If Democratic Socialism Works, Why Doesn’t Venezuela Have Toilet Paper?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Wehrwolfen, Jul 8, 2018.

  1. Wehrwolfen

    Wehrwolfen Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Tucker Carlson:
    If Democratic Socialism Works, Why Doesn’t Venezuela Have Toilet Paper?


    By John Sexton
    July 7, 2018

    Tucker Carlson devoted a segment of his show last night to discussing Democratic Socialism with Professor Cornel West. After outlining some of the policy prescriptions advocated by Democratic Socialists—”state ownership of major industries,” reparations for black Americans, abolishing ICE, etc—Carlson asked Cornel West for an example of where such a program has worked.
    “Can you point to an example, an extant example, of it that works? Venezuela seems like an example of Democratic Socialism. Would you say that it is and if so does it work?” Carlson asked.
    “No, I don’t think that Democratic Socialism as an ideal has been able to be embodied in a larger social context.”
    ~Snip~
    Democratic Socialism eliminates that competition and consolidates the power in one place. If you put all the eggs in one basket, someone powerful and ruthless will come along and take the basket. And then they’ll use that consolidated power to stay there for as long as they can. That’s not a risk worth taking and Venezuela is a perfect example of what can happen when you do.

    Source:
    https://hotair.com/archives/2018/07/07/tucker-carlson-cornel-west-debate-democratic-socialism/

    ~~~~~~
    If these socialists with their theoretical idea of utopia really get enough power whereby they can truly influence the masses. It will be the end of the USA and indeed the western world as we know it. They are preaching pure communism under a different banner.
    Tucker doesn’t seem to have a killer instinct. Why didn't he ask West, “how come the citizens are killing and eating zoo animals to survive and how come people have no jobs?”
    The DSA uses tools like Cornel West and the blind uniformed masses of non-thinking followers, to believe that Socialism is a Utopia and each time it fails the process costs millions of lives and untold suffering.
    They've created their own religions. They comes in many forms beginning with Socialism, Communism, Social Justice, and Political Correctness are some examples. The only thing that matters in these religions is blind devotion to "The Cause"..
     
  2. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    Yup - damn those socialist countries like Sweden with their damn budget surpluses and where a woman can deliver a baby for under two hundred dollars and the child mortality rate 1/3 of the debt-ridden US.
    Damn all these socialist European countries and their higher quality of life indexes and lower child mortality rates. Don't they know that their system is a failure?


    I'm not a Socialists - but pulling a blanket statement out your ass that no form of socialism works is pure crap. Using Venezuela as indicator of ANY type of success or failure of governments is problematic at best. They've had a series of governments, from democracies to autocracies and military juntas. All failed because of corruption.
     
  3. opion8d

    opion8d Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I doubt Venezuela is much of an example of any system. The RW ninnies love to use it as a shining example, though.
     
  4. webrockk

    webrockk Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well, it's not all bad down there in Venezuela...they nipped a growing obesity problem in the bud, commuting is a breeze because the roads are virtually empty, and no one has seen a stray dog or cat in six months
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
  5. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not socialist enough.

    Next time they'll be more socialist and it'll work (said every leftist ever).
     
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  6. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is no example of socialism that turned out well.
     
  7. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The nordic countries aren't socialist.

    If you don't like this video, there's a whole list of why you're wrong videos on youtube.

     
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  8. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    There have never been pure socialist governments. Never been any pure capitalist governments. The best governments seem to be hybrids, using the most effective tool for the job at hand. You would consider Sweden more of a socialist country than the US, yet it has budget surpluses and one of the highest standards of living in the world. Switzerland has socialized medicine - and a very high standard of living. The US has used government supported water projects, airports and sea ports to tremendous advantage.
     
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  9. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    Venezuela doesn't really qualify as socialists country either. Most of it's industry is still controlled by a few wealthy individuals - not the government. Closer to a dictatorship - certainly not a democratic form of anything, including socialism.
     
  10. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, "most" of it's industry IS controlled by the government, or by those the government gives it to run as a favored supporter. You know, like when they confiscated guns from the anti-government forces and gave the guns to pro-government civilians.

    Venezuela started it's slide under Chavez and his socialist policies.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/americas/venezuela/article138402248.html
     
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  11. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    And Chavez was a dictator - not a socialist. And his buddies controlled the wealth, not the government. Hell, I worked on a $125 million dollar home of one the wealthiest bankers in Venezuela just a year ago. You can pretend it was a socialist government - but it was more of a hybrid mafia family.
     
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  12. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Socialism always becomes a dictatorship.

    One always precedes the other.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
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  13. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    Pure socialism has never existed, no more than pure capitalism or communism. All the pure "isms" are just chalkboard exercises in a classroom. Venezuela has a history of military dictatorships, so it's not surprising that it went in that direction. Sweden has a history of a monarchy with a light hand on the reigns, so their "socialist" tendencies slide more in that direction. The US has a military so large it is run more like a government owned corporation, that with our Army Corp of Engineers and numerous government subsidized power grid and sea ports make us a hybrid of socialist institutions and capitalists corporations.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
  14. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Of course not.

    In socialism's case though, that's only because it always leads to dictatorship.

    The USSR and Cuba are the best examples of what was supposed to be pure communism, but became exactly what I said earlier.

    Ironically, the Soviet model is exactly what elements in the US are wanting here. That worked out well didn't it?
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
  15. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    Actually, Mao's China was closer to actual Marxist Communism than the Soviets, and Cuba never had the natural resources or money to do anything on it's own. The successful northern European countries used their natural resources far more wisely and have been able to sustain a number of more socialist programs - but again, all are hybrids.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
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  16. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sure, you can argue "who's the bigger communist" if you'd like. Doesn't really matter.

    Socialism is nothing more than feudalism. Sure it makes everyone equal, it just makes everyone equally poor, and gives the 1% even more power than the people bitching about the 1% in the US.

    Fact is, the more "socialist" the country, the worse it is for the average person living in it.
     
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  17. PrincipleInvestment

    PrincipleInvestment Well-Known Member

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    Toilet paper? Pffft! who needs the bougeois decadence of personal hygene? Take San Francisco's experiment in progressive socialism for instance ... Have the homeless, malnourished, drug addicted party loyalists stopped defecating on SF sidewalks because they don't have Charmin? Nooo!
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
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  18. Iriemon

    Iriemon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I see. Do you care to discuss Somolia as an example of RW conservative policies?

    Silliest thread of the day award.
     
  19. Yakamaru

    Yakamaru Well-Known Member

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    Wrong. Sweden is not Socialist, nor are any other Scandianavian or European country. Stop listening to Bernie Sanders, please. I find it rather insulting to see people call my country Socialist.

    https://fee.org/articles/the-myth-of-scandinavian-socialism/
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...scribes/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.16ec331a1c5c
    https://www.investors.com/politics/...-bernie-sanders-to-stop-calling-it-socialist/
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
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  20. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Sorry no Sweden isn't socialist it is capitalist with a few social programs attached. In short if anything it is neo fascist.
     
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  21. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    NIce bit of turd polishing.
     
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  22. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Is Sweden socialist? I thought they were a social welfare democracy?
     
  23. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Anyone notice a pattern here?

    Shithole Liberal Cities: a Documentary

    No toilet paper, the streets being covered in human feces...
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
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  24. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Anyone can have an opinion but, ... is it informed ?
     
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  25. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The US, Canada, Germany, Norway and numerous other socialist nations seem to be doing ok.
     

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