It doesn't matter where the Drone was. This is what we should be creeping out about

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Golem, Jun 21, 2019.

  1. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 12, 2010
    Messages:
    15,901
    Likes Received:
    1,589
    Trophy Points:
    113
    So, let's break down what you actually said:


    This would mean that your perspective is that Bush and Cheney KNOWINGLY provided false information to drive us into war. Right?

    And this would mean that every other country knew we were supposedly lying, but followed us to war anyway. Right?


    To which I responded:

    LOL, So Bush and Cheney devised a lie... and the democrats who supported it are exempt, and every other nation who stood with us knew we were wrong, but did so just to support our alliance.


    Which is EXACTLY what you said... no slippery slope. Just ridiculous revisionist history on your part.
     
  2. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2016
    Messages:
    12,175
    Likes Received:
    3,718
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Right, but that's just an example. Not the subject of the thread. You go on a slippery slope riding on an example.

    Point (and the subject of the thread) was that our allies stood with us no matter what they knew. Of course, if they had an intelligence agency anywhere near as competent as ours they knew, at a minimum, that there was no credible evidence of WMDs in Iraq to justify an invasion. And now, with Iran, they just don't believe us. that's the main point. Anything to say about that? This thread is not about Iraq, it's about Iran. If you want to discuss Iraq, I'll be happy to, but open your own thread.

    There you go again. "democrats", "exempt", .... Slippery slope.
    You have three options. 1- You can either quote me where I say anything even remotely resembling words like "exempt" in your self-debate 2- You admit that it's a slippery slope and admit your error (we all make mistakes, so there is not shame in that) or 3- You do neither of the above, and you have only ridiculed yourself.

    Your choice.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2019
  3. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    81,176
    Likes Received:
    22,625
    Trophy Points:
    113
    that was before the inspectors were in Iraq doing their investigation, they reported there were no WMD found, Bush kicked out the inspectors and went to war anyways
     
  4. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2011
    Messages:
    83,628
    Likes Received:
    16,347
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The euros do not need America anymore to protect them

    So dont expect much loyality from the euros in the future
     
  5. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    Messages:
    47,924
    Likes Received:
    28,917
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yeah it was so binding that it's been ripped up.

    You need to study the definition of "fact" I think.

    Obama secretly funneled billions of dollars to Iran, who would not release the hostages until they received it.

    Congress did not approve the funds.

    https://apnews.com/fd4113419276444eba1d2a46d5c29752

    He broke banking laws and the US governments own sanctions against Iran to do it.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/06/the...e-iran-access-to-the-us-financial-system.html

    Deal with it.
     
  6. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2009
    Messages:
    8,449
    Likes Received:
    2,129
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No, Obama had a deal with them. Neither the congress nor the people approved it. Trump's word may be broken but not America's.

    I don't think so. It was a monumentally stupid deal for the U.S. Starting from scratch was the only option.

    We will see. the Mexico-Canada deal is real and finished. Only congress stands in the way. Personally, I doubt Iran has or would honor any agreement with the U.S. We have the same two options there that we have with North Korea. Either we accept their nuclearization or we go to war. These are enemies, not opponents.
     
  7. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    81,176
    Likes Received:
    22,625
    Trophy Points:
    113
    no, America had a deal with Iran and our allies, Trump broke our word on the deal....
     
  8. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    81,176
    Likes Received:
    22,625
    Trophy Points:
    113
    we will never know as Trump broke the deal, not Iran
     
  9. EarthSky

    EarthSky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2018
    Messages:
    1,402
    Likes Received:
    731
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    You believe without question that it was in international waters? Because your government said so?

    I guess you believe Iran was behind the tanker attacks without questioning too?
     
  10. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2009
    Messages:
    8,449
    Likes Received:
    2,129
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That is certainly true.
     
    FreshAir likes this.
  11. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 12, 2010
    Messages:
    15,901
    Likes Received:
    1,589
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Nope. Sorry. People dont get to make outlandish claims, and when called on it, and subsequent slippery slope allegations, go "well it doesnt really matter because it's not part of the thread.

    Your attempted point that Bush and Cheney lied and our allies followed us was BS. Point of the thread or not... you dont get to just throw garbage out and see what sticks.
     
  12. Reality

    Reality Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2014
    Messages:
    10,724
    Likes Received:
    2,492
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You realize Iran admitted to the drone bit right?
     
  13. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2016
    Messages:
    12,175
    Likes Received:
    3,718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No quote. No correction. Not a serious poster. Not worth the time.

    Thanks for trying.
     
  14. Heartburn

    Heartburn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2015
    Messages:
    2,400
    Likes Received:
    631
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It wasn't a treaty, it was an agreement and a bad one for us.
     
  15. Sandy Shanks

    Sandy Shanks Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2016
    Messages:
    19,122
    Likes Received:
    4,576
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Trump began the provocation toward war with Iran a year ago when the removed the U.S. from the JCPOA and hit Iran hard with economic sanctions.

    Now it seems the lunatics are running the asylum.

    Secretary of State Mike Pompeo has said that the United States is "considering a full range of options" regarding rising tensions with Iran, including military options, but emphasized that Trump has said that he does not want to go to war.

    Pompeo hasn't learned yet? Americans do not trust anything Trump says. He has lied to us too many times. After all, he was the one who said, “No, it’s not what I meant. It’s what I said."

    Pompeo offered a set of actions that could restore deterrence.

    Now we are getting to what Trump really wants. "Restore deterrence" is code for trying to force Iran to do what Trump wants them to do. And, if they don't do what Trump wants them to do? Trump is "considering a full range of options, including military options" and regime change.

    Here is the lunacy. “We’re not going to have Iran have a nuclear weapon,” Trump told reporters.

    We already had an agreement with Iran that permanently barred Iran from making a nuke. Trump trashed it!!!

    Is Trump bipolar? Did he forget that he removed the U.S. from the agreement? Does he think Americans forgot that part? Is he nuts?

    Iranian President Hassan Rouhani says the White House is "suffering from mental disability" and behaving as "no sane person," in the wake of new sanctions imposed by Trump earlier this week which an Iranian spokesman said have closed the "channel of diplomacy forever."

    Hmmm, interesting.
     
  16. Sandy Shanks

    Sandy Shanks Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2016
    Messages:
    19,122
    Likes Received:
    4,576
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Trump is the guy running the show.

    In the wake of Sarah Sanders and Patrick Shanahan quitting in the past two weeks, now Acting Customs and Border Protection Commissioner John Sanders (no relation) is quitting. He will be replaced by Mark Morgan, the acting director of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, as his new border chief, replacing the current acting commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection. Matt Albence, the deputy director of ICE who led the agency before Morgan’s arrival, will resume once more as ICE acting director.

    Did everyone follow all that. Isn't this fun?

    Occasionally, some of Trump's fans claim I hate Trump. It is their pathetic excuse for being unable to defend their hero in the face of all of his boneheaded mistakes. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

    The Trump administration is great entertainment.
     
  17. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2009
    Messages:
    8,449
    Likes Received:
    2,129
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Tastes better. Less filling.
     
  18. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    6,525
    Likes Received:
    2,303
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Do you recall the Downing Street Memo?

    Or are you suggesting it meant nothing?
     
  19. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2018
    Messages:
    7,192
    Likes Received:
    2,020
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    The democrats had access to the same intelligence that Bush did.
     
  20. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    6,525
    Likes Received:
    2,303
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That's rather beside the point, isn't it?

    The point is the government lies as it pleases, it lies all the time, and the GWOT is a fraud of epic proportions, yet somehow you seem to defend it.
     
  21. Liberty Monkey

    Liberty Monkey Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2018
    Messages:
    9,236
    Likes Received:
    12,470
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    The British murdered Dr Kelly to cover their complicity in the Iraq war, what is now known as doing a Hillary Clinton in the trade.



    Like Jimmy I wonder where was the left MSM media on this? Why was Tucker Carlson the only voice of reason in MSM?

    Of course Jimmy must be alt right because dribble dribble poop.
     
  22. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2018
    Messages:
    7,192
    Likes Received:
    2,020
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    The government is composed of three branches. Two of those branches with over a half a thousand people had access to whatever intelligence was available at the time. As far as I am concerned, the Iraqi war was a mistake. But it was a mistake made by a very large number of people.
     
  23. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    6,525
    Likes Received:
    2,303
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It was deliberate, not a mistake. The Downing Street memo shows that. Only a naïve person believes it was a mistake, an accident.

    The Global War Of Terror is the gift that keeps giving for war profiteers. All these years later, a person that believes otherwise is kidding only himself.
     
  24. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2018
    Messages:
    7,192
    Likes Received:
    2,020
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Then it was deliberate made by hundreds of people on both sides of the aisle and I presume by hundreds more in the the British government.
     
    Eleuthera likes this.
  25. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    6,525
    Likes Received:
    2,303
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Exactly right--the war was brought under fraud, and with huge bipartisan support.

    In just this last week we learned on 60 Minutes that the government has known full well about the dangers and reality of climate change, yet deliberately did not tell the public. The same thing with UFO's. Sharyl Attkisson showed that Andrew Zimmerman had told US Justice Department attorneys that autism was indeed likely in a subset of individuals being vaccinated, but the government kept it secret.

    Get used to it--the government lies often.

    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/51824.htm
     

Share This Page