'Possible irregularities' in absentee ballots holding up congressional election result in North Car

Ballot harvesting is not voter fraud.

 

Ballot harvesting breaks the ballot "chain of custody" which means the ballot no longer has any integrity.

Ballot harvesting allows voter fraud to take place.

California's elections no longer have any integrity.

 

"allowing voter fraud to take place" is not the same as "voter fraud." Let me know when you find proof that voter fraud actually took place in California - as this thread has done in reference to the voter fraud that actually took place for the Republican in North Carolina's 9th.

 

There is no ballot integrity with ballot harvesting.

That's why ballot harvesting in a felony in many states.

Would you trust a stranger to deliver your ballot to the county registrar of voters ?

 

If I was too busy or incapable of delivering the ballot myself, I would be happy to learn that my ballot stood a significant chance of being counted.

 

Then you shouldn't be voting if there was something more important than going down to your precinct polling place and casting your ballot.

 

Leslie McCrae Dowless has been attached to numerous North Carolina Republican campaigns throughout the years, including the Harris campaign in 2018.

It's remarkable how some eagerly swallow evidence-free hysteria of voter fraud such as Lyin' Don pulling 3-5 million invisible bogus voters out of his butt, yet seem passionately indifferent to an actual case of evidence justifying an official, bipartisan inquiry into voter fraud.

Desperate diversions and ideological fantasies aside, this one is real.

"Republicans don’t win and that’s because of potentially illegal votes!
When people get in line that have absolutely no right to vote
and they go around in circles. Sometimes they go to their car,
put on a different hat, put on a different shirt,
come in and vote again!"


"EVIDENCE?
We don't need no stinkin' 'EVIDENCE'!"​

 

...why?

 

Should people get twisted when the lame duck North Carolina Republicans attempt to pass a bill that will effectively ensure that a Republican chairs all future county election boards during election years?

Just in time to scuttle the investigation that you mention rational people should want to conclude?

 

This whole thing just leads credence to TDS or RDS(Republican derangement syndrome.) If they can prove that this dude falsified over 1,000 signatures then be my guest. In reality, Democrats would love to increase their house majority even if by one more seat.

It's frustrating because Democrats did absolutely NOTHING to deserve the mid-term votes. All they did for two years was cry that Trump's a criminal. We also know we have the same failed ideas as 2010. I hope the POTUS finally whips out the veto pen. He's going to need it. That and the Republican Senate.

Until the Dems come up with something, anything new we don't need to implement policies we already know failed us eight years ago.

 

No, I don't think they should get twisted.

You forget, I live in California, where such maneuvers are cheered by Progressives as savvy political moves. Ballot Harvesting?

Besides, explain what laws were broken by attempting to pass such a bill.

I'll look forward to your brief on that....

 

"Such moves" would require that California Democrats pass laws in a lame duck session just before a California Republican came into power. When was the last time that happened? And you dont actually think that ballot harvesting is a remotely analogous situation.

And no, they are not breaking any laws to change the law. But it would make sense that your only requirement for thinking a politician was acting appropriately would be to ask whether they are acting legally.

It is the only defense that you have remaining to justify the assertion that trump is acting appropriately despite his unethical and immoral behavior.

 

So your position is that once a Legislature is in a lame duck session, they should stop doing their jobs?

That's an interesting demand.

Personally, I believe that a person acting within the limits of the law is a pretty good standard to judge their actions by.

I may not like what those actions are, but objectively, it allows me to remain credible, rather than abandoning it, and spinning into ginned up ideological outrage.

 

You are the one who made the claim that California Democrats routinely engage in this behavior. I asked you to give an example of a lame duck California democratic Congress weakening the powers of an incoming California republican.

And it is a pretty weak standard considering that the legislators are largely in control of writing the standards by which you would decide their actions.

 

Of course Progressives running California engage in the behavior you're outraged over. How do you think they passed the Ballot Harvesting scam? How do you think they passed what was at the time the World's most aggressive Climate laws. Ever heard of Gut and Amend?

http://www.capoliticalreview.com/to...slators-gut-and-amend-is-gutless-and-abusive/

As legislators race to pass bills before the deadline, the powerful take unrelated bills and replace them with completely different bills. Then, in the last-minute frenzy, they try to rush them through the last steps with minimal scrutiny (e.g., it is not unusual for there to be multiple different committee hearings in one room in an hour). A sharper contrast with the “good government” civics illustration is hard to imagine.
​

You know why Progressive follow this tactic? Because the State Constitution forbids the Legislature to pass bills that haven't been through committee. By taking an unrelated Bill that has been through committee, and gutting and amending it, they get around this provision designed to allow the public to respond. Typical Progressive totalitarian action.

But you're attempt to pigeon hole the example is rather weak. Progressives have made it so it's likely going to be many generations before a Republican holds any meaningful office in California.

But to the point of your outrage, I asked you what laws were being violated, and you launched into a screed about ethics and morality.

Perhaps you should ponder the concept of credibility when you're trying to argue a point.

 

There is zero good reason that people who win elections can't take their positions the next day. There is similarly zero reason why people who lose elections should retain their position for one day more than it takes them to walk out the door. We are no longer in the C18th. Once the voters have spoken it is time to leave. Well functioning democracies the world over manage it without problems. No reason America can't do the same.

While you are at it, set up non-partisan electoral commissions for every state so that the people running for office don't get to oversee the process that puts them in power. Again, this happens all over the democratic world without issue. Nothing so special about the US that it can't happen there.

I have just witnessed an election in my home state where counting is ongoing almost two weeks after the vote and some seats have come down to a few dozen or a few hundred votes. There are no cries of 'conspiracy', no stupid partisan politics and no concern that the result might not be accurate. The process is non-partisan and transparent. This was not always the case, but we got sick of political parties gerrymandering & trying to skew results, so we fixed the problem. No reason America can't do the same.

 

Partisan sour grapes aside, this is looking like a real case of voter fraud.

 

Neither of your examples are relevant because neither are analogous to the situation in North Carolina, Michigan, or Wisconsin. In all of those states a party leaving power, in a lame duck session, passed laws to deprive power and authority from the incoming politicians.

Gut and amend is a practice that occurs across the nation, in state and federal, and is conducted by both parties.

And I launch into a diatribe about ethics and morality because those are also measures for politicians. They are subjective, but they exist for a reason. If you wish to solely rely on legality as your standard, then you have to live with the limits of using that standard to evaluate the people who help decide what is legal.

And seriously ocean, you dont think I have credibility. I get it. I dont think you have credibility either, but I dont say that in every post. Please dont repeat your belief in that point (or make backhanded remarks like dismissing my intellect or morals due to the fact that I am merely a progressive) for every post.

I will just ignore you if you continue. And you are one of the lone trumpettes that I enjoy debating because your posts demonstrate a skill of rhetoric, language and knowledge.

 

My examples are completely relevant, and you emotional response to legal actions is your cross to bare, not mine.

And you think Gut and Replace is used by both parties across the Nation in State and Federal? Really? Care to prove that?

You throw out stuff that I don't know where you get it, and then question why I call your credibility into question. That's all we got on this site. Want to be taken seriously? Then you've got to have some degree of credibility.

And you are always welcome to carry through with your threat.

 

Fair enough.

 

My responses to your outrage over the 9th District in NC are based on your claims it's evidence of Republicans engaging in voter fraud in general, something you're implying is universal. It's one District out of 13.

I've written that if laws were broken, then the people responsible should be held accountable.

However, this attempt to say this politically driven harvesting shows Republicans are into voter suppression as a policy is disingenuous. I've shown this exact process has been codified by Progressives in California, in the quiet. If Ballot Harvesting is a sign of Republican voter suppression, why is it not viewed the same way when practiced by Progressives in California?

As to actions taken in lame duck sessions, I've asked what's illegal about it? Nothing. You think it's another example of Republican malfeasance that is outrageous and unethical. Ok. There are lots of things legislatures do that many believe are outrageous and unethical. As an example, I presented a process Progressives use in California

That example involved what Progressives do in California via Gut and Replace, which allows the Progressives to create laws in the dark of night at the last minute, and thwart citizen input. I even provided a link that discusses it. Most would view that as outrageous and unethical. You're response? It's done all over the country. No outrage or claims about ethics on your part. As a result, I've questioned your credibility on these subjects as it relates to the big picture.

So what have I got wrong here MrTLegal? I've addressed every point with a relevant argument.

Apparently that is a problem for you, so you make the threat you will ignore me. That's your right. I won't be ignoring you.

 

Attempted diversions are a common ploy for avoidance, of course, but this is an actual instance of a state elections board refusing to certify an ostensible winner due to an compelling amount of evidence of voter fraud perpetrated by a Republican operative in a pattern that may well date back to previous elections in North Carolina.

Fake claims of voter fraud abound, even ludicrous ravings that there are folks who vote, go outside and change hats, and vote again, repeatedly. (If that was the alleged modus operandi of the fanciful 3-5 million who all voted the same way in the 2016 presidential election, haberdashers must be thriving in sales well beyond those cheesy red cult caps.)

These and other silly distractions cannot be allowed to derail realty.

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Investigators are examining whether Leslie McCrae Dowless, a longtime Bladen County operative who worked for a consultant to the Harris campaign, and a group of people loosely connected to him gathered unsealed absentee ballots, marked those ballots for their candidate, sealed them and signed as witnesses. North Carolina requires witnesses to sign absentee ballots. Usually, those witnesses are family members or friends and ballots are not supposed to be handled by a third party.

They are also investigating the possibility that absentee ballots were gathered in areas considered to be supportive of McCready but never turned in.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/cortn...g-in-north-carolina-over-voter-fraud-n2537064

​

 

The voter fraud scandal in North Carolina had the head of the Republican Party there initially attempting a Cesar "False Flag" Seyoc denial before the truth emerged.

EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE NC REPUBLICAN PARTY DALLAS WOODHOUSE
TOUCHING A MEMBER OF THE U S ARMED FORCES​

(Seyoc was the Trump fanatic who sent pipe bombs to prominent Democrats, and GOP bloviators Limbaugh, Dobbs, Savage, Coulter, De Sousa and others quickly joined with other hyper-partisan crackpot conspiracists in a baseless attempt to transfer blame to Democrats.)

​

 

Be careful what crimes you commit and project onto others.

We've heard the relentless, baseless bellywhinging about "Voter Fraud!"

Meet the real McCoy:

​

 

And now, the Democrat Dan McCready has withdrawn his concession just as voting irregularities have begun to appear in a second county from this election.

In the words of Nate Silver, this election should be changed from "Leans R" to "Leans Prison."