Question for Holocaust Deniers

Discussion in 'Conspiracy Theories' started by Ronstar, Jun 19, 2019.

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  1. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I already answered that question in my Post # 100 in addition to asking you to support your fantastic figures.

    Additionally, I don't know if you're talking about "Mischlings" or full Jews.

    If there were 4 million "missing Jews", I don't see why they would not be among the millions of other people who were displaced by WW 2.

    Thanks to "Scott", I did just read that an indeterminate number of Jews were admitted to the U.S. in 1944 -1945:

    http://vho.org/GB/Books/thottc/5.html
    EXCERPT "The American Jewish yearbook gave a net Jewish immigration for the years 1938-1943 and 1946-1949 (inclusive) of 232,191.[24] Figures for 1944 and 1945 do not seem to be available. It was in those two years, incidentally, that an indeterminate number of Jews were admitted to the U.S. "outside of the regular immigration procedure." CONTINUED
     
  2. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nonsense.

    The quotas on Jewish immigration were not lifted until 1968.

    And no, 4 million Jews did not migrate to the USA from Europe after WW2. Nor did such numbers go to Israel.

    You have no evidence of such events taking place, nor will you ever...as it did not happen.
     
  3. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    While overall immigration into the United States did not increase, between 35,000–40,000 DPs, most of whom were Jewish, entered the United States between December 22, 1945, and July 1, 1948, under provisions of the Truman Directive.

    Approximately 80,000 Jewish DPs entered the United States between 1948 and 1952 under the Displaced Persons Act.

    The 1953 Refugee Relief Act defined “refugee” (someone in a non-Communist country fleeing persecution), “escapee” (someone fleeing communism), and “expellee" (an ethnic German forced out of Eastern Europe). The act allowed approximately 190,000 refugees, escapees, and expellees to arrive in the United States before the legislation expired in 1956.



    so yeah, any concept that millions of jews came to the USA after WW2 is utter nonsense.

    as for going to Israel, only 2.2 million European Jews have moved to Israel between 1949 and 2012, and more than 800,000 of them came from the USSR after 1990. Most of the rest were the 300,000 Jews remaining in Poland and 300,000 Jews from Romania. And there are now barely any Jews left in these nations.

    so yeah, arguing that the missing 4.5 million Jews of Poland ended up in the USA or Israel is total garbage.
     
  4. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, your recently discovered blueprints are not legitimate.

    According to Prof. Robert Jan van Pelt, they are of a future camp not yet built.
    Additionally, van Pelt confirms that the rooms marked as "gas chambers" were in reality the defumigation chambers:


    "Auschwitz Expert: Blueprints Found in Berlin Not of Death Camp"
    https://www.haaretz.com/1.5056721

    EXCERPT "Prof. Robert Jan van Pelt, a internationally acknowledged expert on the planning and construction of Auschwitz,...

    Van Pelt said he also doubted the authenticity of the signature of the SS chief, Heinrich Himmler, since such a high-ranking officer would not have signed such plans, and none of the copies he had ever seen bore such a signature.

    Van Pelt also said the words "gas chamber" on one of the drawings meant a room in which disinfection of clothing was done by means of gas, and that the sketch is not of an extermination camp established in 1942, but rather of earlier plans for a huge concentration camp in which a force of 130,000 slave laborers was intended to work.

    Van Pelt suggested the plans might be fakes, motivated by the lucrative market in Nazi memorabilia and documents."CONTINUED

    Please note that he, too confirms that there is a "...lucrative market in Nazi memorabilia and documents."
     
  5. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I never said that 4.5 million Jews went to the US or Israel.

    I accounted for the "4.5 missing Jews" you mentioned in my Post # 100.

    Furthermore, you have not clarified if you are counting full Jews or "Mischlings" (aka mixed Jews)
     
  6. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Mischlinge are not Jews I am talking about Jews. more than four and a half million Jews were in Poland during the war and after the war only 300,000 remained.

    And you have no explanation about where they went. That's because they were murdered during the war.
     
  7. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, I already accounted for the "missing Jews" you mention in my Post # 100 just as I showed where van Pelt, an internationally acknowledged expert on the planning and construction of Auschwitz rejects your newly found drawings as most likely fake and considers Auschwitz's "gas chambers" to be defumigation / delousing chambers.(1)

    Once again, you have provided no source for your fantastic numbers that have been debunked by "Scott's" sources.

    If as many people were executed as you suggest, there would be an enormous amount of very obvious skeletal & dental remains as has been the case with all other genocides.
    Before you can prove a genocide took place, you have to show a commensurate number of bodies yet after over 70 years of searching, only a handful have been found and many of those are entirely unrelated to the holocaust.

    Finally, there is a $100,000- reward(2) for anyone who can account for a tiny fraction of those "missing Jews".
    They simply converted to a "safer" religion, joined murderous monsters like Solomon Morel or became among the millions of other DPs (Displaced Persons) throughout Europe.



    (1) "Auschwitz Expert: Blueprints Found in Berlin Not of Death Camp"
    https://www.haaretz.com/1.5056721

    EXCERPT "Prof. Robert Jan van Pelt, a internationally acknowledged expert on the planning and construction of Auschwitz...

    Van Pelt also said the words "gas chamber" on one of the drawings meant a room in which disinfection of clothing was done by means of gas, and that the sketch is not of an extermination camp established in 1942, but rather of earlier plans for a huge concentration camp in which a force of 130,000 slave laborers was intended to work.

    Van Pelt suggested the plans might be fakes, motivated by the lucrative market in Nazi memorabilia and documents."CONTINUED


    (2) "THE HOLOCAUST ARCHAEOLOGY HOAX"
    http://www.nafcash.com/

    EXCERPT "It is alleged in orthodox historiography that; during WW II - hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of corpses were buried in numerous “huge mass graves” at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II. However, despite all the deceptive allegations to the contrary, the truth is; the largest (in terms of quantity of remains) of the - one hundred - graves / cremation pits that are alleged to have been scientifically proven to currently exist at these sites, in which verified human remains have been tangibly located via bona fide, verifiably honest and conclusively documented archaeology; contained the remains of - ONLY SIX PEOPLE.

    Those who believe they can refute any statement of fact articulated on this web page are invited to accept

    THE HOLOCAUST ARCHAEOLOGY HOAX CHALLENGE

    $100,000.00 REWARD

    For proving - just 1 / 1,000 of 1% - of the criminally fraudulent buried remains allegations" CONTINUED
     
  8. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They defumigated them to death. You probably even deny what Rudolf Hoss, the Auschwitz commander wrote about exterminations or that his deputy was the first one to experiment murdering captives with Zyclon B.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019
  9. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No legitimate court of law accepts tortured testimony ( i.e. Hoess's).

    If millions of people were gassed, at least one "eyewitness" would have noted the most striking symptom of death by cyanide which is cherry red skin. (1), (2).


    (1) "Johns Hopkins"
    http://www.centerforhealthsecurity.org/our-work/publications/cyanide-fact-sheet
    EXCERPT
    "Signs and Symptoms

    Other: acute lung injury, nausea and vomiting, cherry-red skin color."CONTINUED


    (2) "Cyanide Toxicity"
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK507796/

    EXCERPT "Patients with cyanide poisoning will not be cyanotic but will have a cherry red color due to excess oxygen in the bloodstream."CONTINUED
     
  10. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thanks for proving my point.
     
  11. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How many Polish Jews were transported to Stalin's forced labor camps? Has anyone ever checked into that? After all, Russia occupied about half of Poland in 1939.
    Hundreds of thousands of Poles were shipped Eastwards and many died of the strain and starvation. Certainly, among them were lots of Jews as well. The concentration camps didn't start until about 1942.

    1939 — II WORLD WAR — GERMANY AND RUSSIA INVADE POLAND.

    Here is he story of a deported Polish family:

    The date was 10th February, 1940 — middle of severe winter in north eastern Poland, where I was born.
    ~ ~
    On the date of 10th February, 1940, some 218,000 people were forcefully deported from Eastern Poland, and with further deportations during the year, this figure rose to almost 2,000,000.
    As I mentioned previously, we were then crowded into almost unheated cattle trucks, and started our journey into the depths of Russia, which lasted about three weeks, as on occasions were shunted backwards and forwards, and during the course of which, a great number of people died either from exhaustion or were lost in transit. The journey was an inhuman nightmare.
    ~ ~
    There was no supply of water either for drinking or washing. Now and then the train would stop, and so during those stops, those who managed to pack kettles or pots, would gather snow into these containers,...

    We were brought into a region called Czelabinskaja Oblosc to a place called Czepajewka posiolek — hard labour camp. Thousands and thousands of other Poles were strewn from the arctic circle in the north (Archangel) to the extremes of Syberia, European Russia, Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Kirgystan, and other places, and set to work, in appalling conditions, felling forest trees, transporting and working timber, or, as my father, working in mines.
    ...
    Families housed in communal barracks had to endure indescribable living conditions, when people were dying every day from a variety of causes.
    The over-riding feeling was that of perpetual hunger and fear.
    To say that hygienic conditions of our living quarters were less than primitive is to make a gross overstatement. They were so bad that we were continually covered in lice and bedbugs. One day I saw my father’s shirt lying on the floor actually move with crawling lice.
    ...
    People were dying like flies. This was due to the inhuman condition in which we lived — severe frost, hunger, fear, lack of any medical attention and hard work — causing all kinds of illnesses.
    (No Zyklon B??)
    ....
    Hope came in July, 1941. Due to Germany attacking Russia on 22nd June, l941, a Polish-Russian treaty was signed with the exiled Polish Government in London, and a decree of “amnesty” was issued, allowing for the formation of Polish army on Russian territory with the recruiting point at Buzuluk, in the southern European Russia. Thousands of Poles took advantage of this, although not all managed to get out, because news did not reach them in time, before Stalin stopped it.
    ....
    My brother Gustaf and I were herded into what became known as “orphanages”, separating boys from girls. Thus we all became separated from each other, and I remember crying myself to sleep every night, as it was the first time in my life that I was apart from my mother and the rest of the family.

    In an effort to improve hygienic conditions in the newly formed “orphanages”, our heads were shaved and we were de-loused with some solution. Nevertheless, red and common dysentery raged. My brother Alfons, I later learned, went down with typhus,...
    The death rate rose even higher than in the gulags.
    I was just a skeleton, simply skin and bones, and I lost touch with my family for quite a while.
    ....

    Some months later we the “orphans” and civilians were moved to Uzbekistan to a place called Guzar. It was here that I went down with severe dysentery and it was here that dead bodies were found in water wells.
    ....

    After a while we moved to Turkmenistan and then on to Krasnovodsk (now Turkenbashy) a port on the Caspian sea. There we boarded a ship where we were exposed to more appalling conditions. The ship was small and we were squeezed practically like sardines. Sanitary conditions again were almost non-existent. ... Some children were so weak that they could not get up and queue for the toilet. The resultant stench was horrendous. My eyes' condition made things so much worse for me — and it was thus that I awoke next morning to find a body on top of me.
    ...
    A short while later, we boarded buses and were driven high up through Elburz Mountains, at break-neck speed (drivers often being drunk) through hairpin bends to Tehran. There were a lot of accidents, where buses unable to take a bend simply rolled into the ravine below.
    ....
    In due course, my mother and I, along with thousands of other children and their mothers, were moved to Ahvaz on the Persian Gulf. Whilst waiting for a boat to take us to India, we were housed in horse stable.


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ww2peopleswar/stories/83/a7652883.shtml
    -----------
    I wonder how many Jews were among the 2 million Poles?
    Does anyone have some information about this particular aspect of the "Holocaust"?
    Not all Jews were gassed by the Nazis!!
     
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  12. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    you have zero evidence to support your idea that at least 4.5 million Jews converted to Christianity or fled to the USSR.

    just baseless, silly speculation
     
  13. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  14. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    this thread is about the Holocaust.

    please stay on topic.
     
  15. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    about 250,000 Jews were sent from Soviet-occupied Poland to the USSR.

    but as we know the Nazis defied the Nazi-Soviet Friendship pact and invaded deep into Russia
     
  16. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The first camp, Dachau, was opened in 33 for political opponents and union organizers. The SS took control of camps in 34-35 and changed the role to hold undesirables which included Jews, Roms, Soviet POWs, etc. It wasn't until 42 that they started building extermination camps like Treblinka. An extermination section was built into Auschwitz Birkenau concentration work camp and became the largest extermination camp of them all killing the most as those that could not work were sent directly to the gas chambers, mostly women, children, and the elderly.
     
  17. AltLightPride

    AltLightPride Well-Known Member

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    Stalin targeted political opponents for labor camps, not Jews.

    Jews were a few percent of the Polish population, so I don't see why they wouldn't be a few percent of the people sent to the Gulags as well.

    So you get a few percent of 2 million. Really nothing comparable to around 3 millions of polish Jews missing.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2019
  18. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Denying the holocaust is vile. Calling ICE detention centers 'concentration camps' is stupidly dishonest and trivializes the victims of such.
     
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  19. Scott

    Scott Well-Known Member

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    Have you heard this speech of Hitler's?

    Adolf Hitler Explains His Reasons For Invading The Soviet Union


    He told the people it was a preemptive strike. I don't rule out the possibility that he was lying but its being true can't be ruled out. The fact that this historical speech is hidden from the American people is also very telling; Americans are taught that the German people had taking over the world in mind as they were fighting. If there's one lie, there might be more.

    Here's some more stuff for you to check out.

    http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v19/v19n6p40_Michaels.html
    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Who+Started+World+War+II?+by+Viktor+Suvorov&sm=12
     
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  20. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    this discussion is about the Holocaust.
     
  21. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And you have zero evidence that your inflated number of "missing Jews" did not convert to Christianity, migrate to Palestine, the US and other countries or join the other millions of D.P.s (Displaced Persons) throughout Europe.

    Where ever they went, they were not executed and buried at any of the Reinhard camps:


    "THE HOLOCAUST ARCHAEOLOGY HOAX"
    http://www.nafcash.com/

    EXCERPT "It is alleged in orthodox historiography that; during WW II - hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of corpses were buried in numerous “huge mass graves” at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II. However, despite all the deceptive allegations to the contrary, the truth is; the largest (in terms of quantity of remains) of the - one hundred - graves / cremation pits that are alleged to have been scientifically proven to currently exist at these sites, in which verified human remains have been tangibly located via bona fide, verifiably honest and conclusively documented archaeology; contained the remains of - ONLY SIX PEOPLE.

    Those who believe they can refute any statement of fact articulated on this web page are invited to accept

    THE HOLOCAUST ARCHAEOLOGY HOAX CHALLENGE

    $100,000.00 REWARD

    For proving - just 1 / 1,000 of 1% - of the criminally fraudulent buried remains allegations" CONTINUED
     
  22. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    One cannot discuss the holocaust without discussing the much larger WW 2 that, for example, affected Germany's ability to supply the various camps with food, medicine, coal/coke etc.

    The reason for the rampant starvation & typhus deaths especially toward the end of the war was due to the destruction of German railroads and related infrastructure, not a genocidal policy since no order for a Final Solution exists or existed:

    “To the present day a written order by Hitler regarding the destruction of the European Jewish community has not been found, and, in all probability, this order was never given.”

    - Walter Laqueur, Was niemand wissen wollte: Die Unterdruckung der Nachrichten uber Hitlers Endlösung (What Nobody Wanted to Know: The Suppression of News About Hitler’s “Final Solution”), (Berlin-Vienna, 1981), p.190


    Without WW 2, Germany could have better supplied the camps and dramatically reduced the death toll.

    Additionally, it is alleged that the Nazis were "hyper racists" however Hitler's armies were far more diverse & widely integrated than the armies of the Western Allies(1) with Jews as high ranking members of the Nazi party(2) and about 150,000 full & mixed Jews reaching some of the highest ranks in Germany's WW 2 military.(3)

    It is indisputable that many Jews were among those who were persecuted but with Jews in the Nazi party itself and Jews composing some of Germany's highest ranking officers, it is clear that not all Jews were persecuted and the Nazis did not adhere to the Nuremberg race laws which were crafted under the influence of the German Zionist Federation with their obsession in maintaining Jewish racial purity.



    (1) "Adolf Hitler’s Armed Forces: A Triumph for Diversity?"
    https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/1/3/3102

    EXCERPTS " I ask those historians who still believe that Hitler and the Nazis were “white supremacists”: how do you account for the incredible degree of non-German and ethnic minority (i.e., 150,000 Jews and Jewish Mischlinge) collaboration during World War II? Again, some two million non-Germans helped the Nazis.

    The important thing to realize is that had the Nazis been as racist as most historians have argued, then they could not possibly have garnered the immeasurable level of support that they did.

    Even after Stalingrad; Spaniards, Slavs, Franks, and tens of- thousands of other non-Germans continued to fight for the Nazis on a volunteer basis. Frenchmen and Arab volunteers gave their lives in the final fight for the capital of Berlin in 1945. Hitler continued to allow thousands of Jewish men to serve, and many did so with incredible tenacity and valor. "CONTINUED


    (2) "List of Nazis of non-Germanic descent"
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nazis_of_non-Germanic_descent

    EXCERPT "Notably, there were several high-ranking Nazis of Jewish descent."CONTINUED


    (3) "Hitler's Jewish Soldiers"
    https://www.amazon.com/Hitlers-Jewish-Soldiers-Descent-Military/dp/0700613587


    EXCERPT "Contrary to conventional views, Rigg reveals that a startlingly large number of German military men were classified by the Nazis as Jews or "partial-Jews" (Mischlinge), in the wake of racial laws first enacted in the mid-1930s. Rigg demonstrates that the actual number was much higher than previously thought-perhaps as many as 150,000 men, including decorated veterans and high-ranking officers, even generals and admirals."CONTINUED
     
  23. AltLightPride

    AltLightPride Well-Known Member

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    Are your serious?

    Your argument is literally that there was no Holocaust because Hitler didn't write a paper that says "I, Adolf Hitler, hereby order you to conduct mass genocide"???

    You do realize how utterly stupid it is to sign your name on such a paper, right?
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2019
  24. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sorta like a soldier shooting a Jew in the head and having pictures and videos of it but then not believing it because the soldier said he didn't do it.
     
  25. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    no, the reason for the rampant starvation and typhus in the camps is because millions of Jewish civilians were illegally put into camps and ghettos!!!!!

    the German civilians forced to go into the camps and look at the dead bodies weren't starving, they looked healthy. But the dead Jews looked like skeletons
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2019

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