Ralph Schoenman's Lecture on the Kennedy Assassination

It was fact which you have failed to challenge with the exception of his hardship discharge

 

So we're back to you claiming he "waded through red tape to get to Russia"?

After you got you ass kicked on that claim?

 

I never made that claim.

You have consistently got it wrong.

He spent months wading through red tape to return from the ussr with his wife.

 

my goodness, haven't visited these conspiracy threads in a while and i see the same guys using youtube and known wackos was evidence to support these nonsense conspiracy theories.

 

Not to mention that despite his suspicious past, Oswald was hooked up with CIA insider George DeMorinchild who was a close associate of GHW Bush. Bush's private number was found in DeMorinchild's phone book after his suspicious suicide. Oswald was obviously a CIA tool used as a decoy in the JFK assassination. One of our greatest presidents was murdered by US government insiders because he was about to expose them for their traitorous actions. After the Bay Of Pigs fiasco created by the scumbag Dulles brothers and their stooges in the CIA, JFK read between the lines and promised to break the traitorous CIA into a thousand pieces. He then fired Allen Dulles. Shortly thereafter a plot was hatched by these traitors to murder the President.

 

Over 70% of Americans and an even greater percentage worldwide are aware that there as a definite conspiracy to kill President Kennedy and that the official Warren Commssion report was a gross cover up. The only whacks are the small percentage who believe the obviously ridiculous official, "lone nut gunman" theory.

 

Dude, don't you know that they even wrote great literature on this subject??? For example Don DeLillo's Libra, which according to prominent literary critic, Harold Bloom, is one of the greatest works of literature of all time???? Here is the list by Bloom; see if you can find Libra???

http://sonic.net/~rteeter/grtbloom.html

https://www.amazon.com/Western-Canon-Books-School-Ages/dp/1573225142/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1471887483&sr=1-1&keywords=the+western+canon

[video=youtube;wdHlm8oKEpE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdHlm8oKEpE[/video]

In this powerful, eerily convincing fictional speculation on the assassination of John F. Kennedy, Don DeLillo chronicles Lee Harvey Oswald's odyssey from troubled teenager to a man of precarious stability who imagines himself an agent of history. When "history" presents itself in the form of two disgruntled CIA operatives who decide that an unsuccessful attempt on the life of the president will galvanize the nation against communism, the scales are irrevocably tipped.
______________________________ ______________________________ ______________________________ ______________________________ ______________________________ ____________________________

Excerpts from Libra:

"When is your birthday?" [Clay] Shaw said first thing.

"October eighteen," Lee [Oswald] said.
"Libra. A Libran."
"The Scales," [Dave] Ferrie said.
"The Balance," Shaw said.

It seemed to tell them everything they had to know. Clay Shaw wore well-made casual clothes and had the easy manner of someone clearly educated to all the right things. When he smiled, a vein seemed to flash from the corner of his right eye to his hairline.

He [Shaw] said, "We have the positive Libran who has achieved self-mastery. He is well balanced, levelheaded, a sensible fellow respected by all. We have the negative Libran who is, let’s say, somewhat unsteady and impulsive. Easily, easily, easily influenced. Poised to make the dangerous leap. Either way, balance is the key."



______________________________ ____________________ ______________________________ ______________________________ ______________________________ ______________________________ _______




Ferrie: "There’s something I know about you, Leon, that I find fascinating. It’s something almost no one else knows. Very few people know. You’re the night-rider who took a shot at General Ted Walker two and a half months ago in Dallas."

Lee’s mind went blank.

"I can’t tell you how I know," Ferrie said. "But there are men who are interested in you. At first I only played a hunch. I thought Leon and I, we have a psychic bond. I took your application to [Guy] Banister. I had an argument all set. I would say to Guy, ‘Here is a man who wants to spy on our operations. He wants to use us but we will end up using him. Not through manipulation or political conversion. He believes in his heart that he’s a dedicated leftist. But he is also a Libran. He is capable of seeing the other side. He is a man who harbors contradictions.’ I was ready to say to Guy, ‘Here’s a Marine recruit who reads Karl Marx.’ I was ready to say, ‘This boy is sitting on the scales, ready to be tilted either way.'’’
______________________________ ______________________________ __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ __

Ferrie talked Lee into having a meal together. Raymo would drive him to Houston tomorrow if that’s what he wanted. Save the bus fare. Enjoy the comfort of the family car. They ate scrambled eggs in Ferrie’s apartment. There were explosives stored under the kitchen table. Ferrie kept his jacket on, wagged the fork as he spoke.

"I’ve seen the Fair Play [for Cuba Committee] material you keep at 544 [Camp Street]," he said. "I’ve noticed something you haven’t noticed. Librans never notice references to themselves. The official symbol of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee is a man’s hand holding aloft a pair of scales. Two
weighing pans hanging from a rigid beam. Everywhere you go. It’s all around you. Which way will Leon [Oswald] tilt?"

"I don’t know what they want me to do."
"Of course you know."
"Tell me where it happens."
"Miami."
"That means nothing to me."
"You’ve known for weeks."
"What happens in Miami?"

Ferrie took a while to finish chewing his food.

"Think of two parallel lines," he said. "One is the life of Lee H. Oswald. One is the conspiracy to kill the President. What bridges the space
between them? What makes a connection inevitable? There is a third line. It comes out of dreams, visions, intuitions, prayers, out of the
deepest levels of the self. It’s not generated by cause and effect like the other two lines. It’s a line that cuts across causality, cuts across time. It has no history that we can recognize or understand. But it forces a connection. It puts a man on the path of his destiny."

 

Next thing you'll tell me is that there was not a CIA & FBI conspiracy to kill journalist Jack Anderson as well, hmmmm???? Right????



[video=youtube;oMTL1S5ANrU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMTL1S5ANrU&index=47&list=PL1IIRVPwL5-UozGolsBS1au55v9-I6Spd[/video]

[video=youtube;T1h1XwcNoR0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1h1XwcNoR0&list=PL1IIRVPwL5-UozGolsBS1au55v9-I6Spd&index=46[/video]

[video=youtube;aNOQ6SDOaYI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNOQ6SDOaYI&list=PL1IIRVPwL5-UozGolsBS1au55v9-I6Spd&index=44[/video]

[video=youtube;tvdS-1dcVxw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvdS-1dcVxw[/video]

[video=youtube;PTWAJKy9kGI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTWAJKy9kGI&index=29&list=PL1IIRVPwL5-UozGolsBS1au55v9-I6Spd[/video]

[video=youtube;DEX6FKP-Ejc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEX6FKP-Ejc[/video]

 

i once took an interest in JFK assassination, just as many do and so i looked up many youtube videos and read articles. Initially, some of the documentaries were pretty darn convincing... I was initially convinced it was a conspiracy but after some time, i tried to debunk the conspiracies and what i found out pretty quickly is that virtually every conspiracy theory regarding JFK has been utterly debunked. For example, the magic bullet theory was actually put to the test through carefully designed ballistic tests and proven to be nonsense. Snipers also attempted what Oswald tried to do and many of them were able to pull it off, without much practice with that particular rifle which oswald had practice with. The list goes on and on about the so many claims and all of them have been debunked. I then realized that it was just speculation and storytelling.. See many people read all of this but never bother to try and debunk it all as i did, they just take in what they want to believe and ignore the rest.

One thing which blew my mind are the many videos and articles out there which contradict each other. Some conspiracies claim it was the mob, some CIA, some Cubans, some a french assassin and many have different accounts of how shots were fired (manhole, grassy knoll, library etc..).. I would think that conspiracy theorists would at least stick to one story and not 100 different accounts of how JFK was killed... it becomes a comedy of ridiculous, crazy claims...

in the end, it comes down to this. People have a very hard time accepting that some loser like Oswald could've taken down JFK. It can't be! has to be some massive secret conspiracy, the latter provides people with something exciting to talk about, something 'larger' than life and it also makes Kennedy out to be a figure that could've only been taken down by a secret alliance of CIA, mob etc.... not some random loser. What is amazing is that conspiracy theorists use inconsistencies, contradictory evidence and lack thereof as 'evidence' that JFK was assassinated as part of a conspiracy yet they all do the same thing - fail to produce any evidence. As far as Oswald goes, there is tremendous circumstantial and hard evidence backing him up as sole killer but this is all dismissed, because IT JUST CAN'T BE POSSIBLE... one random loser killed JFK..NO! can't be! life cannot be this boring and random...

 

That's not true. Ballistic tests where similar bullets were shot into ballistic gel with bones in it to simulate the bones struck in the "magic bullet" came out heavily deformed.

Attempt to recreate the supposed Oswald shots yielded mixed results when attempted by expert marksmen who were NOT shooting at the President. Guns jammed...shots missed... The success rate for the experts was less than 50%.

As far as conspiracies...one factor is that the CIA has a history of putting out easily debunked "theories" (noise) to make it appear as if ALL the theories are similarly ridiculous. And it works.

 

wrong..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZRUNYZY71g

these guys went through a lot to replicate the conditions, this was a pretty scientific and exhaustive test. They pretty much prove that one single bullet could've done what it did to JFK and Governor Connally. To your point, the test bullet showed more damage than the one which apparently hit JFK and Connally but they explain it too...

many have been able to replicate the shot that killed JFK and some say it was a rather easy shot. Of course you will have some conspiracy theorists which will say otherwise but that's not surprising. Jesse Ventura once tried it and said it was 'impossible' but Jesse Ventura had a show 'conspiracy theories' and is now talking about Trump possibly being killed in a conspiracy, if people listen to guys like Jesse, knock yourself out.


here are some guys replicating the shot and making it rather easily... they also try a shot from grassy knoll location and show that the results are inconsistent with JFK's head wound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RCX3RdVHqo (grassy knoll recreation)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RX2phbWmgA (6th floor shot recreation)


these seem to be pretty well planned and exhaustive tests but of course you will discredit it..

look, i don't want to get into this again, been there, done that. I'm not out to get conspiracy theorists or support them, i'm just telling you that if you take the time to carefully analyze all the evidence and both sides of each story, conspiracy theories fall short. What conspiracy theorists do, knowing that their evidence fails, is claim that the evidence against their claims is 'fabricated', 'false' etc... It's so easy to argue like this 'Okay, yes you have evidence but it's all fabricated...' it's a waste of time to argue like this. Another strategy they have is use inconsistencies as 'evidence'. So if 10 witnesses said they heard shot from one location but 1 says otherwise, there it is 'evidence'... It's been proven that it's difficult to know where shots come from sometimes, this is a known phenomenon that is common place but conspiracy theorists don;t want anyone to know this... anyway, it's lazy to just dismiss hard evidence as 'fabricated' and use inconsistencies as hard evidence... these tricks fall short.

But to be honest what really discredits conspiracy theories is how many different accounts there are. There are people that say they can 'prove' it was from a manhole, that they can 'prove' that it was from grassy knoll and some claim it was from 6th floor but someone else. There are videos and documentaries claiming they have evidence that it was Cubans, a French assassin, mob, russians... they all have evidence of contradictory accounts and it becomes a comedy of idiotic conspiracies.

 

Wait. So you admit that there was more damage to the bullet in the tests (almost none in reality) and "they explain it".

Oh.

as far as "many have been able to replicate the shot that killed JFK "...and many have not...in spite of having non-moving targets and the advantage of not only being actual experts but NOT shooting at the POTUS

And Ventura is the kind of nutjob the CIA loves. His theories are generally ludicrous and his reputation is worse.

 

In the test, they explain why the bullet used in the test had slightly more damage but if you can't bother to watch the video, then i'm not going to explain it to you. It doesn't surprise me that you don't want to make any effort in finding out the truth.

as far as the shot goes, there are varying accounts but some claim it's not only makable, but a rather easy shot. The problem here is that there are so many conspiracy theorists out there that they find people that claim the shot was 'impossible'. From looking at videos, the ones who claim shot wasn't possible are usually conspiracy theorists (ex. Jesse Ventura), i've seen others who believe in a conspiracy who have also claimed 'it's too hard'. The ones who have made the shot, at least to me, seem more independent and just interested in finding out the truth.

In the end, there is overwhelming evidence to support Oswald as the shooter and there is ZERO evidence to support conspiracy theories. Like i mentioned above, what conspiracy theorists do is use inconsistencies (hey some eye witnesses heard shots coming from there) and discredit evidence (rifle planted, finger prints planted, witness who saw oswald carrying a rifle was lying, witness who saw person shooting from 6th floor was lying, photo showing oswald with the rifle was fabricated, oswald's wife was coerced into saying certain things etc..) All the evidence discredited as fabricated by CIA without a single fact to back it up. It's lame to argue like this, same as the 09/11 guys.... How easy is it to simply say, 'all that evidence is false'? Man, we can argue anything like this but it's lazy and never proves anything.

 

There is no definite conspiracy and never was.

It is all basically fiction and speculation.

Having a lot or even most people believe in such an idea is irrelevant.

You need to provide evidence that the Warren Commission was a cover up and so far no one has.

That OSwald acted alone however is well proven by evidence rather than guess work such as what resisting posts here.

- - - Updated - - -

Do you understand what fiction means?

 

Actually from the very beginning the FBI and others were easily able to closely recreate the shooting. No one can perfectly recreate the shooting. It is however proven beyond question that it was no problem for Oswald to shoot JFK as he did.

Your claim of the CIA requires a citation.

 

when you do a test...and then have to "explain" why it didn't come out right...you failed.

 

Wrong.

They did not explain why it did not come out right.

They explained why it could never be an exact duplication.

Sorry they succeeded and proved wrong yet one more of the myths beloved by conspiracy idiots.

 

They did not explain why it did not come out right.

They explained why it could never be an exact duplication.

That's the same thing genius

 

No it is not what so ever slow one.

No wonder you believe in fairy tales you are ignorant about science.

 

When you do a test and it comes out wrong...your "explanation" is called an "excuse".

 

It did not come out wrong.

What they explained was why no test can be a precise duplicate.

Sorry they proved you wrong which is common for you but keep living in denial

 

So their test was essentially worthless then.

If you can't do what you set out to do...you failed.

And they made no attempt to duplicate their findings.

The really "funny" thing was that inspite of having the luxury of setting everything up just the way they wanted in order to "prove" the magic bullet theory...not only was the bullet massively deformed...but they never showed that the bullet that they had entering Kennedy's back actually came out his throat.

And THAT we know. He absolutely had a would that went through the knot of his tie.

 

It was quite valid and proved in fact that the bullet did what it was reported to have done which was not magical.