Is gravity really a push?

Discussion in 'Science' started by Ready Aim Fire, Feb 11, 2014.

  1. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    If the earth's radius is growing at 32 ft/sec/sec would this conflict with any known laws? It seems to me that Einstein and Newton hinted at this and came very close to saying it directly. Gravity is a result of the expanding, accelerating universe.
     
  2. Wizard From Oz

    Wizard From Oz Banned at Members Request

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    Where did you hear the Earth is expanding at 32ft per second?
     
  3. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    ... per second... accelerating. It makes sense. Also I've read some of Einstein and Newton's stuff.
     
  4. cjm2003ca

    cjm2003ca Active Member

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    to expand that much you need new matter to fill that space..that must be alot of space debris hitting the earth..
     
  5. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    Not if space expands at a rate that keeps things at a distance that remains relative to the expanding objects (imperceptable).
    http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/einsteins-general-relativity-theory-gravity-as-acc.html
    If there was a big bang and objects were "sucked" into this vacuum, then we're still being "blown" from the singularity and "sucked" into the vacuum at the same time. The force of the bang and the vacuum should be enough to cause this "very weak" acceleration... I figured the percentage once... something like 0.000000001 percent per sec per sec.
     
  6. cjm2003ca

    cjm2003ca Active Member

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    if that were true then the farther away you are from the original source the weaker it would get
     
  7. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    No. No. As objects go faster, they become bigger... thus more gravity. It's all a balancing act between space and time.If everything is JUST right, you can't tell if the universe is expanding oe contracting. They both can produce the same reactions with the right balancing.
    Luckily, the universe gives us hints that it is expanding and accelerating in its expansion.
     
  8. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    I think you're talking about the compression of an object, in the direction of travel, as it approaches the speed of light.

    The thing is, even though Earth is accelerating, it isn't anywhere near the speed of light as far as I know.

    I think there is something wrong with your interpretation of this idea, but I'm not a physicist so I don't trust myself to provide an accurate explanation.

    All I know is that gravity is a one dimensional expression of space-time, didn't you know that? The user called AboveAlpha has been helping me with my math. :smile:
     
  9. Flintc

    Flintc New Member

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    Many years ago, there was a wonderful tale by the late great R.A.Lafferty. A mad scientist creates a box he claims is a time machine, and inside the box is the future! But when he looks into the box, all he sees is a bug crawling along. He reaches in with his finger and mashes the bug. The next week, he's in his lab and this huge hand reaches out of nowhere and crushes him! It seems the universe is actually shrinking at a considerable rate, but since everything is shrinking in proportion, it's impossible to tell without a time machine.
     
  10. awesome bossum

    awesome bossum Banned

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    So would micro-black hole propulsion be the same as a singularity drive or it be more of a multi-vector singularity tractor?

    And would simple fusion solve the power requirements concerning the containment of said singularity?

    Would the shape of the drive be some sort of double walled spherical configuration with EM containment fields lining the inner walls and quantum dialed to the specified coordinates to effect the desired vector of movement?

    For agile flight you would have to somehow be able to modulate the force effect right?

    Can black holes be "dialed" up and down? Or would you just "counter-balance"?- What about the stresses caused by the contradictory pull?

    Just a few questions...
     
  11. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    http://www.dummies.com/how-to/conten...ty-as-acc.html
    I think you all missed this.
     
  12. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    You're pretty close to what I'm trying to say.
     
  13. Flintc

    Flintc New Member

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    You might like Lafferty. He did another time machine story where a bunch of scientists invent a "time pendulum" that swings this big pendulum hundreds of millions of years into the past. So they turn this thing loose in their lab to watch it swing. And every time it goes by, the scientist are entirely different creatures, but have no way to know this because their entire history has changed with each swing. And when the experiment is done, they shrug their pseudopods and slither out of the room, having determined experimentally that you can't change the past.
     
  14. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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  15. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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  16. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    Okay here is the thing, if the radius of the Earth grows, and assuming the Earth doesn't gain any additional mass, the gravity on the surface of Earth will have a lower value than before.

    Why?

    Gravity is a 1 dimensional expression: GM/r^2; see the Inverse Square Law of Gravity.

    Where:
    G = universal gravitational constant, this is important to what you're saying,
    M = mass,
    r^2 = radius squared.

    The larger the overall radius (the farther away you are) the smaller the expression of gravity will become.

    The smaller the overall radius (the closer you are) the larger the expression of gravity will become.

    Since the gravitational constant contains a length in meters, a weight in kilograms, and a span of time in seconds -- if that's what you mean by "expanding, accelerating universe" -- than yes, we need to take those universal values into account to calculate an expression of Gravity.
     
  17. mutmekep

    mutmekep New Member

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    Op should stop pollute the forum with Einsteinanism and Newtonism , after all both are just theories .
     
  18. RevAnarchist

    RevAnarchist New Member Past Donor

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    I like that our members can think outside the box so to speak. If the earth is really growing at the rate claimed (I haven’t seen it published) there could be other explanations that do not require additional mass be added. For example some material expands when heated or cooled (careful while not meant to be a straw man it could be)

    Then to the member who said the universe may be shrinking. There was an old idea called universal expansion where everything is expanding. That makes more sense (than shrinking), to me anyway because it comes closer to explaining gravity. Btw, Einstein said gravity is the effect of curved space time and as could be expected Einstein’s theory merges well with modern particle physics. The effects of gravity may be caused by what is known as a ‘graviton‘. Supposedly it has no mass and is called a ’spin 2’ particle. We all know that gravitation pulls on all anything in the universe that has mass, and the greater the mass the greater the gravitational force. If quantum gravity exists it could explain how the universe began, but I doubt a theory* or proof that quantum gravity exists will emerge anytime in the near future (just some related on topic gravity trivia).

    *...that makes meaningful physical predictions.

    reva

    - - - Updated - - -

    Uh huh, to what he said.

    reva
     
  19. Nullity

    Nullity Active Member

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    Space is expanding, not the Earth (matter).

    No, as objects travel faster, they're mass increases. They do not become bigger.
     
  20. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    One thing Einstein said clearly is that you can't tell the difference between gravity and acceleration. If I can't tell the difference between a fish and a cow then they are effectively the same thing... but since I can tell the difference, they are probably different. Wrapped up in Einstein's mathematical genius is a common sense approach that even makes sense to those of us who weren't cursed with genius.
     
  21. RevAnarchist

    RevAnarchist New Member Past Donor

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    Yes, also centrifugal force and gravity also feels the same. Einstein’s thought experiments and other examples helped me become interested in science. That said, Einstein is among the top ten people I respect with Jesus as the most respected. However, the thing that really endeared me to Einstein was his personality. Like his common sense approach as you accurately call it. I respected that more than his intellect. His desire for unification and world peace, the ability to be unapologetically child like i.e. playful. His approachability even when famous. I even love his absent mindlessness. All good stuff and this planet needs more stuff like that IMO.


    reva
     
  22. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    I can't agree more... great post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  23. RevAnarchist

    RevAnarchist New Member Past Donor

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    excerpt;
    You did mean 'spacetime' ?

    reva
     
  24. RevAnarchist

    RevAnarchist New Member Past Donor

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    Thanks, I like agreement. Since we are discussing gravity and related fundamental forces of nature, while I somewhat understand how curved spacetime and gravity are associated, try as I might I can not visualize curved spacetime. Not the common aid of a elastic sheet of fabric that represents how mass effects spacetime, but rather spacetime itself. The weights on the sheet does help visualize how gravity wells are created. However, what is impossible for me is understanding 11 dimensional space time (seven higher dimensions plus the four common ones we all know and love, lol) and how it interact with mass.

    Well, I am no fan of string theory anyway, as I hinted I have a hard enough time trying to wrap my brain around plain old four dimensional spacetime and its nuances.


    reva
     
  25. Ready Aim Fire

    Ready Aim Fire New Member

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    LOL.. I'm lucky to understand 3-dimensional space. My hat's off to you for your further endevours.
    Curved space time, to me, is attributed to the fact that everything is round... or curved, so naturally eveything is curved, even gravity.
     

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