Is There Any Evidence for the Existence of God?

Sorry for making such a generic thread, but I've never seen a rational argument for the existence of God.

There's the Thomas Aquinas argument that everything is created by something, as we know it, and, so, there is a loop. The plant was created by the seed which was created by something else, etc., etc. Since this loop cannot be infinite, whatever is at the end of the loop, whatever created the spin, is what we know as a "god." This is compatible with the Big Bang Theory. Even if we consider the Big Bang to be the beginning, then, by Aquinas definitions, the Big Bang was a "god."

This is the best argument I've seen for the existence of a god, but that's not saying much -- I have never really seen any other argument providing philosophical evidence for a god. This also only gives a little reason behind "a god" rather than "God." However, when you think about it, it's really just saying that we exist; thus, there must be a god. Maybe there is a big loop. Perhaps there is some other element besides creation at some point. The answer to life, the universe and everything could be beyond our comprehension.*

There is absolutely no evidence that I've been presented with showing that God exists. This is what I'm really interested in: how is it that billions of people could believe in a personal god? I take the Einstein theory that a deity is not so ridiculous, but the belief of a personal god is craziness. By personal god, I mean believing in a bible, God watching you, sins, Heaven, Hell, etc. Why do you believe in this? How are you certain that this is the truth?

And please, don't turn this around and say "you can't prove that God DOESN'T exist!" Yeah, just like I can't prove that there's not little fat bald dudes in every atom. Anyway, atheism is not believing that God exists, not necessarily believing that God does not exist. So, please, none of those arguments. I sincerely want to see what is going through the minds of the religious.


*Just kidding -- it's 42.

 

I appreciate your respectful approach. It's a refreshing change from the usual tone we get from the atheists on this forum.

The reason I believe in God is because the alternative makes no sense to me: that the universe popped into existence by itself. I do not believe in self-created universes.

I understand that leaves the question: who created God.

The answer to that is that no one created God -- he always existed. He must exist because he is the necessary being.

We know the universe did not always exist, astronomers know it is several billions years old, I don't know the exact age. The point is, the universe is finite in time and also finite in space. A finite universe cannot be all that is.

 

Everything ever created is based on the bones of something before. The very atoms in your body were something else at one time. If you find the origin of all things, that is the definition of God.

 

Why cant something be created out of nothing?

 

Please explain how that happens.

 

A Universe from Nothing: Why There Is Something Rather than Nothing

 

No, actually it is not compatible with the big bang theory..... This theory does not declare anything beyond A singular point by which our 'observable' universe was created..... Never once has it declared that this was a point of beginning!!!!!!!

The idea of the eternal void and the emergence of quantum fluctuation within, giving way to a singular event as the beginning is moronic to say the least! This is not what the big bang declares!

 

I'm not going to buy the book. Give me the Reader's Digest version.

 

Lets progress the thought a bit.......

Consider an infinite void..... Got it?
Now, at what singular point would we see an emergence of mass from this purported quantum fluctuation within it?
If we are talking about an infinite void, nothingness, we are also talking about infinite points within that nothingness by which such fluctuation would occur..... The singular in such a thought becomes nothing more than an absurdity...... Now, the eternal nothingness..... At what single point in time within the eternal model would we see rise to this beginning? Another absurdity!

The universe is an infinite continuum, having existed for all eternity!!!
It can't exist in any other way!

 

So you reject the current theory, believed by all scientists in the field, that the universe is finite in space and time?

 

You have no idea what you are talking about!
The big bang theory discusses OUR observable universe, nothing less, nothing more!!!!!!!

 

We actually don't know that.

Currently the timeline of the universe goes back to a tiny fraction of time immediately following the Big Bang. What happened prior to that, we have no definitive evidence.

It is entirely possible that the universe has always existed in form or another, through a long series of expansions and contractions.

 

There is absolutely no reason to assume that something is created without evidence to support that claim. The universe is from all evidence a rather exceptional event; perhaps it has no origin or cause. This does not make it a meaningful god--since gods are concepts with a bit more of a definition than just effects without causes. Among other things, they are said to have intelligence.

The simple answer is that human beings have very deep seated cognitive vulnerabilities. Religions are organized institutions that exploit these cognitive vulnerabilities. If one were to describe a memetic social virus, it would behave much like a religion--and, in the same sense, some people would be immune to the concept, just as some portion of the population will have an innate resistance to any particular disease.

 

By definition, the universe has always existed, because our concept of time is a consequence of the universe.

 

Have you ever tried to seek God without religious influence?

The reason there is no single best universal argument for God is because it is too personal and subjective in concept and conclusion. Someone could could say xxxxxx to you and it would have no effect but say the exact same thing to a different person and cause a Damascus road Epiphany.

Before seeking proof for the existence of God you would need to define God. A similar example is the term Religion. Before that institution can be understood it needs a universal definition and the one I have thought of is this:

Religion is the institution of the indefensible.

How are you defining God?

 

But that's a logical fallacy known as personal incredulity.

 

How is it a logical fallacy to say that it makes no sense that the universe popped into existence out of nothing?

 

We do not know whether the universe is finite in space or not.

 

The precision of the universe cries out creator. Beyond that is another argument, but yes there is a "God" who/that got everything started from chaos.
Also if you want to dig deeper find some translations or even critiques (these would be by Cambridge or other prestigious scholars over the years-look for them in bibliographies if you have to but they are out there) of Ancient Greek philosophers. They absolutely proved (with discussion/theory/and more thought and discussion) that there was a being that /who created the universe.
I warn you some of this writing is mind boggling and can only be taken in in increments, considered and then go on to the next thought, but if you are truly interested in the subject it is worth it.

 

Short answer, you're wrong.

Long answer, you're really wrong.

 

you beat me to it..

 

Let's not get hung up on the big bang theory. It is a theory. I helps explain why the universe is expanding, why all the elements of the universe are moving away from each other. It doesn't explain what came before. It doesn't guarantee that there is only one universe. As mentioned above it doesn't promise that nothing existed before the the big bang. The only thing we know for sure is that all the elements of the universe are moving away from each other. From my perspective to put the big bang theory into a religious discussion is something like wondering what sort of snow tires one should buy in Rio de Janeiro. it just doesn't relate. People's concept of god is personal and subjective. People should believe what they like and ignore others who tell them what to believe. Physics deals with the observable universe. Religion and belief takes over when science can't observe and measure things. Not much point in mixing the two together.

 

That's not what is observed at all.

 

Because "nothing" is a myth.

 

Before the big bang there was extremely dense matter that exploded, creating it. So scientists basically took the observation of expansion and reversed the process to a detonation, or beginning point. But what if the universe is expanding itself back into another starting point of dense matter? From our humble perspective the universe is expanding, but it is not aimless and there is a target.