Neither party cares about the people's healthcare.

I contend that neither the Republicans nor the Democrats really care about providing a system that provides quality and timely healthcare at a reasonable cost to the patient.

Each side is lost in arguments about who should administer healthcare. The typical conservative vs. liberal arguments of federalism vs. socialism keep rattling about in the media and in the halls of Congress. Each side says the other side is looking to harm the American people in one fashion or another while in truth each side is looking for an angle to implement "their" system.

Well what about us, the American people? What about what is best for us?

Who has the answers? I know it is not me.

I dislike very much the concept of single payer. To be honest it just seems to go against the grain of liberty to me.

Am I wrong?

If not I would really like to know how the People ceding power over their healthcare to the government benefits the People. How is the government going to control costs on healthcare when costs on everything else the government touches rise? What about access? Am I to believe that a bureaucracy the size of the U.S. government is going to efficiently ensure that the people get access to healthcare? Ever been treated at a State run hospital? I have. Several for that matter. It has been awhile but as I remember there is very little that seems efficient about them. I have family and friends that are still forced to use them and they have improved, but not much.

On the other hand you have the more capitalists approach. Make me understand how letting corporations who exist to make a profit be in control of healthcare is going to reduce the cost of healthcare. How is it in their best interest to do so?

Wouldn't actual competition reduce or stabilize prices and increase access? Is that not the system we had before? If so what happened to it? Why did prices become so inflated?

As you can see there is much I do not understand. What I do understand is that my families healthcare costs have risen rather dramatically when compared to my income over the last 10 years. Our health is not the factor. I actually have less issues now than I did at the beginning of that time period. My income is not a factor. It has increased steadily over that time period.

As I said I do not think either party has my best interest at heart. So who does?

 

Both parties are a part of the same hypocrisy; that's one of the reasons i've been a life-long independent.

 

I give up. What is the difference in you and Democrats? Why do those claiming to be independent favor Democrats?

 

Can i please get posters to think of health as they think about sleep, nourishment, shelter, transportation and on and on?

Once you see it as just one of the many commodities, offered by specialists, to the public, it clears up a lot of things.

Why was health care so cheap in the 1940's?

This starts the ball whipping along.

It changed due to the public being sold insurance.

Insurance is you handing to a company the risk for a hopefully small fee. It stays small so long as doctors don't get paid by government. Government has endless amounts of money where insurance firms do have law created limits. Law does not apply in the same way to government.

Voters clamored for government to dip it's deep beak into our problems. Voters caused prices to go up.

So, how can we solve it. We can make health care cheap by removing government. Easy peasy.

 

Not necessarily Robert; remember, being an independent means I'm beholden to no political party and can thus vote my conscience which I have done every single election since registering during the Nixon years. Some independents march in lockstep with either major party; others such as myself can make our own decisions without being prompted as to how to vote by a political party.

Either way, don't give up, there are better days ahead.

 

Is that even possible at this point? What about the insurance companies? How do we get rid of them? Or do we just remove the government and let the insurance companies do what they will?

 

I am not a life long independent. I was born into a Republican family. I converted to independent 18 years ago. Some of my older family members have become independents since.

How are the R's and D's a part of the same hypocrisy, at least when it comes to healthcare? Are you saying they have the same goals?

 

The parties (both) are populated with fallible HUMAN beings. If history is reviewed, it becomes clear that great care/effort has to be applied to maintain the things that are right, helpful or good.

But here is where I'm going with this:

We have 2 parties mainly. Each party has a set of characteristics and certainly different (official) agendas. What I'm most concerned about is people moving any/both in better directions.

If the people were reasonably cognizant of history and promoted a modicum of compassion overall, we'd SHAPE the political system into something more workable. But right about now, many have fallen for the notion that they cannot make a difference (which has not ever be absolutely true).

No one has to tell me (as in the OP) that if we look at political parties (factions or even ourselves), that we'll see human nature 'slithering' about. We aren't always good, right or vigilant... so problem come and affect us all. It's the same, the world over. However... WE CAN AT TIMES STAND UP and with reasonable conviction improve the situations before us. Yes, easier said than done... but at this point (as before, in the history of this world) we must endeavor to foster what is better. None of us will have our absolute way, and that should be consciously and soberly considered; the alternative is just more stupid war and suffering; and there are MILLIONS of good reasons to avoid that.

 

What a crock of shyt.

You clearly don't understand the subject.

Tell us how Obamacare or Medicare has ANY relationship to your rant. Yea..healthcare costs money. ANd?

 

Talk about a pile of shyte.

Could you please point out where I wrote anything concerning the ACA or Medicare?

 

Oh and since you are so enlightened on the subject do you care to enlighten poor ignorant me.(according to you).
Or would you rather just hurl insults?

Healthcare costs money? Really? Who knew? I suppose I should just suck it up and accept the fact that my family must suffer the consequences of what the government and corporations decide instead of attempting to educate myself and try and do something about it.

 

What exactly is a "reasonable cost"? This really is the most fundamental question of all in regards to this debate.

There are other branches of healthcare that do not suffer from this, dental and vision, but that is primarily because the procedures are predictable and anticipated. The principles of capitalistic competition can be applied without much concern and to go against it almost guarantees adverse effects.

The arguments about health care have little to do with who should administer it, but how much they should charge for it. What should be the proper and fair costs for any given medical procedure? How does a consumer, at a time of physical duress, make a competent decision, only to be billed months later for thousands of dollars worth of medical services in which he/she had no time to shop around for the most economical approach when their life may have been on the line?

What is best for us, the American people? That comes down to what we believe...is health and the right to life something that is negotiable? That is the fundamental question we are grappling with, and the fact that we are asking this question in the 21st century is an embarrassment compared to every other industrialized nation.

What the hell does this even mean?

Are you questioning your right to die? That may be a legitimate argument, but it has nothing to do with healthcare.

 

No I am questioning rather ceding control over my healthcare to the government is in my best interest or not.

 

what i mean is not just on healthcare but in most of their dealings; all most of them care about is getting relected to office and in order to do so, most of them will tell you anything you want to hear as long as you will vote for them even if they know they cannot come through with their campaign promises.

 

I agree with this. I think it is reasonable to expect that my healthcare does not cost so much that it inhibits me from being able to provide a decent lifestyle for my family.

 

A. No response.

I'll ask again.How does anything in your rant have anything to do with Obamacare or Medicare?

And yes healthcare costs money.

You decry corporation and you decry government.

What else is there?

You whine about "both parties" but aren't informed enough to know what either party is trying to do...

 

If you don't get your insurance through your employer then you almost definitely get it through the ACA or Medicare. You seem to be too wealthy for Medicaid so...

You tell us

 

What else is there? That question saddens me.

I whine about nothing. And I think I know exactly what each party is trying to do, which is my problem with this whole debacle.

 

Employer

 

Here is where you and I differ.

I have once in a while voted for Libertarians. I used to only vote for Democrats. I now only vote for republicans. By your definition, I too am an independent.

 

This is a fast solve.
1. no campaigning until the final 60 days.

 

If you have the means, i.e. money, how would you be ceding control?

No one is talking about overturning one's right to buy whatever they chose, it's about providing for those who cannot chose.

 

here's why it won't work: the first amendment; they'd claim their rights were being trampled upon.

 

I won't deny the will claim that, however it is possible to make it entirely legal.

 

Family and church are for charity. Government is not.