Kushner's "deal of the century" falls flat on it's face

No, what I am saying is that my statement can be completely verified. You can quibble
over dates (but there's no proof either way, just some evidence)
Jacob said such and such
which gave a prediction --- some say the prediction was made after the event,
but the prediction wasn't fulfilled till the First and Second Century AD.
And the second set of predictions held that the Jews would return to take back
their land. This one was ridiculed by European academics in the 1800's, early
1900's.

ps the Jews were offered a homeland in Uganda and Egypt -- that's like telling the
Nth American indians today they can go to Panama or Argentina.

 

Chalk it up to coincidence.

Herzl considered Argentina. The idea, of course, was to create a homeland for Jewish people.

 

There's an awful lot of "coincidence" in the bible. You have to multiply the chances of
each prediction against the next prediction. Numbers add up ferociously.
Alongside the issue of a homeland for the Jews are two entrenched problems:
1 - the Jews never saw any country save Palestine as their homeland.
2 - the Jews in any other country would be minorities there, subject potentially to the
same experiences they faced in every other country.

 

The location for Israel was not chosen by the Jews or the UN

its where God wanted It to be

 

So does the unbelievable nonsense, from the alleged great flood to Jesus rising from the dead.

I don't think it's fair to suggest American Jews, despite discrimination here, are generally subject to experiences similar to those in many other countries. America's large Jewish population suggests Jews saw America as a relatively safe port in the storm.

I agree that Jews finally settled on Palestine because of their past history there. But we should note that Jews were initially a minority in there, too.

 

But the original UN partition was rendered moot by Israels forced expulsions. This was happening before the date of the UN mandate in the spring of '48. And don't forget that even in the years before, the Jewish militias of Irgun and Haganaugh were carrying out what we now would consider terrorist attacks such the King David hotel bombing.

"Fighting intensified in January 1948, and the Palestinian exodus began. Up to 100,000 Palestinians, mainly from the upper and middle classes, fled the cities and towns which were the epicenter of the fighting. Until then, expulsions were rare. But in April 1948, the Jewish forces launched a more concerted campaignof massacre and forced displacement, including the notorious Deir Yassin massacre of about 100 Palestinians on April 9. This spread panic among Palestinians, encouraging them to flee.

When terror didn’t do the trick, Palestinians were forced out by Jewish militias. Early April saw the launch of the “Plan Dalet” military campaign, which sought, in part, the ethnic cleansing of most or all of the Arab inhabitants from areas claimed for a Jewish state. As the British withdrew from Palestine in early May 1948, Israel declared its establishment, and the war intensified with the intervention of several Arab armies. The process of Palestinian displacementalso intensified. Yitzhak Rabin, then a young Jewish commander, would later write in his memoir of how he was ordered by David Ben-Gurion—literally with the wave of a hand—to “drive out” the 50,000 civilians in the towns of Lydda and Ramla on June 10 and 11."

https://www.theatlantic.com/interna...g-of-nakba-israel-palestine-1948-gaza/560294/

The loosely formed and poorly organized Arab armies were a reaction both to the creation of the state of Israel but also the forced expulsions and massacres that were happening in Palestinian villages. It is not so much that they organically took a chance on beating Israel as much as they felt compelled to react to the atrocities happening as the Palestinian refugee crisis grew and impacted their lands.

And as we are well aware, such as it is now it was back then:

Israel illegally demolishes over 70 apartment buildings in Arab East Jerusalem:

I only used foreign policy to coo-berate my statement as to Begin's quote on the war of '67. I do think that all the conditions are there for another 2008 moment as nothing in the fundamentals of the economy has changed. That being said, I don't agree with all "my boys" reasoning either. Especially his final statement about Keyensian economics which he misrepresents completely.

Note he doesn't have a background in economics.........however, I do maintain that his quoting of Begin is accurate and both CIA and other Israeli officials have confirmed that the '67 war had nothing to do with preemptive defensive movement and everything to do with destroying Egypt's air force as a threat to greater Israel's expansion.

Such as it is now with Iran, it was back then with Egypt.

 

The issues begin with the identification, verification, and classification of events, then as events are examined and sequenced, a look at causation vs. correlation of events, finally, a look at the relevance of events.

What events are we talking about?

Again, what events are we talking about? Events after WW2 where Israel was able to get a sovereign state?



Now, is your position is that Jews were unwilling to honor the above boundaries? The Arabs rejected the UN partition. Should they have accepted it? If not, why not?

The point is moot. Jews chose to stay in Palestine where they had come legally during the British Mandate and were unwilling to leave the region. The UN partition was a solution for the residents of Palestine. Jews said they accepted it. Are you claiming they didn't?

 

to be honest, either does Israel... but both will need to try

Israel is growing and needs to expand, Palestinians occupy the land around them, that is gonna cause conflict

we eventually made peace with the Indians, but it took a long time... we wanted their land, they did not want to give it up... eventually they had to compromise or be wiped out

Indians are allowed to practice the Peyote religion, but non-Indians are not allowed to partake, Israel may do the same someday, let Palestinians live among them as long as their religion does not spread

 

How do you know what God wants, assuming a personal god exists, pays attention to an individual's difficulties, and then intervenes?

 

He told us to put Israel where it is

 

And this matters because? The Palestinians don't deserve at least a protectorate? Palestinians should agree to have Israeli settlements dotting their territory?

At some point, Palestinians must indicate their grievances are finite. They must accept a two-state solution. Israel won't settle for less.

They figured out in September 2008 just how dumb it would be to let the banking system collapse. They proved in 2008 that they can make sure that won't happen.

You do know there's no point in going over who did what, when, and to whom. What should be done now?

 

It is indeed true that according to the Jew, their God supports even genocide to take the land. That's what they learn when they read the Torah about what they did to the people of Canaan. It's an extremist religion on par with what ISIS does.

 

It's funny how this pans out
1 - the Old Testament is a myth and the Jews were just Canaanites.
2 - the Jews conquered the land and killed all the Canaanites.

Which is it?

 

It's historical. The Old Testament spoke of a Promised Land. It also said this land would
lost twice. One of these will be when the Messiah comes and is rejected. But finally the
Jews would be called out of all the nations that were their "graves" and take back their
land with the sword in the times when the Gentile's time is fulfilled. This is primarily in
Genesis, Exodus, Ezekiel, Daniel and the Gospels.

 

God did support genocide in suport of the Old Testiment Jews

Congratulations for noticing

 

God "committed genocide" in fulfilling what He said He would do
when the Jews did not know the "time of their visitation." That
"genocide" continued right through till this century. That's history.

 

And the evidence the OT is the word of a god...?

Why is the OT obviously wrong in some of what it says? There's no evidence people can live hundreds of years. The story of Noah makes no sense. People don't turn into salt pillars.

We might have a creator, but there's no evidence it takes an interest in our individual lives or helps you cheat death (go to Heaven).

 

The religion of hate claims 2 is true, and so the Jew alive today can do it too. Their God supports it. It's their divine right to ethnically cleanse and kill the Palestinians. And so they are at it. The western christian nations support it. Jews in those countries have organized themselves to lobby for it. As if we ever heard of a Jewish lobby who demands not in our name. You do see Muslims march, not in our name. Massive difference.

 

The Jewish and Muslim God are the same God.

The Koran says Allah gave the Jews the Torah.

 

you mean like how the Muslims stole Palestine in the 7th century?

 

You lost me when you put an apostrophe in "it's". Hint: "it's" is a contraction for "it is". Text: Kushner's "deal of the century" falls flat on it's face

You meant to say, "its" which indicates a possession of whatever "it" may be.... Did they not teach these simple things when you were in high school? Perhaps not; we've been in a downward spiral of being dumbed-down in public 'education' for at least the past thirty years. But, you will school us in the sophistry of Middle Eastern politics...?

Afterword: nobody cares about the Palestinians, EarthSky. They've taken everything they've been given in abundance and in return have only offered hatred, sabotage, combat, and bottle-rockets. If the Mediterranian rose up and washed all of 'Gaza' away tomorrow, nobody would even give a damn.

 

how come when the Muslims take land you call it "conquest" but when Jews do it you call it "theft"?

sounds like a bigoted double standard

 

Jews were persecuted worlwide long before Zionism

 

no but the Muslims persecuted the Jews again and again

 

Now you are inventing your own facts

The palestinians refuse to live in peace