Pick between $15/hr min-wage or UBI

Discussion in 'Opinion POLLS' started by wgabrie, Feb 22, 2021.

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Would you pick raising the minimum wage or issuing UBI?

  1. $15 per hour minimum wage

    1 vote(s)
    3.8%
  2. Universal Basic Income (UBI)

    7 vote(s)
    26.9%
  3. Unsure

    3 vote(s)
    11.5%
  4. No, neither!

    15 vote(s)
    57.7%
  1. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    LOL. No. Net sales is over 500 Billion.
     
  2. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Some day AI may be able to do every kind of menial task, but not for decades - probably centuries.
    In the meantime there are countless jobs that desperately need to be done by unskilled labor.
     
  3. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Government, without a large bureaucracy, can create databases and cut checks to productive workers.
    IMO, ordinary Americans should demand more of that and less of everything else from government.
     
  4. Collateral Damage

    Collateral Damage Well-Known Member

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    7ef7bed6-c48f-4687-9c82-eb104b4823a5 (costco.com)

     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2021
  5. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  6. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    I didn't move anything, wgabrie! Everything that defines the actual powers of government is rooted in the Constitution, and there is no (NO) justification whatever in the Constitution for government to determine what a worker's compensation-package should be. NONE!

    A brain-surgeon may make $100,000 an hour... a 'hash-slinger' in a greasy-spoon cafe may make QUITE a bit less than that! Is that fair? The brain-surgeon might be able to make a decent hash for dinner, but, would you want the hash-slinger performing surgery on your brain...? To repeat -- You get what you EARN in a free-market economy, based on what you KNOW and what you can DO!

    Or, ultimately, you get North Korea, Cuba, the failed Soviet Union, or, VENEZUELA. Take your pick.... :rip:
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2021
  7. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why not just leave the workers money alone? Americans need to demand less government, period!
     
  8. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    I'm under the impression that most doctors get paid a large lump sum to do their work. They are not paid by the hour. The $100,000 an hour is just so most people can relate.

    In fact, I think the "hash-slinger" probably works longer and harder than the Brain Surgeon. And, he/she probably affects the lives of more people, the customers who pass through every day to eat.

    But the Brain Surgeon might just make a small incision and be over and done within 5-7minutes. He probably also depends on a machine to do the grunt work of the actual operation. And the Surgeon might be replaced in 5-10 years by an automated machine that uses AI. Machines are learning to do this stuff on par with professionals.

    But, you probably already know this, these are just facts, so let me tell a personal anecdote. I am in the process of attempting to get a bachelor's degree. And that depends on me getting approved for financial aid from the federal government for being a low-income individual. If everything works out, I will get a degree and perhaps a good-paying job one day if I stick with it, but I didn't earn it. I just have the "privilege" of being a low-income individual. ;)
     
  9. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm truly confused by your post. I don't even know where to start.

    Congrats to you on having a five minute surgery. My shortest was a few hours.

    You aren't paying the surgeon for his time. Your paying for his 10 years of schooling and many years of internship where he was making no money.

    If surgery is truly as easy as you claim, next time you need a surgery, ask your local diner line cook to do it. ;)
     
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  10. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    Rather than argue with you, I'll simply suggest that a robot that can "sling hash" will probably go 'mainstream' before we see the robot that does brain surgery.

    Consider: that would very likely put human hash slingers out of work a LOT sooner than brain surgeons.

    The takeaway? Choose your major very carefully when you enter college -- it will have a lot of bearing on how much money you make in life!
     
  11. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Generations of Americans have had their opportunities and lives destroyed by the institutions of our Big Bad Governments at least since the Woodrow Wilson administration. Payments for damages are appropriate - especially since the perps have never been punished. Millions of ordinary Americans, especially in our urban hell holes can no longer survive let alone rise w/o government aid.

    Only productive work and a living wage can give them a ways out and up. That and replacing the entire obsolete education system should be the highest priorities for any opposition political movement that wants the power, size and cost of government to ever shrink without a massive economic collapse.
     
  12. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If I earn a dollar the the government leaves it alone, I have a dollar. By the time my dollar makes its way through the government, I am lucky to get 30 cents. The way up is through opportunity. Government only hinders opportunity.

    I grew up poor and actually ate government cheese. (Not bad BTW!) If I wanted something, I had to find a way to get it. I dumpster dove for recyclables, sold drawings door to door, and learned to paint address numbers on curbs to make a buck. I even worked in a bicycle shop for less than minimum wage and learned how to make repairs and deal with customers.

    If government gave me money, I would have never learned to provide for myself. The same animal can be a hunter or a pet.
     
  13. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    The brain surgery robot is already here! The Neuralink robot. :)


    Anyway, I'm going to get a computer science degree that is a cross between business administration and the usual tech stuff. I'll be able to do the usual tech stuff but also lead a team. :)
     
  14. Collateral Damage

    Collateral Damage Well-Known Member

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    Think what happened when xray machines came along. The poor chap who had to hold a sheet of paper up and a large light behind the patient, then draw pictures of where he thought bones were was out of a job.

    *Humor!!!!
     
  15. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    People who want to keep more of their money, and that should be virtually everyone, should support policies that could eliminate the bottomless pit of ignorance and urgent need that has been created to justify the existence of Big Government and its destructive policies.
     
    Curious Always likes this.
  16. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That can only be achieved when the percentage of those contributing to the workforce decreases to the tipping point. As long as people are comfortable living on handouts, they will not change.
     
  17. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Almost all human beings will choose to join the productive work force if that is a viable option.
     
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  18. Turin

    Turin Well-Known Member

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    Wrong.

    I have AI right now in my work environment automating the day to day menial tasks of like 10 people. We spent about 200k on the software / hardware and another 100k on the support contract. Using this AI, we have been able to totally eliminate 10 positions from the company. And that is just one tiny microcosm. We are of course, looking to expand the use of AI heavily.

    AI is already doin incredibly complex AND menial tasks everywhere.

    Just look at the AI written to land the mars rover as another example.
     
  19. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Prove it. Take your $200K AI to Baltimore and tell it to clean up the alleys.

    https://www.wbaltv.com/article/scot...est-baltimore-president-donald-trump/28611545
     
  20. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    Wow! What industry are you in? We could use some AI automation at the Family business if it's any good. Feel free to contact me either here or in a private conversation. :)
     
  21. Turin

    Turin Well-Known Member

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  22. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    There is an army of unemployed Americans in all of our urban hell holes ready to clean up the wreckage for a living wage.
     
  23. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So why aren't they doing it now?
     
  24. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Current minimum wage laws.
     
  25. Doofenshmirtz

    Doofenshmirtz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How so?
     

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