Is this theft?

Discussion in 'Other Off-Topic Chat' started by Lady Luna, Oct 21, 2011.

  1. Lady Luna

    Lady Luna New Member

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    I'm in a nonprofit club that promotes Middle Eastern dance by sponsoring workshops with big names in the bellydance community, and performing at different venues.

    One member, who I'll call T, has been working really hard to put the upcoming workshop together. The goal posts kept moving, through no fault of her own or anyone's - just life - and she worked hard and persisted. However, the poor economy resulted in not enough people registering so far, and the Club will lose all of its money if it goes ahead with the workshop because the costs of renting a place, plus paying all the expenses of the dancer we're bringing in, come to thousands of dollars that will break the Club unless enough people register.

    There was a meeting the other night and the Club had a vote about whether to continue with the workshop, or cancel and refund the registrants' money. It was a tie, so T has decided unilaterallly to go ahead with renting an extremely expensive venue, even though one of the Yes votes was conditional upon obtainng a much cheaper venue. So that conditional yes vote changed to a no today.

    We are cajoling T in emails not to spend the Club money (I think the civic center had a deadline today because T was trying to ram this through in a hurry) because the club didn't have a tiebreaker, and she doesn't have the right to spend the money unilaterally, which is what is happening now.

    I just emailed her that if she uses the Club funds against the wishes of the majority, she is stealing the club's money. The Club hasn't voted in favor of continuing with the workshop and using that expensive venue. She is just doing this unilaterally, and since she was entrusted with the funds and her name is on the accounts, we cannot stop her.

    Isn't that theft? I would like to know if that is truly considered theft under the law, and if so, what the Club can do about it. Input is appreciated.
     
  2. Travis Bickle

    Travis Bickle Banned

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    Whether or not it is theft would depend on the club charter, regarding who ultimately has control of the purse strings. If T is the ultimate arbiter of such decisions, there is no theft. If T engaged in the rental of a venue without authority, you should be able to cancel the contract stipulating that the person had no authority.

    If this is just an ego thing for T, I would use any legal means to rectify the situation, including pressing charges if applicable. Talk to the local police. They should be able to tell you if a crime has been committed once you tell them the arrangements of the company.
     
  3. Lady Luna

    Lady Luna New Member

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    T's name is on the accounts, but funds can only be spent by a majority vote. We vote on every little expenditure: stamps, printing costs, little bits here and there, so for her to do this on her own and to put the Club on the hook for thousands has some of us in an uproar.
     
  4. Lady Luna

    Lady Luna New Member

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    That's exactly what it is, and I told her so in one of the many emails I've posted to the Club this morning. She is ignoring them so far, and I'm not the only member calling her on the carpet, although I'm the most vociferous and blunt. I think I get it from forums. :twisted:
     
  5. Travis Bickle

    Travis Bickle Banned

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    It sounds like you have a case, but it might best be handled in civil court. Sue her for money if you have to, or just threaten legal action and that might be enough to get her to come to her senses. She may have just made an irrational emotional decision and perhaps her better sense will prevail.

    It's a funny thing with so-called charity type organizations, people are often drawn to them by their ego, and the last thing on their mind is helping others. The church I sometimes attend has an awful music director who takes classic hymns and puts his own spin on them so people cannot even follow along or enjoy the singing. He's clearly not there for the church, but to satisfy his own need to be in the spotlight.
     
  6. HonestJoe

    HonestJoe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That would depend on the jurisdiction(s) involved but "what constitutes theft" probably comes to countless pages of complex legalese. I suspect a key point is how well documented you have the structure and rules of the club. If it's not at all (as is the case of far too many such organisations) but account is in her name, I suspect there isn't much legal scope.

    I do think you're being a little unfair regarding the vote. If it was presented as a simple go-ahead or cancel as you describe and the vote tied, leaving T having (as agreed?) a casting vote, people can't really go back later and say they want to change their vote. You can't say Obama hasn't done what he promised so you're going to switch your vote to McCain.

    Overall though, I feel you're approaching this poorly by looking towards a serious criminal charge. Rather than "cajoling" T in to doing what you want, why aren't you discussing the situation with them and trying to come to a practical solution (or least worst option)? I fear the approach you're implying would only cause a load more trouble and finish off your club for good.
     
  7. Lady Luna

    Lady Luna New Member

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    The Club has a legal charter where everything is clearly spelled out. T is in violation. That isn't in doubt.

    T voted, but it wasn't tiebreaker; with her vote the sides were tied, with one yes vote being conditional on T not doing exactly what she is doing. I'm maintaining that a tied vote requires a tiebreaker, and that's what the Club should do before T spends the funds.

    Spending all of the Club's funds will finish off the club, and that's what the majority wants to prevent. We're talking about $4,000 down the drain that the small club cannot recoup, to feed someone's ego.

    Of course I don't want to go the legal route, and I doubt anyone else in the Club does,either; I just mentioned it in a Club email that T has no legal authority to spend the funds without Club approval, and that is stealing. I didn't threaten legal action as I have no desire to pursue anything against her other than throwing her out of the club if she goes through with this, but I wanted to make her stop and think about what she is doing since she is completely ignoring what any members say.

    The Club is telling her we need to have a tiebreaking vote, which I think is the right thing to do. The problem is the cheaper venue had a deadline of today, and I think T may have already booked the expensive venue. Several of us have told her she needs to use her own money since she had no authority to spend the Club funds on this, so ideas have been proposed to settle this. She simply isn't responding. GRR.
     

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