Pakistani court allows marriage of kidnapped Christian girl because she had first period

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by chris155au, Feb 13, 2020.

  1. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Chris, you may be well intentioned, but sometimes it seems you are woefully ignorant.

    You ask questions, and no one is going to give you the long detailed answer they deserve.

    Everything that happened here has intimate connection to historical muslim practice. The fact that the girl came from a Christian family almost certainly has a huge part to play in the court's ruling, even though they do not openly admit that. In their minds, the muslim would be "rescuing" the girl from Christians, bringing her to the "true" religion, and the non-muslim girls are sort of "fair game".

    The family has not been allowed to see their girl. And if they do see her, it will only be in the court room and they will not get to see her alone. Once a girl has been married, she's not legally part of the original family anymore.

    The family believes the girl was initially kidnapped against her will, and so far there is no indication to the contrary. (Other than the girl's signature on the affidavit submitted by the husband's lawyer to the court that she consented to marriage, but that could have been forced)
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2020
  2. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    Because I can't see the connection between the Quran mandating relationships between men and women and kidnapping? Surely you can't be serious. Do you know the connection?

    Well that's certainly no reason not to ask them.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2020
  3. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Taking non-muslim girls by force and marrying them. Even if they are young teenagers and neither the girl nor her family consented.

    Then, once she is married, she is legally treated like a child to her husband. He controls her.

    Is that an adequate enough explanation for you, or are we going to have to get into exact specifics with religious texts?

    Also realize it's as much an attitude wrapped up in the religion as it is specific instructions.

    In that culture, girls are sort of seen as property of their families or husbands. If she had come from a muslim family, the court would have given the family of the girl more protections. If you switched the religions around, there would be outrage in the local community, and there probably would have been a mob that would have beaten the Christian family that took the muslim girl, before the entire family was arrested.

    Chris, are you able to connect the dots in your head and understand this?
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2020
  4. Wonder4575

    Wonder4575 Newly Registered

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    But all cultures are equal. ;)
     
  5. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    no... as a bill that had to be paid to the victim.
     
  6. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    What section in the Wikipedia article is that?
     
  7. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    chris155au likes this.
  8. Etbauer

    Etbauer Banned

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    Uhhh... lol, what else could that mean? Did I miss the section where there was a long conversation in which they expressed their desires?
     
  9. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    Just because it doesn't say that they expressed their desires doesn't mean that they didn't.
     
  10. Etbauer

    Etbauer Banned

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    Lol, that's the 'values' you want us to live by huh? Rape people, use your authority over people to avoid gayness. As long as your daughters don't expressly say they don't want to be used by rapists, assume they do.

    Hey, did it say that the men didn't want to have sex with them?
     
  11. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    I assume you are asking for scripture.

    23:6
    Except from their wives or (the captives and slaves) that their right hands possess, for then, they are free from blame;
     
  12. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    Why has "captives and slaves" been added?
     
  13. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    Evidently to screw with your mind, man! lol

    Since I neither read nor translate Arabic, you'll have to ask someone else.
     
  14. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    A few more translations for you:

    Sahih International: Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed -

    Pickthall: Save from their wives or the (slaves) that their right hands possess, for then they are not blameworthy,

    Yusuf Ali: Except with those joined to them in the marriage bond, or (the captives) whom their right hands possess,- for (in their case) they are free from blame,

    Shakir: Except before their mates or those whom their right hands possess, for they surely are not blameable,

    Muhammad Sarwar: except with their spouses and slave-girls. The practice of carnal relations is lawful with them.

    Mohsin Khan: Except from their wives or (the captives and slaves) that their right hands possess, for then, they are free from blame;

    Arberry: save from their wives and what their right hands own then being not blameworthy
     
  15. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    Well "captives and slaves" was in brackets, so I assumed that you added it. Didn't you?
     
  16. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    No, of course not. A straight copy paste

    Btw... Did that answer your question?
     
    Last edited: Feb 29, 2020
  17. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    From what source?
     
  18. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    Are you serious?
    I said Google "Koran, concubines, captives" and lo and behold that was the first thing that popped up.

    You try and see what you find..or..copy/paste the quote and find whatever translation/translator it might be.

    Suit yourself. You asked a question, I answered it, and then answered it again. If that's not the information you wanted, so be it.

    Happy surfing...
     
  19. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, the original doesn't have those words in brackets.
     
  20. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    BS. Don't call me a liar. That is exactly how I c/p it. I can't imagine what you think I had to gain by altering a quote that can easily be found on the internet! And then go drag a bunch more of them up!

    wtfev....
     
  21. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    Last edited: Feb 29, 2020
  22. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    Just exactly where did I call you a liar? I just said that it wasn't the original.
     
  23. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    lol

    Yo, go look at my first post with the offending translation in it.

    Now, scroll to the post below where I included several translations.

    Now, run down those names til ya find Mohsin Khan. Tell him that parentheses were not in his original translation!

    lol :fart: oops...
     
  24. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

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    The 28 year old Indian actor?
     
  25. UprightBiped

    UprightBiped Active Member

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    I don't give a crap if he's your neighbor's third cousin's seventh son.

    EVIDENTLY he has a Koran translation and there you have it on your screen.

    https://images.app.goo.gl/3EGd4GyNf81Cd8zR7

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 29, 2020

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