Is America Still the Last Best Hope on Earth

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Aleksander Ulyanov, Jun 13, 2022.

  1. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Jun 13, 2022
  2. Rampart

    Rampart Banned

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    a failed state with a crumbling infrastructure and unproductive economy?

    i'll read the link later. thanks, alek
     
  3. Melb_muser

    Melb_muser Well-Known Member Donor

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    Americans are loud and they don't like to be ignored. No surprise they are the biggest influence still.
     
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  4. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    But I bet you won't find us on foreign political forums! Yet people from other countries come here to tell us what our rights should be in our own country. That's pretty loud don't you think?
     
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  5. Melb_muser

    Melb_muser Well-Known Member Donor

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    On the world stage, general travel.

    I like to feel Americans are never truly in foreign countries because they take a little slice of America with them. Diplomatic immunity.
     
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  6. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    Well the first question that comes to mind is what do people hope for? The question posed assumes some collectively agreed goal of the human condition and that the US was and is in the (best) position to offer it.
    As a child of deep immersion in western culture and values, I would say that the American myth is still strong. By "myth" I don't want to imply à péjorative view of the story. I mean it to refer to the story generally heard about its identity.
    And most of that is in its history...the countless images of escaping persécution the pioneering Davids defeating the strong Goliath of the British Empire.The courage of the movement West, the Great cities, dependable economy and the limitless opportunities open to everyone.
    Except those who have some expérience with the USA know that under the shiny exterior, America has also absorbed and accepted the less attractive shadier éléments of capitalism such as influencing, climbing the greasy pôle of social connection over merit, which eliminate most aspiring people and most people of colour from equal considération. It's flirtation with McCarthy fascism, it's difficulties with policing the world.
    But that isn't unique to the USA.
    When you speak of last best hope you have to include non white minorities, extremist religious lobbyists, crime, éducation, health care, social stabilité, crime, housing.
    And while other places also have problems in these areas, I don't see anything special about the US which will solve them any faster or satisfactorily than others developed western countries. In fact some of those places are not saddled by their own pasts and the subsequent resultant cultures.
    IMO the paths of western Europe and the US were quite parallel until the end of WW2 and the fallout from that has caused Europe to prioritise other things over wealth and military power. While there is certainly discrimination in the ROW I don't consider the US to be any further along the path of equality in practise than other western nations.
    I don't see à more perfect democracy or health system.
    I do see shinier glittering prizes if you do well, but these too are comparable to the top échelons in Europe, including expertise, éducation, wealrh and opportunités to spend it.
    There is IMO à huge number of reasons to admire and celebrate the US, but equally I can accord the same to Europe. I have huge respect for the artistic output of American writers and musicians but equally those over here. I have already said that the USA is not exceptional, anymore than other western nations which share the same fundamental cultures. They are just different in those things which offer colour to it...language, music, landscape, artistic style etc.
    My personal hopes aren't satisfied in the US but others may find that it offers their hearts' désires. We are all à work in progress.
     
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  7. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    There is still à prevailing attitude in the US that Old Europe still is the norm.
     
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  8. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    If by norm you mean most modern, they are wrong It was the US for most of the 20thc but now it's Japan
     
  9. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    I meant that some think what Europe was like in 1945 and some vague time before that, is still the case.
     
  10. Hey Now

    Hey Now Well-Known Member

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    It's kind of a privilege! :D
     
  11. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    They would do better to leave it behind and try to fully understand other places
     
  12. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    Simply put, I believe the hope of America, the foundation of which is individual liberty, is plummeting fast but is still better than anyplace else.
     
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  13. independentthinker

    independentthinker Well-Known Member

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    Yes, because we have the world's largest economy and by far the best military.
     
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  14. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    This was from 2020, so you missed your shot.
     
  15. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    What? The norm?

    What are you talking about?
     
  16. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    You don't want to do it here?

    Kaz egregiously insulted the "left" by acting like "we" didn't believe the above. That belief is WHY we're leftists. It's the RIGHT that's gone round the bend IMO, WE'RE the real Americans and always were. Unless, of course, you see intolerance, xenophobia, misogyny and theocracy as the most important core American values.

    Besides spinning in his grave WHERE are conservatives like Bill Buckley? I'd even put up with George Fwill's friendly fascism just to hear a SANE conservative nowadays
     
  17. Buri

    Buri Well-Known Member

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    The first hope for America? Don't make the same silly mistakes other countries made, like disarming yourselves and becoming servants to the gov/king. Keep personal responsibility at the forefront of your mind, mind the statistics in all things, and watch your neighbors back. We saved a lot of people from German aggression who learned nothing apparently!
     
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  18. Joe knows

    Joe knows Well-Known Member

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    I believe we are a pretty great country. Look at how fast we came up with the COVID shot and how many other countries wanted it. Just one of the latest examples
     
  19. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I don't think you would think an actual conservative is sane, so I'm not sure that you would accept any argument from the right as even legitimate; or at least that's your history.
     
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  20. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    There are no kings or even Queens withvany power left in the West.
    I don't know where you get this benighted understanding of other places. It is so far removed from the existential order that it can only be from some desperately ignorant gossip.
    It is sad that such impressions of other places still exist in your "great country". I suggest à year out and à grand tour of orher places.
     
  21. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Legalize Secession. At this point the Blue States are being held hostage by a hostile power.

    If you don't agree then legalize secession and see what happens.

    The American Dream is still alive in the Blue States. The red states are drifting quickly towards authoritarianism. It is a damn dangerous thing and we can never allow someone like trump to control US power again.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2022
  22. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    We cannot allow the next Fox News celebrity to have his finger on the nuclear button. It is too dangerous to be allowed.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2022
  23. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    You are being held hostage by whom? If you think you hold the majority opinion you should have no problem “legalizing” secession yourself.

    Start a petition. I’ll sign it. I have no problem “legalizing” secession. Get your blue Reps and Senators to write legislation “legalizing” secession. I’ll lobby mine to vote for it.
     
  24. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    This is a myth that is much exploited by your government.
    Each country could ALWAYS go its own way in health matters and the underhanded misreading of à contract allowed à "staggering" three weeks headstart, which you never maintained.
    I am fed up hearing this lie often repeated by Bozo because he has nothing else to boast about.
     
  25. Buri

    Buri Well-Known Member

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    When your gov can arrest you for saying words, and terroristic threats, you might as well have a king. I'd travel other places but I've worked for more non-American companies than probably anyone here and nowhere are our freedoms and liberties so abundant. It's mostly people living in cages who are petty because they lost their rights. Oh, do you guys HAVE a Bill of Rights?
     

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