Most religious people are low IQ sheep (no offense)

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by mbk734, Jul 23, 2018.

  1. mbk734

    mbk734 Well-Known Member

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    No offense to them, but they have to be this way to follow their religion and it's got a lot to do with religious schools and how parents raise them. Atheists, in general are more intelligent and think for themselves. They don't take pride in it but they just can't understand why theists can't even consider the possibility of no God. With wider access to the internet and information, I think religion will continue to decline. We are seeing it already with millennials. This will be a huge step for society and culture.
     
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  2. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I detect Godless bias here. No debate.
     
  3. mbk734

    mbk734 Well-Known Member

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    Godless bias? That's a good one. The future is Godless. It will be both good and bad in many ways.
     
  4. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    I am non-religious, but I don't think that atheism stems from sheer intelligence. The vast majority of atheists today (arguably all) receive most of their arguments from others in a way that has similarities to how religious people receive theirs. Sometimes it needs a bit of massaging, "thinking for yourself", but I don't think very much more than religions do. Many get it from the internet, or from the general intellectual climate of today. At the moment, atheism is less likely to receive their ideas from their parents, but that's changing as a wave of atheists are reaching the age at which people tend to get children.

    That's not to say there are no correlations, I just think they are both caused by education. I think education and intelligence is correlated (causation probably going both ways) and while the education doesn't "teach" atheism, it has certainly put together a framework in which atheism is quite easy to adopt (and that education is supplemented with the internet and peer discussions). This is in practice no stranger than the fact that education used to be predominantly religious and all the smart people used to be religious, even decent theologians.

    Now, this is not to say education and the internet should be supplying an equal amount of religious ideas, I think the "atheistic" version of education is more correct, but by the time those ideas reach the masses, I don't think it requires much more intelligence or thinking for yourself. Intelligence may be correlated with atheism, but I think we do a disservice to ourselves and to society if we put too much emphasis on that point.

    I agree that religion will decline a bit, I think we are still regressing to the mean away from religion, but eventually I think it will swing back. There are questions that humans still struggle to answer without religion. Questions which I consider misphrased, but I don't believe humans are going to be able to look past them. Or if they do, it will take a couple of swings of the pendulum for us to figure it out (and perhaps by that time, we will have moved beyond religion vs. non-religion).
     
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  5. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    People are like cattle in a lot of ways. They follow the herd. Some listen to that still small voice inside but the majority follow the herd. Jesus compared us to sheep which is probably more accurate. Proof? Things seem to go in trends. We see divorce increase mainly because the herd finds it acceptable. Drugs are trendy....whatever the herd finds acceptable. Abortion is rapant, the herd finds it acceptable. The herd quashes that still small voice that pricks our conscious and now they find a new trend, that is, "God doesn't exist. " They call it "atheism." It's ALWAYS been there. Telling the Creator "I won't believe in you therefore you don't exist." It is a trend and the herd will return only after life deals them some nasty blows. That is the message of the Bible. It does not reflect intelligence. It only reflects what the "herd" is doing. This is why Progressives tend to always deal in "collectives". There is safety in numbers.....the herd mentality. The more adventurous listen to that "still small voice" and trust in Him. God always has a remnant. Perhaps some of the herd will follow. It is a narrow path.
     
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  6. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    People are like cattle in a lot of ways. They follow the herd. Some listen to that still small voice inside but the majority follow the herd. Jesus compared us to sheep which is probably more accurate. Proof? Things seem to go in trends. We see divorce increase mainly because the herd finds it acceptable. Drugs are trendy....whatever the herd finds acceptable. Abortion is rapant, the herd finds it acceptable. The herd quashes that still small voice that pricks our conscious and now they find a new trend, that is, "God doesn't exist. " They call it "atheism." It's ALWAYS been there. Telling the Creator "I won't believe in you therefore you don't exist." It is a trend and the herd will return only after life deals them some nasty blows. That is the message of the Bible. It does not reflect intelligence. It only reflects what the "herd" is doing. This is why Progressives tend to always deal in "collectives". There is safety in numbers.....the herd mentality. The more adventurous listen to that "still small voice" and trust in Him. God always has a remnant. Perhaps some of the herd will follow. It is a narrow path.
     
  7. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I believe religion is in the DNA - you either have it or you don't.
     
  8. Kyklos

    Kyklos Well-Known Member Donor

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    Awwww, their say'in I'm stupid!!! Awwww, that hurts....it really does. LOL!!!
     
  9. it's just me

    it's just me Well-Known Member

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  10. it's just me

    it's just me Well-Known Member

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    You know, if I have heard this "we're smarter, we're independent thinkers" meme once I've heard it a million times. Do these guys ever have an original thought?
     
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  11. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    Did you take a poll? I dont see that in religious philosophers versus atheist philosophers, got any data on that?

    This 11-year-old girl just beat Einstein on an IQ test
    https://www.fromthegrapevine.com/lifestyle/11-year-old-girl-just-beat-einstein-iq-test

    More like identical, most of it is semantical nonsense, grammatically incorrect, misrepresentative, and built on a plethora of fallacies that they hand wave away pretending they are valid premises.
    Sure its the latest fad.
    But you are religious unless you have no conscience, or no moral compass, or no beliefs, no supreme meme required, at least according to American lip service.


    Why the Department of Justice’s Religious Liberty Guidance Matters
    By Staff

    It has been a great week for religious freedom – the protection for the conscience rights of every American of every faith and the free exercise thereof. Earlier this week, the Senate Foreign Relations committee held its hearing for Gov. Sam Brownback to become the next Ambassador-at-Large for International Religious Freedom. And today, the Department of Health and Human Services finally provided new rules that exempt the Little Sisters of the Poor, our fellow Baptist universities and organizations, and many other entities of many faiths who objected to the Obama era regulations forcing them to participate in health insurance policies that provide abortion-causing drugs.

    Also today, the Department of Justice issued wide-ranging legal guidance that directs every part of our federal government to respect and protect our most fundamental freedoms. It’s no coincidence that this legal shift comes the same day as the Department of Health and Human Services finally provided relief from the contraception mandate to those who faithfully dissent.

    We are thankful for the priority this Administration placed on religious freedom when President Trump signed Executive Order No. 13798 earlier this year. The Department of Justice’s legal memo today is the implementation and enforcement mechanism of that Executive order.

    The free exercise of religion is America’s first freedom for a reason. A state that can pave over the conscience rights of any American’s beliefs is a state that can do anything. This guidance from the Department of Justice lays out the bedrock principle of freedom and places it back in the national dialogue. We welcome a continued substantive discussion about religious liberty, because we believe that religious liberty is in the best interest of all Americans.

    • Ensure a Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA) analysis is articulated in the process of all future regulations; That means it was GONE!
    • Reaffirm the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution and the Religious Freedom Restoration Act as the standard by which conflicts between the federal government and the religious beliefs or actions of citizens are adjudicated; and other ways the government can assure the government protects instead of infringes upon the religious freedom of our fellow Americans.
    The religious freedom guidance issued by the DOJ today addresses all of these areas and goes even farther. Here are the 20 principles laid out in the memo:

    1. The freedom of religion is an important, fundamental right, expressly protected by federal law.
    2. The free exercise of religion includes the right to act or not to act in accordance with one’s religious beliefs.
    3. The freedom of religion extends to persons and organizations.
    4. Americans do not give up their freedom of religion by participating in society or the economy, or interacting with government.
    5. Government may not restrict or compel actions because of the belief they display.
    6. Government may not exclude religious individuals or entities based on their religion.
    7. Government may not target religious individuals or entities through discriminatory enforcement of neutral, generally applicable laws.
    8. Government may not officially favor or disfavor particular religious groups.
    9. Government may not interfere with the autonomy of a religious organization.
    10. The Religious Freedom Restoration Act of 1993 (“RFRA”) prohibits the federal government from substantially burdening any aspect of religious observance or practice, except in rare cases where the government has a compelling reason and there is not a less-restrictive option available.
    11. RFRA’s protection extends not just to individuals, but also to organizations, associations, and at least some for-profit corporations.
    12. RFRA does not permit the federal government to second-guess the reasonableness of a sincerely held religious belief.
    13. A governmental action substantially burdens an exercise of religion under RFRA if it bans an aspect of an adherent’s religious observance or practice, compels an act inconsistent with that observance or practice, or substantially pressures the adherent to modify such observance or practice.
    14. Under RFRA, any government action that would substantially burden religious freedom is held to an exceptionally demanding standard.
    15. RFRA applies even where a religious adherent seeks an exemption from a requirement to confer benefits on third parties.
    16. Title VII of the Civil Rights Act prohibits covered employers from discriminating against individuals on the basis of their religion.
    17. Title VII prohibits discrimination on the basis of religious observance or practice as well as belief, unless the employer cannot reasonably accommodate such observance or practice without undue hardship.
    18. The Clinton Guidelines on Religious Exercise and Religious Expression in the Federal Workplace provide useful examples for private employers of reasonable accommodations for religious observance and practice in the workplace.
    19. Religious employers are entitled to employ only persons whose beliefs and conduct are consistent with the employers’ religious precepts.
    20. Generally, the federal government may not condition federal grants or contracts on the religious organization altering its religious character, beliefs, or activities.
    We are encouraged by the legal clarity provided through these 20 principles on religious liberty covering issues of great importance to millions of Americans. This legal memo reminds all federal agencies that people of faith do not have to leave their deeply held beliefs at the door when entering their job or public marketplace. https://erlc.com/resource-library/a...f-justices-religious-liberty-guidance-matters
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2018
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  12. Wildjoker5

    Wildjoker5 Well-Known Member

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    So why is it that the top schools in America are all private schools that typically have a religious theme to them?

    "Atheists" and "religious" people are the same, its a group. The INDIVIDUALs think for themselves.
     
  13. mbk734

    mbk734 Well-Known Member

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  14. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Atheists and theists expressing certainty is hardly the evidence for high or low IQs. Expressing certainty is a lack of evidence for a high IQ, or perhaps even emotions can trump IQs?

    I think organized religion will continue to decline, but some kind of spirituality will replace it, given that science offers no purpose to human existence.
     
  15. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    Obviously, you could say the same from the other side, you can see it as people's interest to stick to failing marriages or thinking there is a god which is the trend and is currently on its way away.
    That seems to underestimate the impact of the secular/non-religious movements. Evolution, cosmology etc. has unlocked a continuously viable way to be non-religious which didn't really exist before the 1800s.
    It's not only progressives that are doing it, I think everyone is (and indeed, not doing it is a bit weird). A mentality which fails when "the herd" gets a hold of it is going to fare badly.
    It wasn't that far back (and is still so in many areas) that the adventurous thing is to reject God. It seems your conclusions will revert themselves over time.
     
  16. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    Religion served a genuine purpose in times past, It was a basic set of rules, be they good or bad, for a community to govern themselves.
    It served as spiritual enlightenment for the sheep, and power control for the leaders.
    It financed many endeavors.
    The absurdness of the religions, was not noticed in the superstitious past.
    But, we as a race, are evolving past the religions of thousands of years ago.
     
  17. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is a still small voice that is within us all. Recently I blogged with someone that is pro- abortion. He says he hates abortion. He lists the unredeeming qualities of abortion and is right. However he believes abortion should be ready available because of freedom. He silences that still small voice in favor of going along with the herd. We always know what the herd is doing. it goes in trends. The still small voice is definitive and never changes. There was a time in Mexico where they cut the beating hearts out of hundreds of thousands, decapitated them, then threw them off the sides of their temples. We shrug today at the thought. It took a while before the "trend" caught on. But it was accepted and the herd followed until it changed. The still small voice however is consistent. Having the perseverance to stick with what you call a failing marriage builds character and relational maturity. It is good for everyone, especially children. We pledge to be faithful for life in obedience to the still small voice but the herd beckons the grass is always greener on the other side and everyone does it anyway.

    Evolution is an unproven theory. The godless embrace it as fact because it aides them in their quest to deny God. It helps build the herd.

    All of Hitlers subjects fared pretty bad I'd say. He had quite a herd. The still small voice is usually heard by individuals not collectives. We don't go along to get along. However, we verify the voice with eachother.

    Many are pretenders. They attend Church for various reasons other than the still small voice however when they step away, they often make a big deal of it, saying they were mistreated or they no longer liked the donuts.

    Be still and know that I am God.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2018
  18. Market Junkie

    Market Junkie Banned

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    Yeah, mbk, the low-IQers are clearly much easier to dupe...
     
  19. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  20. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    That's a load of silly putty cooked up by the American Taliban. It's a clever way to reintroduce Jim Crow laws and to return to a segregated society. Bigots will be coming up with all kinds of rules to exclude groups they hate and say = "It's legal!

    And if parents claim that it's against their religious to give their kids routine medical care they can say "We didn't have to because our religion says to pour oil on them and pray over them."

    And don't forget the religious rule that says thattrue belieers have to kill people who don't believe in they favorite imaginary deity and to burn down their town.

    We really need a giant asteriod to hit and put us out of our misery because too many people have gotten too stupid to live in the modern world.
     
  21. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    I'd take offense to this more than anything else, were I fool enough to allow myself to be offended by such comically transparent flamebait.
     
  22. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Crikey, that's a rarity these days. It's been replaced by neuro-linguistic programming.
     
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  23. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yeah millennial atheists are proof of higher intellige.....hahahahahhahaha.

    Take a millennials cell phone away and they can't figure out how to tie their own shoes.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2018
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  24. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    With religion having been so directly associated with paedophilia for so many decades, the latest exposé only yesterday (link below), I'm surprised it's still practiced at all. Doesn't the religious community care about child abuse?

    "Lord Carey told the child sexual abuse inquiry he was "shocked" by the crimes committed by disgraced bishop Peter Ball."

    https://news.sky.com/story/former-a...y-admits-church-failed-abuse-victims-11447370

    'shocked' - believe that, you'll believe anything.
     
  25. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    I think similar is a better word. There are still religious people who get it from literal pulpits. I'm sure there are different compositions of media for the two groups, not to mention different sources.

    That's not really what regression to the mean implies.

    While I disagree, I reckon that's an extension of our discussions elsewhere which doesn't really need repeating here.
     

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