Only 2.27% of the population can prevent a constitutional amendment that's a problem.

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Sackeshi, Nov 21, 2019.

  1. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    That is a problem because slightly over half the 13 least populated states that only make up 4.55% of the population can block an amendment.

    Only 20% is needed to pass an amendment, and 60% have no way of stopping the amendment.
     
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  2. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We are a union of states. Sorry if that bothers you.
     
  3. 61falcon

    61falcon Well-Known Member

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    And only 538 anonymous citizen to most elect our president and vice president???Using the word DEMOCRACY to describe our country is a joke!!!
     
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  4. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    yeah and most of them are empty
     
  5. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We are a union of states regardless. Sorry if that bothers you. Perhaps you should try passing an amendment?
     
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  6. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's a problem for meglomaniacal tyrants for sure.
     
  7. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's almost like a republic or something.
     
  8. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Donor

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    This problem could be resolved by dissolving the Union.

    It cant be resolved by instituting a popular vote for everything, because that would create a 'breach of contract' situation between the FedGov and the states that refused to join without protection from an electoral system that would subject them to rule by the more populous states. It would, in a legal sense, legitimize secession, and lead to a dissolving of the Union anyway.

    The Union was literally founded upon restricting much of what could be done via mob rule.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2019
  9. 61falcon

    61falcon Well-Known Member

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    Do you know of the identity of a single elector who voted our current president and vice president into office????Because I don't!!!And neither do 99.99999999 % of the voting public in our country.
     
  10. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    Actually the voters have nothing to do with it. It's the legislatures that approve amendments.

    Article V

    The Congress, whenever two thirds of both houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, or, on the application of the legislatures of two thirds of the several states, shall call a convention for proposing amendments, which, in either case, shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the Congress; provided that no amendment which may be made prior to the year one thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any manner affect the first and fourth clauses in the ninth section of the first article; and that no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal suffrage in the Senate.
     
  11. 61falcon

    61falcon Well-Known Member

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    A republic just means we do not have a monarch.
     
  12. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Donor

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    But regardless, an amendment must be ratified by 75% of the states to pass. That changes the benchmark dramatically from the percentages you have used.
     
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  13. Chester_Murphy

    Chester_Murphy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Considering forming a posse? lol
     
  14. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So what you have is a lack of civics education.
     
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  15. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    I didn't know off hand, but it took me about a minute to find my states's Electors. Then I looked through the list and recognized one of them. We live in an information age. At least, my current state (FL), has pretty transparent government records.
     
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  16. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    I didn't know off hand, but it took me about a minute to find my states's Electors. Then I looked through the list and recognized one of them. We live in an information age. At least, my current state (FL), has pretty transparent government records.
    Just FYI, one of them was Pam Bondi, the former Florida Attorney General. Another was Joe Negron, former FL senate President. Now you know the names of two of them. Here's a pic of Bondi.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2019
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  17. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    It only takes a majority to get a majority of the state legislatures that are pro an amendment.
     
  18. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    Why do you consider this a problem?
     
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  19. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    It's a little more complicated than you make it out to be. It takes 3/4 of the state legislatures to approve an amendment, not a majority. Please read Article V of the Constitution again.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2019
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  20. perdidochas

    perdidochas Well-Known Member

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    Please re-explain. Your first sentence makes sense. Your second sentence does not.

    You need 3/4 of state legislatures to pass an amendment. (75%). It only takes 25% of state legislatures to stop an amendment.

    What does the 20% and 60% in your second sentence refer to? To put on my science teacher hat, what is that 20% and 60% measuring?
     
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  21. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    why don't you consider it a problem that 2.25% of the population can prevent the will of the 97.75 from getting an amendment they want or need passed but a minority could pass an amendment splitting up the big 12 states and they could not do anything about it.
     
  22. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    It takes 38 of the several sovereign states to make a change to their treaty. That was one of the stipulations for them creating the treaty in the first place.
     
  23. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    Lets say for some 50+1% of each state's population of the smallest 38 states decided to pass an amendment making only the senate seats count towards the EC total. That would only be 20% of the population. They could each vote in slight majorities on the legislatures of the states and wam. you have 38 state legislative majorities for making each state only get 2 electoral votes.
     
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  24. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    We are a union of states.
    End of story
     
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  25. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    Yes, 38 of the states can pass amendments to the constitution. That was what the delegates from the several sovereign states negotiated.
     
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