IKEA apologises for child shooting a gun

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by Bowerbird, Jun 27, 2018.

  1. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-...ild-shoots-gun-found-in-indiana-store/9915436
    Should IKEA have apologised?

    Should the owner have his gun licence revoked?

    Should we just shrug our shoulders and ignore the incident?
     
  2. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't see the big deal.

    What if the headline read: "Miscreant delinquent youth grabs Ikea kitchen knife to stab couch cushion"?

    (Something that has happened, and led to Ikea outlets in certain neighborhoods having to lock all their knives in the kitchen section behind a plexiglass case)
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
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  3. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Then why was the guy not prosecuted for bringing a gun into the store?
     
  4. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Prosecutorial discretion. They don't always prosecute people for breaking every law.

    It was more of just an accident.
    Also this happened in the state of Indiana. People carrying guns aren't all that uncommon there.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
  5. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    However someone who is reckless enough to lose a gun and not realise it, well are they the sort of responsible citizen who should be carrying a gun?
     
  6. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    Law enforcement officers in the united states lose duty firearms on an almost routine basis. Not simply due to incompetence, but also outright theft. Not just sidearms, but even fully-automatic firearms and grenade launchers.

    Isolated incidents due to incompetence occur. They will continue to occur no matter what efforts are implemented to try and prevent such, as incompetence cannot be legislated out of existence.

    Perhaps the parents of the child in question should be the ones apologizing for not property educating their child about what to do and what not to do while in public.
     
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  7. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Ye gods!!

    If a cop lost thier weapon here there would be hell to pay!!
     
  8. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    Depends on the Police Department, once, on Official business,
    I parked an unmarked unit front of a hospital, and left my jacket with Shield and I.D. holder, someone opened the car and took the jacket, I reported the loss, and as a result, was suspended two weeks without pay and had to pay for a new Shield.

    Imagine if it had been a firearm ?
    Internal affairs would have had my guts for garters !
    They were very hard on lost guns then.
    Failure to secure a firearm it was called.

    Regulations demanded a retention holster, securely snapped in to prevent loss, and one was always regularly checking to make sure the gun was properly secured.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
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  9. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Mate even army cadets have to check and secure weapons at all times

    I just think someone who loses a gun without realising it is not a fit person to hold a gun license
     
  10. not2serious

    not2serious Well-Known Member

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    It is the "imperfect" human condition. We are not autotrons,
     
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  11. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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  12. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    F.B.I. has a Bureau of Professional Responsibility, their version of Internal affairs, and when you work under them in joint task force, and run afoul of the regulations
    They hold a hearing, and it is not fun & games.
    Trouble.
     
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  13. Rucker61

    Rucker61 Well-Known Member

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    It's a good question. The answer is the responsibility of the local concealed carry licensing authority.
     
  14. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

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    http://extras.mercurynews.com/policeguns/

    Nine-hundred and forty-four guns. They used to belong to law enforcement officers across California, but a new Bay Area News Group investigation found hundreds of police-issued weapons have been either stolen, lost or can’t be accounted for since 2010, often disappearing onto the streets without a trace.

    From Glocks, Sig Sauers and Remingtons to sniper and assault rifles, some equipped with grenade launchers.

    A year after a bullet from a federal agent’s stolen gun killed 32-year-old Kate Steinle on a San Francisco pier, this news organization surveyed more than 240 local, state and federal law enforcement agencies and discovered an alarming disregard for the way many officers — from police chiefs to cadets to FBI agents — safeguard their weapons.

    Their guns have been stolen from behind car seats and glove boxes, swiped from gym bags, dresser drawers and under beds. They have been left on tailgates, car roofs and even atop a toilet paper dispenser in a car dealership’s bathroom. One officer forgot a high-powered assault rifle in the trunk of a taxi.

    The tally includes Colts, Rugers, Smith & Wessons, a Derringer, a .44-caliber Dirty Harry hand cannon and a small snub-nosed revolver called a “Detective Special.”

    In all, since 2010, at least 944 guns have disappeared from police in the Bay Area and state and federal agents across California — an average of one almost every other day — and fewer than 20 percent have been recovered.


    https://www.nbcwashington.com/inves...From-DC-Area-Police-Since-2011-459196943.html

    A compilation of police records obtained under the Freedom of Information Act reveals a series stolen or lost firearms at large and small police agencies. At least 35 of them were taken or lost from the Metropolitan Police Department in Washington, D.C., since 2011. Twenty-eight others were lost or stolen from Prince George’s County Police. Ten were reported missing or stolen from Alexandria police, while eight were lost or stolen from Virginia State Police during the time period.

    In a rising number of cases, the firearms were stolen from police vehicles. Six of the seven firearms taken from Fairfax County Police were listed as taken from cruisers or officers’ personal vehicles. A firearm stolen from the car of an off-duty Rockville police officer was later seized from a teenager on campus at Albert Einstein High School in Kensington, according to police reports.


    It is not even just local law enforcement officers who lose track of their duty firearms. In recent years in the united states there have been reports of the ATF, FBI, DHS, FBP, and other government agencies losing track of countless firearms, and having no clue as to where they have gone. The problems would not even be known to the public if it were not for independent watchdog agencies performing audits in search of the problem.

    Perhaps other nations are better at controlling their governments and government agencies, but the united states is most certainly not one of them. If the government cannot even keep its own firearms under control, there is no point in trying to implement more firearm-related restrictions that relate exclusively to the public, while exempting themselves.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2018
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  15. ECA

    ECA Well-Known Member

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    The difference of course being that with a gun you can miss the couch and hit another person. But eh....no biggie.
     
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  16. ECA

    ECA Well-Known Member

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    So then why do we bother to have laws regarding negligence? Eh....negligence is going to happen so why bother having any laws punishing those negligent?!
     
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  17. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    How is bringing a gun into the store a crime?

    The guy should pay for the damages to the couch.

    Why aren't the parents of the kid charged with neglect since they obviously didn't know what their kid was doing. There was a far greater chance kid could have been kidnapped before finding an unattended gun.
     
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  18. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    No one was harmed, so no crime was committed. Do the parents get charged with negligence too?
     
  19. Capt Nice

    Capt Nice Well-Known Member

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    Totally stupid. As a rookie cop in Detroit I once got a call of a man in a restaurant with a gun. I found it was a customer setting at a dining table with his friends that had removed his suit coat and had his revolver in a holster on his hip. I confiscated his gun, took him into the restroom to discuss and found he was a LEO from a neighboring community. I told him he could get his revolver back when he came to the police station to get it. There obviously are many idiots out there but when I carry, even to this day, I'm aware of it at all times.
     
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  20. Battle3

    Battle3 Well-Known Member

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    A certain level of responsibility is required. I would revoke the mans license to carry concealed, and require him to take a class before reapplying.

    My guess, the reason you see such pushback to punishing the man is because in the USA (probably in AUS also) the gun banners abuse every restriction. If I say the man should lose his license and take a class, the gun banners will try to expand that into mandatory annual class for all people who carry a firearm, the class will be expensive and inconvenient and designed to be as big a barrier as possible to owning a firearm.

    And in fact that's what historically happened in the USA with carry permits, safety permits, purchase permits. The gun banners claimed they were just "common sense" and once passed turned them into de facto gun bans.
     
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  21. 6Gunner

    6Gunner Banned

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    There was a friend of mine who has spent time as a LEO, and he carried religiously. As he got older, he found himself wearing sweats or shorts more than anything else, so he started carrying his EDC in a fannypack (this was the mid-90's). One day he stopped to grab lunch at a McDonald's, and went in to use the restroom. He went out, got in his car, and was halfway home before he realized he didn't have his fannypack. He flew back to the restaurant, ran into the bathroom... and his fannypack was gone. Good news was the pack had been discovered by an employee, who had given it to the manager, who found the pistol inside. Bad news was the manager called the cops, and my friend had to explain his mistake to a coworker.

    He went back to wearing jeans and t-shirts instead of sweats and carried the gun much more securely after that.
     
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  22. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    I feel like posting " get over it" simply because nowhere in this thread or any I have ever read has that been proposed. What has been proposed is that nothing is done, that he get a free pass, that irresponsible behaviour is not only overlooked but lauded
     
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  23. Rucker61

    Rucker61 Well-Known Member

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    "Lauded"?
     
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  24. Battle3

    Battle3 Well-Known Member

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    I'm speaking from knowledge of the gun banner movement over the past 80 years. Even today, after DC 's gun ban was overturned by the Heller decision, DC tweaked the language of their ban to keep it in place, Heller had to go back to court and have it overturned again, DC then tweaked it again, etc. Chicago has been the same.

    Try to get a carry permit in DC or NYC - the deliberate hurdles are well documented, and the hurdles are there to make getting the permit as burdensome as possible. Purchase permits in California are the same, and the documentation requirements (which were increased last year, and again this year) on gun dealers are so onerous that they are putting dealers our of business - which is the intent of the gun banners creating such burdensome requirements.

    But you don't live in the USA, so how would you know this history and the current activities of the gun banners.
     
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  25. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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