Not happy with how Brexit is going

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by alexa, Feb 8, 2019.

  1. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Conservatives will soon be in the opposition. It is simply a question of time as the economy settles down and unemployment rises due to Brexit.

    And the only reason they are not there today is because Corbyn is such a dork ...
     
  2. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Your second sentence lost you a like!! :)
     
  3. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    OK this is I think a very interesting Channel 4 Interview about how the rest of the world views Brexit though I do think the British man being interviewed is somewhat optimistic. They nonetheless make many very good points.

     
  4. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Justice Minister is very unhappy about the idea of No Deal and is giving his vote for extending article 50

    https://www.theguardian.com/politic...expresses-grave-concerns-about-no-deal-brexit

    and

    Hammond was off to China intending to get the best deal ever, you know with Brexit China will be wanting to do all kinds of business with us, rather than without being a part of the EU most countries will have no interest. Anyway Hammond was getting ready because as you will be aware we have only a handful of trade agreements and these Tories keep threatening No Deal.....so what happens? The Defence secretary boasts that he is going to send the British Aircraft Carrier (is that the one that we cannot afford planes for?) to stand threatening China in the South China Sea. No surprise then that China has decided No Trade Deal with the UK

    https://www.theguardian.com/politic...illiamson-china-warship-threat-philip-hammond

    I mean for goodness sake what was the matter with him. Fox knows the routine and told Duterte that he shares his values. This going it along does involve licking everyone's arse. It is time the Defence Sectretary and others started understanding basics.
     
  5. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The people voted for Brexit and Brexit it should be
    Deal of No Deal.

    Holes in the dike can be managed one leak at a time, as needed
    and hastened by urgency rather than those who would
    deny the people's vote via obfuscation.

    Moi :oldman:


    One Side or the Other
    Take :flagcanada: Please
    Imagine :flagcanada: Maple Syrup
    Made in Poland
     
  6. saveliberty

    saveliberty Well-Known Member

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    The EU is a failed experiment. Time to accept it and unwind the mess.
     
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  7. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I see. On hearing that No Deal will destroy the UK, you voted No Deal.
     
  8. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    PARAPHRASING IS A CHEAP SHOT !
    Use your words/actions without implying, inferring, suggesting Moi's



    The UK will not be destroyed!
    That is the Bogeyman the rich wish YOU to believe.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogeyman

    Give the "in charge" plutocrats (money power) the chance
    and they will defer BREXIT as best they can. True?

    That is why it is important that the EXIT date remain firm.
    With such pressure they just may pull it off.
    Try a Camp David accord style meeting as involved Carter, Begin and Sadat.
    Get it done.

    The Plutocracy that runs the UK has no will to get it done, do they.


    As to the problem of no deal, please refer to previous upload #80. Gracias.
    "Holes in the dike can be managed one leak at a time, as needed
    and hastened by urgency rather than those who would
    deny the people's vote via obfuscation."






    Moi :oldman: :flagus: :salute:
    No Vote, just an opinion.
    You don't want my opinion, here's my impression.



    Who Takes :flagcanada: ?
    Britain or the EU?
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2019
  9. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nonsense, that was what was being spoken about when you came in and seems I got to you somehow given how emotional you have become.
    There is supposed to be freedom of speech here, you are not dictator

    I very much doubt you know anything about what is happening concerning Brexit here and you certainly do not have the ability to make such a suggestion. However you were replying praising Brexit when that was pretty much the lay of the land.

    Just as I thought. You know nothing about it. It is 'the rich' who have organised it - but removed their assets from the country. Brexit was voted for by three groups of people. First it was the old. Without the over 50's, the people who will be minimally affected, there would have been no Brexit, However it was not all the old just generally the under educated who had this amazing idea that we were going to bring back a lost era where Britain was great - and had a minimum of non whites. That is the reason for a lot of people's support for Brexit. Is it yours? The second group of people who voted for Brexit were the people who have been hit the hardest by the Tories austerity policies. They to a fair extent bought the 'get rid of the immigrant' rhetoric which was very much the rhetoric during the short referendum. Along with that went the desire to tell those, Cameron, who had put them into this situation most recently to bugger off. During the Referendum 'leave' copied many of the strategies of the Scottish Independence Referendum including the rhetoric, except with Scotland that was not about ethnic nationalism. One of the things they did copy was what Radical Independence had done. They had gone in among all the areas where people had not voted since Thatcherism as they believed their vote was worth nothing and they encouraged them that this time it really could mean something and got them to vote. 'Leave' did this as well, telling them they would get rid of the 'foreigners' but they told a little lie which did not happen in Scotland. That lie was suggesting voting to leave the EU would not make their life better. They lived in areas which got major grants from the EU and they will suffer the most from Brexit. MP's have found themselves in a fix. They want to show their constituents that they are following their democratic voice but they have become aware that especially a No Deal is going to cause them massive loss. Even a good deal would but a no deal will be catastrophic for them...so much so that May has made plans for Martial Law as she is expecting things to go crazy as the effect hits us. She has also offered to put some money into these areas for a short time if Labour will agree her plan which would not be a No Deal but it does not look likely this will be acceptable to Labour and on Ireland it seems to be acceptable to no one. The hard Brexiters did not think of Northern Ireland and the head Unionist from there believed that she could pull a fast one over the Catholics and end any hope of Union. In reality she almost certainly has made that a certainty ...or maybe not..it may return to fighting.

    OK the last group of people who voted are those with more than a bob or two who hope to make much more than a bob or two and in particular see this as a last ditch hope to keep neo liberalism moving the people of Britain bit by bit back to a feudal society. A No Deal Brexit is not for the people. it is a betrayal of the people. It is interesting that one of the leaders of the No Deal brigade wants to bring to UK Universities people who will indoctrinate students into far right thinking making it mainstream as it appears has already happened to a great degree in the US. He is correctly understanding that something like Fascism will probably be necessary for him to keep those he sees as minions in check.

    Now as you will have noticed one of these groups included the old and a fair number of them have now left us. In addition a fair number of the young who want to stay in the EU have now reached the age of the vote. Democracy did not die on the night of the Brexit vote and that number now would not be a majority.

    In addition Britain's previous ability to speak louder than her current power is gone with her becoming a laughing stock to the world except for Brexiters whether in the UK or out. Much of that power came because we were in the EU. Hence people often wanted to do business with us because of that and because we were viewed as stable and reliable, a belief which has now totally gone. That is gone and our Government if thinking of doing a No Deal has only managed to make Trade deals with 7 out of 69 countries we need so anyone who does not see that a No Deal is going to be a disaster for this country is living in cloud cuckoo land not least because the likelihood of there even being a United Kingdom after a No Deal is as slim as to be laughable.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2019
  10. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    @alexa

    No, YOU know nothing.
    Is that the level of discussion you prefer?

    If you can't create those thoughts of 1,000 words in fewer, it is smoke screen :blahblah:

    Take the last word if you can't dialog avec Moi.
    ttfn :blowkiss:
     
  11. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nothing but a meaningless personal attack. No ability to argue information given. Why am I not surprised.
     
  12. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Too bad. Corbyn remains nonetheless an intelligent dork.

    Meaning, though he knows what must be done to insure economic fairness, his means for doing so remain archaic. European Social-democrats in general are living in age that has long since passed them by factually ...

    Ie, they wont work ... !
     
  13. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Of course what was in the past will not work now. I would say if it is not Corbyn it may well move in the UK to the end of the Union by a United Ireland and Independent Scotland and very likely a fascist England. Corbyn can stop that, certainly a fascist England and a Corbyn England could work well with an Independent Scotland and United Ireland if that is what the people of those countries choose. On many levels now he does have the right position and working with DiEM 25 and Social Democrats in the US and other countries point us in the right direction. We need radical change and we need it quick if for no other reason to sort out climate change and avoid human extinction.

    The video I looked at suggested that although Brexit has scared people off leaving the EU, the far right are working on changing it from within.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
  14. saveliberty

    saveliberty Well-Known Member

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    So your defense is Brexit was voted on by the population and that is unfair because they have points of view? The US higher education system is indoctrinated by the Left just as the UK is. Your other defense seems to be the political landscape has changed as so much time has passed, while the Left tries to reframe the argument. :lol:

    Say want ever you want, what I see is government refusing to implement the will of the people.
     
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  15. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I wasn't defending. I was just saying things as they are.
     
  16. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    first casualty of brexit? Fybmi airline shut down blaming Brexit uncertainty...
     
  17. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The dike will burst and the UK will be flooded with unemployment. The UK is forgoing about two-thirds of its total export to the EU by exiting. Hello, high unemployment!

    Mark my words ...
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
  18. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Indoctrination happens in public education.

    I am a boomer.
    Back in the 50's and 60's President Abraham Lincoln
    was taught as a saint and a martyr.

    As a product of my own studies as an adult my opinion is very different.
    Bloody Lincoln made war on civilians.

    Indoctrination in public schools happens. Comprende!
    The other day I was watching the news and it showed
    elementary school kids "protesting" this or that at City Hall
    while attending school with their teachers!
    Protesting something not directly related to their school or education.
    Who made the assignment.
    What of the student who didn't want to protest? A, D- grade?
    I wish I could remember the topic of their protest - hey I'm over 70 - :oldman:
    but, I do remember my reaction as above.


    Indoctrination in Public Schools happens.
    For my tax dollar it should be stopped.


    Moi
    :oldman:




    No Canada-1.jpg
    Across an immense, unguarded, ethereal border, Canadians, cool and unsympathetic,
    regard our America with envious eyes and slowly and surely draw their plans against us.

    Example, being indoctrinated they were a good neighbor across
    the longest, undefended border.
     
  19. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Me Too ! ;)


    They're just protecting the people from their democratic stupidity. :lol:
     
  20. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes Brit people.

    Brexit and the bogyman will come and get you.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogeyman
    Be afraid. Be very afraid.
    Mark my words.
    :)


    The gov't under pressure from the wealthy is stalling Brexit.
    Best to keep the date of exit, make them hurry it up.
    Above I suggested Camp David (Carter, Begin, Sadat) style negotiations.
    No one leaves the area until negotiations are complete.
    If that fails, trust bilateral negotiations with this or that nation will be the
    solution to resolve unexpected hardships.

    People are getting wise to the fact that Free Trade oppresses
    the proletariat for the profits of international capitalist with no loyalty to any nation.
    Why would a Brit believe they can compete with Eastern European labor?
    They can't. So the Brit loses employment or income.
    But, the welfare folks can afford a big flat screen TV thanks to Free Trade.


    Moi :oldman:
    Fair Trade
    Not Free Trade!


    :nana: :flagcanada:
     
  21. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Britain HAD fair-trade! (No VAT on exports!)

    Whatever Free Trade you THINK Brexit will afford you is pie-in-the-sky.

    Some people must learn the hard way ...​
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
  22. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Spurious commentary without substantiating evidence ...
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
  23. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Please do not edit quotes, highlight as you like.
    Some of the flavor of the edited part is lost via amputation from other thoughts in the upload.



    Meanwhile, the problem with globalism and the profits to be gained
    is they don't trickle down to the working people and their standard of living!
    Working people are wise to this now to the chagrin of the globalist profiteer
    who can have Polish labor competing with Brit labor without regard for relative
    cost of living.
     
  24. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    For your edification, definition of "indoctrination":
    The above can happen, but it is my experience that universities have a very large bandwidth when it comes to learning.

    Of course, if YOU were going to school in Russia/Chine/North Korea, maybe YOU were indoctrinated ... ?
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
  25. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sorry, but not quoting frm posts in order to understand a response by others is ... uh, "bad manners".

    Granted, not enough "trickle down", but that is simply a matter of lax upper-income taxation, which is the key reason that the US is plagued by Income Disparity. (The US is one of the worst of any developed nation.)

    But upper-income taxation in the EU is much higher than in the US, and Income Disparity is far less. It could nonetheless be better, and that is a key project that the EU should supprt. (In my most humble opinion ...)

    PS: Polish labor has some of the highest wages in the entire history of the country. Nobody is hurting.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019

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