>>MOD WARNING<<<Christians .... if you were raised to believe

PLEASE READ THIS MOD WARNING


atheists are morally inferior, how do you explain (to yourself) good and kind atheists? further, how do you account for the secular nations now leading the world in human welfare?

do you experience conflict as a result of being confronted with the evidence that the indoctrinated idea is patently untrue? does it make you doubt your parents/pastor/grandparents etc, or whoever taught you that this was true?

do you pretend they don't exist?

do you resolve their presence by telling yourself there's an extenuating circumstance in most cases?

I'm genuinely curious to know how the average Christian explains profound or even moderate (ordinary) goodness in non-believers.

 

crank:

I do not know that anyone was "raised to believe" what you are proposing. In my experience, people form those types of opinions when they reach a certain age and start making observations of their own.

Alter2Ego

 

either way, the question remains. how do you process the reality of good atheists?

 

They burn in hell with the bad ones


...well unless you are talking about JW's who say you get a second shot during the 1,000 years after the retrun of Jesus to get you crap in order, but if at any point during said 1,000 years you post on an internet forum trolling Christians, it is straight to non-existence for you.

 

Islam seems to demand the most pious followers, so if religion was good we'd likely see Muslim nations leading the way in medical advances, human rights, woman's rights, gay rights, etc, instead of Modern Secular Humanist-leaning nations....is that happening?

 

crank, uh, I don't know how to break this to you, but, uh, our future does not look too bright, according to Deckel here, unless we change our ways.....so I'm walking into my nearest house of worship ASAP and repent, how about you? It won't be easy, having to leave science and reason at the front door, but I think we can do it.

 

The Bible teaches that in spades, seriously, haven't you read it?

 

They MUST pretend we don't exist, or how do they actually face the moral dilemma of Jesus seeing that good, moral, well-intended, charitable people like Ben Franklin and Einstein will get savagely tortured by Jesus and pals (worse than Hitler treated the Jews) in "hell", while they themselves bask in the paradise of "heaven"....they have no conscience, apparently.....I couldn't live with that guilt, so I abandoned Jesus and pals, since "heaven" would be a guilt-ridden "hell" for me to live in! By moving to science, we leave that horrific guilt behind.

 

You started out this post with a strawman. I was raised Catholic, and was never raised to believe that atheists are morally inferior. The nations leading the world have a basically Christian structure, so that isn't cognitively dissonant.

We explain goodness in non-believers as just basically being human nature. It's the same way we explain sins in all mankind. Humans are sinners. Humans are good. Humans are everything in between.

Basically speaking, you are making a broad assumption of a strawman that Christians view atheists as evil. I certainly don't, and never have. I actually feel sorry for y'all.

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God working through atheists, despite their unbelief.

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Not necessarily. We don't know what happens for sure in those last moments of life. They could repent then. Regardless, it's not our job to judge them.

 

Well, we know for sure that living a Christian life will get us to heaven. We don't for sure know what happens if we don't, and we shouldn't judge. Also, "Jesus and his pals" aren't torturing people in Hell. Hell is simply a place that has absolutely no trace of God.

http://www.catholicity.com/commentary/shea/00059.html

 

Well, they can always turn to their divorce and child abandonment rates. Last I heard, those rates were 4% HIGHER among Christians than among atheists and agnostics.

 

Evidence for that?

 

This oughta do it for ya:

http://atheism.about.com/od/atheistfamiliesmarriage/a/AtheistsDivorce.htm

 

Not all religious people believe that - some fundies who usually deny science do sure, but I think that most people regardless of religion recognize that good/badness are inherant traits - the idea that they're exclusive to religion, especially a fundamentalist religion is pretty silly.

 

Actually that would be according to the Jehovah Witnesses. I don't think changing your ways would brighten your future one iota though. Trolling God is one of them there unpardonable things. But thanks for admitting yours and cranks purpose is to troll.

 

crank:

I thought your question was to the board in general. Now you are directing it to me, personally.

In my experience, atheists are no different from most people that I meet off-line in the real world and online at websites like this. They simply refuse to offer true worship to Almighty God Jehovah, like most of the people I have had conversations with.


Alter2Ego

 

FreedomSeeker:

I do not have a clue what you mean by that. But since you are telling me something about "spades" being a Bible teaching, supposed you quote the verse of scripture where you are getting that from? Be sure and include Bible book, chapter, and verse so that I can confirm it in my own copy of the Bible.

Alter2Ego

 

Each parent is different, I suppose, but THE BIBLE teaches that non-believers are so vile, so disgusting, that they DESERVE eternal torture, as they have turned away from the moral guidance given by the invisible man in the sky - who of course is one of the most immoral beings of all time - if one reads the Bible. Or is Revelation missing from your Bible?
Have a great evening.

 

Just like YOU refuse to offer true worship to ZEUS. There is no more actual evidence that Almighty God Jehovah is real than there is for Zeus (or Apollo) or Thor, or Odin, or Krishna, or Bigfoot, etc. So you and I and crank believe that 99.999% of the gods were just invented by ancient barbarians who wanted to control people. If you could just go ONE more, we'd by in 100% agreement on this issue.

 

The problem with your premise is that the average Christian was not raised to believe what you seem to believe they were. I would say the vast majority of Christians do not have any issue with the idea that non-believers can be good people and do good things. You have some awfully skewed ideas about Christians, were you raised by people that taught you the inaccuracies about Christians that you obviously believe? So have you considered that it may be your opinions of Christians that might be off and explain your animosity towards Christians and their Faith?

 

Christians do not think anyone is inferior, in fact, we put ourselves at the bottom. Christians, unlike atheists, know they have sin and are not perfect...not anywhere close to it.

We just know where to go for help.

 

I'm sorry if this offends you, Perdi, but I don't lump you in with Christians here. In my experience, and it is only my experience, Catholics are far more accommodating and tolerant than Protestants.

As regards the now atheist countries having a Christian structure, I'd have to disagree. The places in question have as much, if not more, influence from Norse culture, Germanic culture, Celtic culture, and pre-Christian Roman culture. In some cases none of the above (Japan, for example).

 

Or Odin, or Vishnu, or Zeus, or Kali, or Satan, or invisible giant lizards from the Snarflox universe.

 

I would be very interested to know how they explain that statistic to themselves. I guess the only possible salve is to do the 'true christian' dance. Hang on, no ... there's another option. You could fall back on "being a Christian doesn't mean you'll stop being human" ... but of course this is not a safety dance (I worked it in!), because one is then compelled to ask 'well what the hell is the point, then, if it's not going to make you a better human being? is it ONLY about becoming immortal?' in which case, selfish much?

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see above. what's the point in religion at all if it's not going to elevate you in terms of behaviour?

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does it make the post-faith era seem less threatening if you call debate and critique 'trolling'?

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I simply responded to your post saying Christians aren't all raised to think this. It's what happens, here in the forums. We respond to posts addressed to us.

 

Does living under a bridge seem more attractive if you called it "camping"?