Quantum Physics Experiment Suggests That Reality Isn’t Objective

Discussion in 'Science' started by wgabrie, Mar 15, 2019.

  1. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    It turns out that two observers can witness the same something while both seeing two conflicting events and both will be right. Wow! Well, there goes the idea that you can use eye witness testimony to convict a criminal. Two conflicting realities exist in the same universe.

    And maybe Trump really did see Muslims dancing in the streets and others didn't . But maybe they're both correct???

    Quantum Physics Experiment Suggests That Reality Isn’t Objective
    https://futurism.com/quantum-physics-experiment-reality-objective
     
  2. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    I reject this categorically on the basis of the empiricism of measurement.
     
  3. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    LOL! Did you choose that outcome???
     
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  4. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    I don't think bald-faced lies are included in this hypothesis. ;)
     
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  5. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Objectivity removes personal beliefs, emotions, feelings and instead reviews facts. If two people observing something are truly objective in their analysis, they will more than likely find agreement. 'Witnessing' is not the same as being objective. The root problem lies in most people not having the capability or interest to be objective. Lastly, there is no such thing as 'objectivity' in Trump world...
     
  6. Blaster3

    Blaster3 Well-Known Member

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    all that proves is that those mit characters are freagin braindead... spent all that bs to say they agree with what was already known decades ago... left/libbies are baffoons and shouldn't be allowed to wander around without supervision...
     
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  7. Gelecski7238

    Gelecski7238 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    From the URL: The experiment involves two people observing a single photon, the smallest quantifiable unit of light that can act as either a particle or a wave under different conditions. The photon can exist in one of two alignments, but until the moment someone actually measures it to determine which, the photon is said to exist in a superposition — both conditions are true at the same time.

    Is this a load of misleading propaganda? When the photon is assessed by the first person, decoherence sets in and the photon is no longer in superposition. The second person sees the photon in the same condition as the first. Also, I would like to know how a person can perceive a single photon. The macroworld and the subatomic microworld are not interchangeable. Equipment performance cannot be substituted for the effect of human participation because of the awareness factor causing decoherence. Measurement by equipment does not cause decoherence if the data obtained is erased before it is perceived by a human.

    If instead the meaning of "a single photon" is a different photon for each observer then there is some randomness of outcome, and the effect of the second photon may not be precisely identical to the first. Still, the machinery registering the effect of the microworld is not equivalent to observation of reality by humans in the macroworld. There are no two conflicting realities experienced by the witnesses. Objective physical reality is objective.
     
  8. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Maybe the reason the wave function did not collapse is because they used wave interference to measure it, which does not actually physically affect the photon in any way (although it could result in entanglement into the overall system).

    Another possibility is that the interference at the measuring import induced a [normally unlikely] change in the system via entanglement. In this case the measurement may have been too strong to carry out an accurate experiment.
    No, the laws of physics do not get violated, it would just cause entanglement to leak out of the system at some point, so the experiment would fail.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2019
  9. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    A fundamental principle of Quantum Mechanics: When a measurement is made on a system, the system exists in a unique state a the time of the measurement and immediately thereafter. But it then returns to a superposition of Eigenstates.

    In regards to the report: As I read this, the measurements are not made simultaneously, but sequentially. So there is nothing new here. There is no unique polarization until a measurement is made. Then, no unique polarization exists until the next measurement is made. This is consistent with a fundamental premise of QM.

    There is nothing to see here. Move along.

    It was shown by Bell that there cannot be any hidden variables for an entangled pair of particles, giving them a unique or "original" Eigenstate. No unique state exists until measured. So it logically follows that after a measurement, there are no hidden variables and no unique state exists.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  10. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Do you know if that's ever been demonstrated to be true when the measurement was made via wave function entanglement and not actual particle-particle interaction?

    I mean we measured the ghost wave with another ghost wave, and observed the statistical correlation on one of the resulting particles to imply information about the other particle, even though the two particles never physically interacted.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2019
  11. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    As yet, Quantum Mechanics has never been wrong. It is the most successful theory in the history of science. The entire world of electronics depends on it being correct. And the mentioned premise is at the core.

    And I don't even know what you said. ;) They made measurements on the system as we do in any system.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2019
  12. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We've seen those type of attitudes shattered in the past.

    There are always subtleties we do not understand, and when the observations do not fit with established theory, it leads to new theories.
    It might be that the current understanding of Quantum mechanics will need to be tweaked.

    Experiments are never wrong; our interpretation of them are.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2019

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