Nationalise Health Care

Discussion in 'Health Care' started by Nonnie, Jul 29, 2018.

  1. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why doesn't America just scrap all this failed health insurance crap and just implement an NHS?

    Just privatise it all. Let's be honest, the debt level is so high, what would a few extra trillion dollars do?
     
  2. Mr_Truth

    Mr_Truth Well-Known Member

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    Kudos for making a post that makes sense, for once.

    Contrary to the myths and fantasies of the far right, our Founding Fathers did believe in government sponsored health care. For example, Jefferson helped the French create their health care reform:

    https://familiesusa.org/blog/thomas-jefferson-a-founding-father-weighs-in-on-health-care


    In 1798, Congress passed legislation that provided government mandated health care coverage for maritime employees -

    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smar...ess-first-mandated-health-care-in-1798-17926/



    During the 1940s, the USA financed the Marshall Plan that enabled European countries to create and sustain their own post war medical coverage which lasts to this day. And up to this date, American taxpayers finance Israel's health care for their citizens. All this without the slightest objection from the far right.


    It is time to have reform in the USA as well.
     
  3. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Just means no monthly private health care costs, just raised taxes across the board.

    Ok, the UK's NHS has it's faults, most due to useless politicians and Europe. Pros and cons to both systems but an NHS system covers all.

    Also, you can still pay privately if you have the wages to do so.
     
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  4. Enuf Istoomuch

    Enuf Istoomuch Well-Known Member

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    The USA has the worst system in the world for financing health care. All other free, democratic, capitalist and industrialized countries spend less money to cover more people with better health outcomes. What we should be doing is studying how it all works in those other nations. Take the best lessons and figure out how to apply them here.

    I expect unemployment would rise for a while as for-profit insurance companies would be forced to transition to non-profits and all those bureaucrats they employ to protect their profit model become surplus to requirements.

    While I don't claim to know which system would be best, I am especially impressed with Germany. They invented the oldest system of national health care, starting in the 1880's. That system has evolved greatly of course but is still working. It survived two world wars, the fall of two empires and many economic upheavals.

    The German system:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Germany

    Otto Von Bismarck, who began it all in 1881:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_von_Bismarck
     
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  5. Mr_Truth

    Mr_Truth Well-Known Member

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    while it is true that taxes might be initially raised to finance health care, as people return to work once their health issues are corrected, this will result in much higher productivity which ultimately expands the tax base and generates far more tax revenues without increasing tax rates
     
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  6. Battle3

    Battle3 Well-Known Member

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    LOL, what a fairy tale.
     
  7. Battle3

    Battle3 Well-Known Member

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    So your argument is that since the financial system is ruined anyway, just add to the problem. If its going to collapse, then make it into as big a show as possible, right?
     
  8. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Seems to be the pattern and inevitable conclusion.
     
  9. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    Are you desiring to pay a premium directly to the government for your policy?
    The product should be so much cheaper and so much better that you should gladly pay your premium, and smile all the way to the bank to deposit your savings
     
  10. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    For what policy?
     
  11. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    Your single payer health insurance of course
     
  12. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There are no policies with the NHS.
     
  13. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    So you want your tax to go up and equal dollar amount as mine to pay for it?
     
  14. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Yup.

    Add up the current average premium cost, the current average copay, the current average deductible, the current average employee cost for the employee medical benefit, the current employer cost for an employee's medical benefit, ....... or just look up "per capita cost of healthcare by country", and tell me if you think you're getting your money's worth. Be sure to check outcomes by country to validate your answer.
     
  15. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    So you're advocating for everyone to pay the same price?
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2018
  16. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    No. I'm advocating a higher progressive federal income tax to pay for it.
     
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  17. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    So you dont want to pay as much as those who make more than you?
     
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  18. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    Surely you're not looking for a subsidy from your neighbors
     
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  19. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    It seems to me that you don't really want to honestly discuss the OP. Tell me what the per-capita cost of healthcare is in the US, -with a number. That is essential to the subject of the OP. If you don't post a reply with a number, you're not interested in discussing the subject and you shouldn't be posting here. So tell me what it is since you know plenty about the subject.
     
  20. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    Well according to you, were gonna fix that with single payer.
    So given that, why dont you want to pay as much for this wonderful insurance as the guy who makes more than you?
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2018
  21. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    I'm done with you. You're not discussing this seriously OR honestly. Bye.
     
  22. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    It's ok, tell the world you want your neighbor to pay for half of yours. Nobody's gonna judge
     
  23. Mr_Truth

    Mr_Truth Well-Known Member

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    attack noted
    now try to make a reasoned argument against the TRUTH I posted
     
  24. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The way the NHS works is that it's paid for by government, out of the taxes raised. The UK's NHS has been set up and funded this way for 70 years.

    So if you add all the tax generated (VAT, income tax, capital gains tax, inheritance tax, fuel duty, corporation tax etc.. etc.. ) together, the NHS is funded out of that. UK tax doesn't need to rise.

    I don't know your tax system and level of taxes, nor, how much you all spend on health insurance per month.
     
  25. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    Are you advocating paying the same dollar for dollar increase in taxes as those who earn more than you?
     
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