I am against all forms of compulsion as a principle. Compulsion is always slavery and compulsion is always a waste of resources. Military service is only honourable if voluntary and can never be anything but a tragedy if it is done at gun point. For example, the Vietnam War was fought with an army of slaves; men were forced to fight in a war and for a cause they did not sign up to fight for and the ones who refused were put under trail to be stripped of their liberty. How is this not slavery? And how is slavery ever moral?
If you leave on the day you reach the age of majority in order to avoid the draft then the state would consider that a crime. Also, why should someone be forced to give up their property, community, livelihood, and family just so they can avoid being enslaved by the state? If you believe in unalienable rights (those pesky things mentioned in the DOI) then you'll have to agree that someone cannot alien their life and property simply by choosing to stay within a tax jurisdiction. And, if you dont' believe in unalienable rights, then you believe, implicitly, that slavery is not necessarily immoral. Had the Founding Fathers been like you, we'd all be British still today. Obedient, timid, and unquestioning.
If you leave who cares what they think. If you want the benefits of citizenship you have to pay the costs of citizenship. It would be really nice to let everyone else fight and die for you, pay your taxes, and upkeep the infrastructure you use. But lucky for the rest of us you too have to pay as we do. The founding Fathers changed the system they lived in to fit their needs. They worked to change it as I said. You may want everything for free or on your terms but that is not the world we live it. No free rides, if you want that go move to some socialist nanny state and hope they like having people that dont want to contribute in their system.
Yeah? Got a contract somewhere, or do you just believe it's whatever your rulers tell you to believe. Being a citizen doesn't make you a sheep; well, not some of us anyway. I won't speak for you. Bleat bleat. They changed it in a way that you'd never approve of. Yes, I'm sure that you believe that if it's not from government, then it's not a thing that can be had, so anyone who is anti-government wants things for free. That's terribly unimaginative. Do you also need a bureaucrat to inform you how to wipe your bottom when you are done with your business? The socialist nanny-staters make the same arguments that you make. In fact, you are remarkably similar to them. Unimaginative; cannot imagine life without rulers and bureaucrats; wants government to do everything for them.
Funny how the majority voted No and feel it is not tyrannical for government to enslave people in this manner. Yet, if you ask is it immoral for the government to take away guns that would be viewed as immoral and tyrannical by these same people.
The draft is not enslavement it is merely a requirement to serve in the military for a short period usually 2 years and during your service you are free to do what you want on your off duty hours, not slavery. Taking away guns is permanent which takes away a right specifically granted by the constitution. Apples and oranges.
''life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness'' is the foundation of this country's origin - slaves don't have that luxury, especially those killed overseas in imperialistic wars by contrast, your heroes Reagan and Bush took guns but that was temporary it is the ultimate hypocrisy to object to taking guns but applauding institutional slavery
The draft most certainly is slavery. It's forcing one to fight/die/train for war. Not to mention, I don't want some punkass coward in my unit who was forced to be here. I want a stone cold warrior who dreams at night about completing the mission.
Bwahaha, interesting take. Is it moral for the government to take your arms? No! Is it moral for the government to FORCE you to bear arms? Yes!
The question is: Is compulsory military service immoral? Morality is in the eyes of the beholder. Having said that, IMO absolutely. But to add to that: In the US, it's unconstitutional. It is a violation of the 8th, 9th, 10th, 13th and 14th Amendments to the Constitution. As to the 13th Amendment, it is clearly INVOLUNTARY SERVITUDE. This differs slightly from outright slavery as some have suggested.
Forget for a minute about how unconstitutional it is. We DON'T WANT anyone in our military that doesn't want to be here. As I stated above, I don't want some sissy who is scared of war to be deployed with my platoon to a war zone. I want trained warriors who are hell bent on taking the fight to any enemy we encounter.
Never, not for one second. Agreed in another way. I don't want anyone in ANY military who does not want to be there. You are not saying the same thing above. Sissy??? Scared of war??? How old are you? Who the **** other than some demented savage wants war? Why is a pacifist a "sissy" to you? Do you have that much of a bloodlust that you thirst for war? Do you know Mr. "ArmySoldier" that over 90% of those murdered in war are innocent men, women and children? Do you know that there is NEVER a good reason to wage war and that all wars are waged for $$$$PROFIT$$$$ and hegemony? There are NO exceptions.
Someone who volunteers to go to war. Hell, I'll never forget how excited I was when we heard our rotation was called. What's an infantryman's job? When you're deployed, you get to DO IT
I ask you again, what's an infantryman's job? To wash trucks? To mow the lawn? Why does one VOLUNTEER (everyone volunteers in this Army) to become an infantryman?
I do not believe it is immoral to require a term of military service, but, in many countries I don't think it's necessary. It's not necessary in the U.S. for example. Self defense is not immoral. What if you don't need the welfare system in Sweden and don't support it? Should your taxes be reduced by a corresponding percentage?
***INCOMING MESSAGE FROM DURANDAL*** Strive for your next breath. Believe that with it you can do more than with the last one. Use your breath to power your capacities: capacity to kill, to maim, to destroy. And just where do your capacities come from? Why do you always go where I want and do what I say? Perhaps you're just running a fool's errand, doing everything as I've planned, never able to change your course. You would do well to believe that I know the outcome of your battle with the Pfhor already, just as I can decipher the chaotic motion of gas molecules in the clouds of Tau Ceti IV. Or, perhaps, that is not the case. Perhaps, you are doing what you were meant to do. Your human mentality screams for vengeance and thrives on the violence that you say you can hardly endure. Your father told you as a child to always fight with honor, but to always fight. Do you care about honor, or do you use honor as an excuse? An excuse to exist in a violent world. Organic beings are constantly fighting for life. Every breath, every motion brings you one instant closer to your death. With that kind of heritage and destiny, how can you deny yourself? How can you expect yourself to give up violence? It is your nature. Do you feel free?
But there are perpetual wars, the manufactured raison d'etre for the military industrial complex. They did have a draft when I was of draftable age during the Vietnam War. I chose to do whatever was necessary to stay out of that bloodbath and I succeeded. They were not going to force me to hurt anyone under any circumstance, never mind commit murder. They will have a draft again when they decide their perpetual war requires it. I don't worry about me, I worry about my grandchildren and their children. They will try to use their lives for their genocidal agenda and personal $$$profit$$$. They don't care about human lives. "War is a Racket" - Major General Smedley D. Butler, USMC, 1935
I too grew up under the draft during Vietnam. I chose to join the Navy instead of waiting to be drafted. Some people like you may believe that war is murder but unfortunately there are many more around the world who do not and the majority of them are not American and want to kill Americans. If these people want to kill Americans and use war to do it then I believe it is better to take them on somewhere else other than on our soil and that is where the military comes in. Those who don't believe in fighting will be the first to be eliminated if war breaks out, eliminated by death or complete subjugation from their surrender.
Who has been drafted since the 80s. I served during the 70s and I am still around, during my 4 years service I did not feel like a slave. I worked my 8 hours 5 days a week and did whatever I wanted the rest of the time just like a job. Slaves could not leave their plantation when they were not working, the military can.
