-Let It Be Known What Atheism Truly Is-

Atheism is not JUST A LACK OF BELIEF IN A GOD? Then what is it??

 

It is a descriptor word...which means many different things to many different people.

Some of the uses are so different from each other...I question whether the word should be (or can be) used as an effective descriptor. Better, as I see it, to simply state one's position than trying to use an ambiguous word to describe it. Doing the latter can easily lead to misinterpretation.

My personal thoughts are that almost everyone who uses "atheists" as part of a self-descriptor...uses it because of a guess that no gods exist...or a guess that it is more likely that one does not exist than that it does.

In any case, the word DOES NOT derive from "a" (without) + "theist" (someone with a 'belief' that at least one god exists) = someone without a 'belief' that at least one god exists. (As stated in the essay to which you linked.)

That cannot be, because the word "theist" came into the English language AFTER the word "atheist."

The word derives, as that essay pointed out before going into the nonsense, from the Greek (through the French) and has the etymological derivative: "a" (without) + "theos" (a god) = someone without a god...NOT someone without a 'belief' in a god.

 

Never said they were.

 

Then there is no problem, I'll look out for it in future, to keep you honest.

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Atheism is a lack of belief, Frank just doesn't like calling himself an atheist because his golfing buddies don't like it.

 

Didn't say they are one and the same.
But both do agree that god is what an individual thinks a god is.

 

No your the one claiming to know things ,deities and forces of the supernatural, which we have no reliable evidence for while we Atheists simply deal with that which we can experience and explore gaining knowledge of by the use of reason through science our greatest tool to explore the mysteries of the universe. We ask you and others all the time for simply evidence of your claims made and get nothing save you assume things but based on nothing. We claim through assumption but using simple common sense we know material forces are real as far as we can tell so why would we jump to something outside of that its not rational to believe in something without evidence. If you claim no evidence as we would see it can be provided then what is the point of debate we are dealing with the real and you fiction from perspective of many Atheists until your side can provide evidence which your claiming can never be provided. You now see the issue.

I'm not opposed to many supernatural things as fictions I like a good ghost story or fable made into a movie like anyone else I just keep them as fictions.

 

This is such a typical strawman Christians tell themselves. The problem isn't that we deny your god because "we like sin." The problem is that you secretly fear atheism.

"Why do they deny my god?" you wonder about us. "Why are they so confident?"

"Can it be that I'm wasting my life on fairy tales?"

You wanna know why I'm atheist towards your god? Then you tell me why you're atheist towards all the gods you don't believe in.

 

Just following up to point out that your theist prediction about atheism failed to materialize "before Jan 20th".



On the other hand what has subsequently occurred are serious threats to your theist rights following Jan 20th. If Trump has the right to ban Muslims from entering this country then he has the power to stomp on any and all theist ideologies, yours included.

So your prediction was only off by 180 degrees!



And FTR I will be doing my duty to oppose Trump stomping all over your 1st Amendment rights because, as an atheist, I understand that your freedom OF religion does not exist without my freedom FROM religion.

 

You are talking to somebody that denies the earth is spherical.

 

It's all a Hollywood show. At anytime our rights can be destroyed, and by an president. People cling to their rights as if the world leaders have their best interest at heart. They could care less about our rights, the only thing they care about is if the world keeps going the way it is. Where they live in luxury, with vast riches, sending young men and women to their deaths just to live that life of luxury. Hiding every evil intent and action from the people under the notion of top secret or classified. It's just another way of saying, Americans can't have the truth. They don't need to know what's "truly going on" with other nations, and we don't. While the citizens complain over matters that do nothing. Look there are people that are able to print and create money, and they do. Real value such as gold (rare item), cannot be printed or created. But that is not what they have set up is it. They hold most the gold while having citizens using IOU notes that they create. It's no different than the medieval times, with kings and queens, with deception as if it's not. Instead of enslaved with chains, we are enslaved without chains. And through their deceptions we scream and argue over policies that can be taken at any time. Or policies that change nothing, while putting on a show, I will do this, I will do that, every election same thing nothing changes unless it's for the worse. And people still argue as if the citizens need to oppose one another, and not oppose the wolves in sheep's clothing, who are absolutely responsible. A masterful deception that the people fall for every time. There is no republican or democrat in Washington. It's simply a mafia, they are all on the same team while acting as if their not. While republican and democrat citizens argue over which side is better. Both sides play the same game and will continue to do so, until good men do something.

 

None of the above has anything whatsoever to do with what I posted and/or the OP topic.

IMO that rant belongs in the Conspiracy forum which is down the hall and off the wall.

Have a nice day!

 

Did you not say:

I was letting you know we have no rights. People think they have rights maybe they do, until war or any matter whatsoever is given to extinguish them (meaning no rights if they can be taken). Such as the Patriot Act. Where if you are deemed a terrorist, or affiliated whatsoever, you are detained without due process and could be held indefinitely. Here is the problem, who has to know that they have considered someone as a terrorist if there is no due process? They don't even have to deem one a terrorist because nobody has to know. It's a mafia tactic (so to speak), as to be rid of those who are a threat to the power. And at the time Americans were not just ok with it, they were screaming for it along with the war following 9/11.

Rights are given to the dumb by the leaders of this world. The dumb find it acceptable because they believe other people have authority over them, and because of that, the authority is given. So it continues, as it did from the beginning with either small tribes or nations/kingdoms.

So the only ones with rights, are those who can grant them and obviously extinguish them.

 

Two fallacies in what you stated above.

Firstly We the People grant ourselves rights and We the the People have DUTY to uphold the rights of others even when we disagree with them. Yes, that includes terrorists who do have the right to due process. Nothing was more unAmerican than the Bush/Cheney regime denying rights. Those were crimes against humanity that should have resulted in impeachment and subsequent jail time IMO. While that never happened neither of those two unindicted felons dares to leave the USA for fear of being arrested and tried in the Hague.

What Trump is doing now to Muslims is being challenged by We the People and Federal judges because We the People understand that we must stand up for the rights of others.

Lastly you obviously missed the fact that I prefaced my comment with "IF Trump has the right...". He does NOT have that right and We the People are holding him accountable and won't allow him to take away our rights.

The rights of We the People were granted to ourselves by ourselves and we have a duty to uphold our rights when wannabe despots like Trump and Bush/Cheney try to take them away from us. There are some who are dumb enough to not comprehend that they will lose their own rights if they allow them to be taken away from others. They supported Bush/Cheney just as they currently support Trump. They are not the majority and cannot be allowed to prevail.

Let me paraphrase the well known poem from WW2 and put it into context for what is happening today.

First they came for the Muslims and We the People stood up and said "No way that is happening on our watch".

 

You blame Bush and Cheney, yet Obama had 8 years and not only did nothing on the matter of rights, but only added to the problem. Perhaps you should look into the changes of the Patriot Act from the Obama administration. Who not only agreed with Bush and Cheney, but again made it worse.

The problem with Americans, is they think there is republicans and democrats in Washington. By definition there are neither, and by definition they are very similar. They are all on the same team after the same agendas, using Hollywood tactics to make the people think otherwise. It causes distractions, division, chaos, this way they can hide the truth, and step in and solve the problem they have created. Yet the people think the problems were created elsewhere. No, all political and governmental problems come from within the government.

Today the American government can be deemed a mafia. A mobocracy, with a mob that is untouchable. It is not justice for all, it is only justice for non government agents, or American citizens. The mob is above the law, and cannot be touched. For the dumb American people think it's ok for a president to have the power to "Pardon" criminals. This would be a very wanted power by any mob, for they can do illegal stuff and merely be pardoned. And we have it in our government. It's weak, it allows for criminality without justice within the government. If I commit a crime, why is it that I don't have the power to pardon myself. And what is it, that grants such power to POTUS or for that matter "ANYBODY"?

The idea of America from our founding fathers was to have a government without power, and the people with power. An idea that enabled man God given rights, and a country that would support that idea. We was not given rights by man, we was given human rights by God, and that is the major "IDEA" of America. That a government would not be allowed to hold power over the people, but that the people holds the power over the government. Unfortunately it has taken a turn for the worse. And now it is but a select few, that holds all the power. The complete opposite of what America is suppose to be, and opposite of what it was that allowed America to prosper so very quickly. It is profoundly clear, that going away from the constitution and the very idea of America, it has only went downhill very quickly since, and allowed for vast power of government OVER the PEOPLE!

 

Still ???

Look around you at your fellow Americans and see how many are openly demanding that their rights be upheld?

4.2 million women and their supporters were marching all across this nation in what is probably the largest event of it's kind in the history of this nation.

They clearly comprehend that they have to stand up for their rights and that is exactly what they are doing.

We the People are not going to give up our right without a fight.

 

That's 'the herd instinct' at work - or given that they're sheep perhaps I should say ''the flock instinct'? You could walk along any street with a megaphone complaining, for example, about the increasing price of fish, and before you know it there will be a crowd following behind you doing what comes naturally to them - making lots of noise. Stupid people always like making lots of noise.

 

The 4.2 million women, what rights are they screaming for do you know? Are they asking for a different president, or rights?

God gave us all equal rights, it is only man that deceives (evil) others into taking it. Making them believe they must go to their masters feet and ask for these God given rights back. What are God given rights. That's easy.........Freedom. God didn't create a man to have power over all the others, we all have our earth that was given to us by God. We have the minds and intelligence to acknowledge how to go about it fairly. Do we use that knowledge and intelligence....no. We would rather have power over it all and dictate to others what to do, how to live, how much taxes to pay, what land is available and what land is the governments. An open unclaimed piece of land.......is just that. And should be available for anybody who so chooses to use the lands resources, for it is God given.

 

Really?

Not according to your own bible he didn't!

Name these imaginary "freedoms" that your god has allegedly "given".

Freedom of religion including freedom FROM religion not to believe in your god? Where did your god grant that "freedom"?

Freedom of expression? Nope, not allowed by your god either.

Freedom of privacy? Nope, your god spies on you 24*7 so no freedom of privacy.

Freedom for the presumption of innocence? Nope, according to your god everyne is born guilty!

 

No man has authority over another. Love thy neighbor as thyself, this alone is all the laws (commandments) and all the prophets. If man could do just this one thing, the result in FREEDOM would absolutely show. And one man having authority over another would cease to exist. For if everybody loved their neighbor as themselves, it would be impossible to have a master.

Other than to love our lord God with all our heart, mind, soul, and strength, to love thy neighbor as thyself is the main message within the Bible, the greatest gift is that of charity, and to love thy neighbor as thyself is to do just that. Most people go beyond what is truly written, either those of faith or those of no faith. It's rather simple and very clear. A common sense (knowledge of good and evil), towards that of good or righteousness. It's very easy and clear to understand that of which is evil or wrong, and that of which is good or righteous. There is no need for deep thought, we have knowledge of that of our Father, and understand good and evil, regardless of the excuses thereof.

 

Thank you for proving my point that your god has NOT provided any "freedom" whatsoever.

The Founding Fathers knew that religion was responsible for the OPPRESSION of freedoms and rights which is WHY they deliberately EXCLUDED it from Constitution of We the People.

As far the pablum about "love thy neighbor as thyself " goes that was exposed as utter nonsense with the oppression of gays by theists. Gays were not even allowed to marry the consenting adult of their choice that they loved under the religiously dictated DOMA legislation that was subsequently ruled to be UNCONSTITUTIONAL by the Supreme Court. That was a FREEDOM "given" by We the People as opposed to your god who demanded that gays be denied their freedom.

One more thing while I am at it. We the People treat everyone as being EQUAL under the Law of the Land which is more than can be said for religion that has all kinds of classes of people such as slaves, sinners, priests, rulers, deities, etc, etc. Theism is fundamentally flawed and, while the Constitution is far from perfect ,it is way better than anything religion has ever produced.

 

How do you know people become atheists because they want to sin? Its like saying people believing in Christianity because they are afraid of dying without showing that this is actually true.

 

Not really to sin, just an excuse as to try and be-rid their guilt (wrong doings). For one does not have to tell another when they do wrong (evil), for they already know. To say I don't have to worry because God doesn't exist, is to try and excuse their own guilt.

We all fall short of the glory of God (yes including Christians)!

 

It is a source of constant celebration for me that I have never committed a sin in my life.

 

Let it be known what atheism truly is....


... a name given by pre-Christian Greek theists to people who did not worship the *official* gods (it was even a crime at one time):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_atheism#Classical_Greece_and_Rome

In western classical antiquity, theism was the fundamental belief that supported the legitimacy of the state (the polis, later the Roman Empire). Historically, any person who did not believe in any deity supported by the state was fair game to accusations of atheism, a capital crime. For political reasons, Socrates in Athens (399 BCE) was accused of being atheos ("refusing to acknowledge the gods recognized by the state").