Obamacare A Big Lie From The Start...

How about if we just make it illegal to be poor and herd all the poor people into ghettos so they can get appropriate health care? Then we can auction the healthy ones off to any employer who will take them for whatever wage they are willing to pay, from which their debt to society for keeping them in health will be deducted. There will be fines to employers for returning damaged goods.

 

spoken like a true communist............hail Hydra!!!

 

Or how about forcing Fortune 500 company employees to pay their own health care rather than have the costs deducted on the corporate 1120 forms?

It's time to end this subsidy for elite suburbanites - too bad we can too many right wingers on this forum to agree.

 

it is really about insurance or is it more of an ax to grind because of the apparent income disparity...........

 

For all of you who like to pretend that health care costs were not increasing prior to the ACA here is a source of actual data:

http://www.cms.gov/Research-Statist...NationalHealthExpendData/Downloads/tables.pdf

Suggest you read the tables so you can address the cost issues more intelligently.

 

and here's a current review of Obiecare:
On its one-year anniversary, ObamaCare gets an ‘F’

By Michael D. Tanner September 28, 2014

http://nypost.com/2014/09/28/on-its-one-year-anniversary-obamacare-gets-an-f/

This is a long read, but most interesting. Seems that the touters of Obiecare have been re-spinning their numbers in order to make a piece of (*)(*)(*)(*) legislation using the Mussolini method of celebrating a non-victory. They have repeated the lie often enough they actually do believe it.
Anyone who signs up for Obiecare are traitors and scumbags.
If you like your plan, you can keep it.
If you like your doctor, you can keep him.
You don't have to work if you don't want to, we'll take "care" of you....I wonder what they mean by that?

 

NY Post owned by Rupert Murdoch.

lol

 

a better source than some obscure blogger who is waiting for their welfare check while living in their parents basement...the 1st is just around the corner for those who are traitors and moochers..

 

Do you actually believe that no one is aware that medical costs were increasing?

Have you ever argued that an effective way to slow the rise is tort reform?
Have you ever argued that an effective way to slow the rise is to deport illegal aliens?
Have you ever argued that an effective way to slow the rise is to rewrite the laws to allow the free flow of insurance opportunities across state lines?

No? Was crony capitalism through an unconstitutional law the only way? Did it work? Did the average family see a decrease of $2500 per year?

Isn't your real goal population control through a socialist scheme?

 

The government should oversee it, I would do three things.

1. Instead of the exchange plans beef up Medicaid reimbursements and make that the default insurance for the uninsured, run by HMO's who would get to keep 6% for administrative costs and must use the rest for care. To get providers I would require all medical providers take Medicaid patients if they take any other form of insurance including company HSA and provided plans at the new Medicaid rates.

2. Apply price gouging laws if a price is out of reason its illegal, as set by the government, allowing for a fair profit. Require clear national pricing for services if they are medically necessary.

3. The government will oversee costs for Medicaid using its clout to buy drugs, medical devices, negotiate for services and decide on other issues including what treatments Medicaid will provide. This will also be applied as recommendation for those with other insurance.

 

Actually if you follow the thread a lot of the posters blame the ACA for increases in health insurance costs. I agree with you they are clueless but posting actual facts never hurts,

Tort reform might reduce cost increases slightly but the devil is in the details. The only major proposals seem to be to,reduce pain and suffering and punitive awards which actually seem to be the only existing check on the really bad doctors and hospitals. Allowing insurance sales across state lines might help if the plans were standardized enough to allow comparisons. Just try to actually compare plans now and you will realize how critical this is.

And population control would not be a bad idea in a world where the population is increasing faster than society seems able to find meaningful roles for the population that already exists. Not sure what the socialist scheme has to do with it though. I always thought population control through limited education and medical access was the Republican plan.

 

Why do you believe that government should have any role in determining your health care options?

Are you incapable of making your own decisions?

Should the government determine what kind of car you can drive? Oh, it already does.
Should the government determine what kind of light bulb you can buy? Oh, it already does.
Should the government determine what kind of toilet you can buy? Oh, it already does.
Should the government determine what kind of food you can buy? Oh, it already does.
Should the government determine what kind of education you can buy? Oh, it already does.
Should the government determine what kind of ________ you can buy? Oh, it already does.

It is time to get the government out of the unconstitutional actions it takes.

We need a Convention of States to propose amendments under Article V of the Constitution.

WE are no longer free. Government is devouring us.

 

We have pre-ACA cost increases and we have ACA-imposed cost increases. Those who seek wisdom would want to discern the differences. The ACA propaganda was a lie from the beginning.

Tort reform: These can be as simple as loser pays the costs to restricting damages to expenses you paid for the service. Lawyers will no longer become rich when idiot juries award hundreds of millions of dollars in damages. If you earn 50K per year and you lose a year of work the highest award should be your lost wages. If you like double that.

We have many private standards organizations. let private citizens create on.

Do you believe that everything we can buy must be standardized? Who would do that and why? Have you ever made any decision on your own without a government minder assisting you?

Wow. Here we have a whole new radical idea. Will you be waiting on a government minder to impregnate your or your spouse? Or does the government just get to decide if or when you may have children?

Given your imagination can you give me your imaginary link to the Republican plan to limited education and limited medical care as a means of population control?

You do realize, don't you, that population control means control over the population and not control over reproduction, don't you?

 

They already do I'm on Medicaid in Florida, in an HMO, I can choose my primary care home but the insurer decides what specialists I see and what treatments I get largely using older tested procedures and drugs (with some exceptions my Diabetic insulin therapy using modern long lasting insulin). I get some input but in the end I take what care the HMO and my doctors decide on. The State has oversight.

I'm a socialist and communist, I don't fear bigger government and if you had this constitutional convention who says your side would win I would side with those wanting economic egalitarianism, a strong welfare state modernized perhaps to allow levels of support, a free education K through university to graduate school for one advanced degree, a job for all, housing for all, food and water for all and health care for all run by the government (models could vary Germany has a good one to copy). And I want universal equal rights to include economic classes and other factors for all citizens.

I would limit citizenship to those born here when they turn eighteen and apply for it and limited to them, ending anchor babies.

 

then move out of this capitalist society and return to Russia. They have everything you want.

 

Convince your state legislature to petition the Congress for an Article V convention of states to propose amendments and let's see.

Of course you do not fear bigger government. You are a slave and a mooch.

 

So please explain the difference between medical cost increases before ACA and after ACA. Other of course then the fact that you can blame the increases post ACA on Obama.

And tort reform is just a way to make it impossible for anyone to sue doctors and hospitals for malpractice no matter how egregious. The plaintiffs will just run up the costs to the point where no individual lawyer will be able to take the financial risk of a lawsuit. Funny how the Republicans are against government involvement in most things are willing to use government interference to limit the legal process.

And if you mean "control the population" use that term not "population control" .

And please explain why you would oppose standardized health insurance policies. I assume you have probably never actually read an insurance policy or you would know why standardization is important. And yes I have made an occasional decision on my own and am grateful for instance for standardized financial accounting procedures which make it possible to compare corporations prior to stock investment just as an example. Laws requiring standardized auto insurance plans help compare plans. And standardized mortgage requirements help when taking out home loans. Etc, etc.

 

And should the government decide what kind of wars I support? Oh, it already does.
And should the government decide safety standards for cars. Oh, it already does.
And should the government require I save for retirement! Oh, it already does.
And should the government control elections? Oh, it already does.
And should the government have any role in my life? Oh, it already does

 

so, let's go for broke and turn everything, including your Bill of Rights, over to the government? You surrender too quickly

 

According to the IRS tax stats, out of total income earned, state and federal take half of that total income. We have already allowed government total control over us.

The ACA did nothing to control health care cost because their was nothing left for them to control. Health insurance companies reimbursed at less then 33% of total charges submitted. Healthcare providers can charge whatever they want to but they won't get paid anymore then what the insurance says they will pay.

Insurance companies knew that eventually consumers now with higher out of pocket expenses would come to the conclusion that having health insurance was not worth having anymore and that is why we are now mandated to carry it.

 

Not so. Murdoch is the world's biggest pornographer (the FCC imposed a huge fine on him for his smut) and a corporate welfare queen.

 

and so? all those democrats in DC are pedophiles and Muslim lovers...what difference does it make?
ACA is slowly going down in flames, and you can directly blame Obama for shooting himself in the foot.
NOTE: Obie is NOT the king of America. He is another freeloader and moocher whose wife has a double standard. Her brats aren't on ACA.........wonder why that is....

 

I'm deemed fully disabled by the government and in need of Medicaid, SSI and SNAP (state SSI program option) and therefore get help. I did work as a Busker I earned $400 a month with some more on special event days and paid taxes but I never demonstrated being able to earn the $1070 month required and my atrophy and nerve damage in my hands now even affects that work. I frankly would be lucky to make under half that now. I can't make jewelry anymore my left hand is useless 90% loss of use, that and most jobs demand two hands working well enough to do manual tasks. Typing this is by mouse and on-screen keyboard taking me fifteen minutes. What job group am I supposed to do I can't play musical instruments, can't make jewelry, can't type, can't do manual work (electronics assembly etc.)?

I have a nurse come in to help me wash, tend to my meds and do my wound care and I hate it but accept I'm disabled and need the help.

Moocher and slave I'm disabled, in need of government care and I hope you are never in my shoes I will trade my body for yours in a second.

 

Why bother. First you already know it is true. Secondly you will reject any evidence given. If the Islamofascist supporter on the golf course is not responsible for Obamacare then who is?

I see. So in your imagination the only possible solution requires first, crony capitalism and second socialism. I am not surprised. Are there any decisions you want to make for yourself?

I suppose I could say it both ways. I can use population control for the people smart enough to reason through it in context. I can use control the population for those who are unable to reason.

People should be allowed to sell what they want. And people should be able to buy what they want.

For those people who need someone else to hold their hand I am sure there is a business opportunity for those willing to rent out their hands.

 

"Of course you do not fear bigger government. You are a slave and a mooch."

I nailed it. You are a slave and a mooch.

So instead of being a liberal, socialist, Progressive, Marxist perhaps you should occasionally just say, "Thank you" to those of us who pay your way.

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I wonder why you appear to be happy with this sad state of affairs.