Payback strategy Greece, could end in stable and greener Greece

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by Xanadu, Jun 20, 2015.

  1. Xanadu

    Xanadu New Member

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    Now Russia want to provide Greece Russian gas via a pipeline to pay its debts back to the EU countries. That makes Greece more dependent to Russia, and ensions can rise between Russia and NATO. Because strategically Russia comes closer to NATO joined nations.

    What you want are less tensions Russia-NATO and payback of Greece's debts to the EU soon. Now you can let Greece drill and by fracking provide gas, and sell it to the EU member nations as pay back. Another way is let Greece drill deeper and generate electricity from geothermic sources or energy from volcanos (Greece has nine), but the problem with the real green energy sources of nature, is that the system is going to lose power too soon (their power out of balance), but eventually oil will deplete, and waiting too long to switch from oil to the green energy sources would create chaos in the system (but a world war cannot start because the oil will be depleted at the same moment, so you could end up in some sort of Mad Max situation, but a lot of people would start their own energy production before that day is nearing to prevent going back to a stone age situation)

    Greece can go bankrupt, but the global system can go bankrupt too. Russia gas isn't inexhaustable too. You know how power works, they will never give up, as long as they can cause chaos in the world they maintain power. Greece, Russia, EU they all play the same game. They are always after an increase in chaos in society, and Greek society is making the same old mistakes too (history was always the same process), reacting to all the changes too collectively, that makes them more weaker and vulnerable by the day. It's hard to maintain a state of relative balance when there is uncertainty and chaos going on.

    It seems that the solution is that the global system must give up a littlebit of wealth to the Russians and Greeks (or to a nation that NATO trusts), to stabilize Russia and Europe (because there is enough wealth in the system, which would balance itself too by doing that, because the wealth has risen too high, too many peaks of wealth, would more equalize)

    All this complexity in the entire structure shows how chaotic the global system has become (after a century) If chaos means power, than the answer cant be order soon, but stabilisation of a situation. Because if such a process is going to fast, it will cause too much chaos in a society or system (and all the politics this brings forward increases chaos too, because communications increase)
     
  2. mihapiha

    mihapiha Active Member

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    That might be a danger indeed, but it is realistically impossible and let me explain why.

    If you personally were ever in debt to any institution and ever unable to pay back, you may have experienced that the lender usually doesn't even care about your problems. If you have experienced a bankruptcy of a company you owned that is generally amplified. The people your company owes money to, generally debate between themselves who gets what, without ever asking you. Maybe you heard of such experiences before, if you have never lived though economic problems in your life.

    The same is true for Greece. When there is a new handout to Greece to be given, or an extension of a loan, or rates of the loan to be changed, Greek people aren't asked. Greek loans are debated between the French and German financial ministers without even inviting the Greek counterpart. If Greece wants to make investments they have to ask first. Greece's situation in terms of mobility of what the can and cannot do is incredibly limited because of the countries debt.

    While I'm sure that Russia would want to aid Greece (and many other countries) in order to make them more Moscow oriented, their hands are tied, if the country is massively in debt to Germany and France, because it will be someone in Berlin and/or Paris deciding whether they can build a pipeline in Greece.

    Very few countries in the world still have the actual political freedom in terms of what they can do on their own land because of economic dependance and/or debt.
     
  3. lunecat

    lunecat Active Member

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    Bollocks, Russia promised Iceland a big bailout in 2008 when it appeared the West would abandon them the their fate. Russia did not do this despite the massive investments of dodgy Russian companies with links to the State.. So I have absolutely no doubt what so ever that Russia will provide any money to Greece.

    Russia is as bankrupt as all the other Western States. Greece has to realise as does the rest of the modern "so called Industrial World" that we are living beyond our means. Either we do away with 90% of state funded benefits, such as welfare state, health care, education or we collapse.

    Best we develop a grammer school style school education & "friends" style health care system to move on. Before we face total destruction.
     

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