Physical beauty- Objective or subjective? Cultural or universal?

If such thing as "objective beauty" does exist, I would argue it is down to mathematics (symetrics) and general signs of healthiness and vitality, but can we really get any closer to objectivity and universality than this?

Is beauty in the eye of the beholder or is there such thing as objective beauty? Is it down to cultural indoctrination or are there traits that will pass as universally attractive?

 

I would say beauty is fundamentally subjective, but most if not all beings you might (or even can) ask will have a similar subjective view. Just because something is subjective doesn't mean it's arbitrary, it just relates to observer, and when it comes to beauty, we have a very peculiar set of observers.

 

I would say beauty is fundamentally subjective, but most if not all beings you might (or even can) ask will have a similar subjective view. Just because something is subjective doesn't mean it's arbitrary, it just relates to observer, and when it comes to beauty, we have a very peculiar set of observers.

 

I believe that there are certain things that are universally considered as beautiful such as signs of youth and health. For men these "universal traits " would include signs of feminity and for women, signs of masculinity.

Afterall, man is a biological being and strives after reproducing to ensure his genepol does not die out. People are only willing to reproduce with strong and good genes. So universal beauty would be a symetrical face, body size, height and other signs of health such as skin- and hair texture.

Everything else, such as hair colour, eye colour and personality are of course subjective and cultural.

 

How do you explain all the fat and/or ugly people then?

 

Fat, underweight and ugly people have a harder time finding partners, no?

Certain traits are biologically hardwired into our brain (has to be). When it comes to the face, for men, it is all about symetry and femininity (big eyes and full lips) where as (fertile) women prefer symetry and masculine rraits (thick eye brows, strong jaw and average to above average height). Also, masculine vs feminine behavior plays a part in the game. Competeting for sexual selection is not very easy and "natural selection" will and has always had its way of sorting out the weak and "ugly".

Women are a little more complex than men and can vary in their preference depending on their age and if they are ovulating or not- fertile women tend to prefer the masculine traits.

To this comes the subjective preferences that are personally- and culturally rooted. There will always be that one person who finds x attractive while the rest of us just shake our heads in disagreement.

What all these statues from different eras such as Ancient Egypt, Ancient Greece, Ancient Rome and paintings from the 1700's all have in common is symetrical faces.

 

I don't believe this at all. I've seen great looking guys with ugly women and vice versa, so there is definitely a LOT more to it.

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If any of this was accurate, then ugly people would have been extinct and everyone would just be good looking. But there are way more ugly/fat people than good looking ones.

 

I believe evolutionary psychology has to play a part in the "dating and mating" game and try to give my amateur analysis from the perspectivebof that discipline. Unattractive women prefer more "feminine" men because they can rely on them being committed to the relationship.

Ultimately, it is the women that have the upper-hand here. You are the one's who choose.

 

Some people are ugly only because they are fat. Modern society offers crappy food and encourages unhealthy behavior. Others are ugly because of disfiguration or other signs of unhealthiness, eg people who wear glasses. Maybe ugly people exist because ugly people have always bred with other ugly people (they've had no other choice).

 

I don't know. Like I said, I've seen some good looking men with some fairly unattractive women. Do you think that maybe men would choose an unattractive mate because perhaps he thinks she would be committed to the relationship or because other men wouldn't be very interested in her?

 

But I'm saying that I've seen good looking (or at least decent looking) people with some pretty ugly partners. What gives?

 

Sounds like a legit analysis.

I am not too big-headed about our spiecies; we are animals too, we are nothing but apes.

 

Speak for yourself.

 

I think that people who would choose a mate because of such things would be very insecure people to begin with. And does personality play ANY role in your little thesis?

 

Hahaha.

But it is true!

I've seen men who have improved their "game" solely by starting working out so that they start looking healthier, stronger and more masculine. Same goes for people who wear glasses, when they wear contacts it is easier for them to compete. Although some people might actually like glasses "because it tells someone is intelligent" and that would be something that is culturally- rather than biologically founded.

 

I dated a guy who was a body builder. He was the biggest arrogant (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*). I think he ended up marrying a woman who was not very attractive.

 

I mentioned it in my opening post.

 

I had a crush on a guy (s) who was less than attractive before, because they had very attractive personalities, were funny, etc.

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I just looked and I see no mention about personality in your OP.

 

He was a c-nt and therefore went on having an unattracgive woman to be sure his partner would not leave him- She was "too ugly" to get anyone else and he was to much of a jerk to find an attractive partner.

The fact that you chose to date him kind of tells there is at least some truth to my thesis.

 

She wasn't THAT ugly. She just wasn't as pretty as me.

 

Well, this is for heterosexual humans. These are all traits of humans, and humans have a very specific outlook on some subjects, especially those that have to do with reproduction.

 

But did you actually go about to date them?

Crushes, love and romance is chemistry and selfishness; kind of like drugs. You want it because you like the kick. Lol.

Sorry, twas in my second post:

 

Looks can only get you so far, and that goes for men and women. What good is a Ferrari if there's nothing under the hood? You know?

 

I still believe there is such thing as universal beauty.

 

I don't know about that. I think there are all kinds of beauty.