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Ranked Vote: Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by Meta777, Apr 20, 2018.

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  1. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    Only those who don't make it their living to rule their fellow man should be allowed to do so. I like the lottery system.
     
    Longshot, Jul 15, 2018
    #76
  2. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Jul 25, 2018
    #77
  3. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    BTW, here is the updated list of both past, current, and future planned votes:

    List of Past/Planned Votes:
    [04/16/18] What is the Best Flavor of Ice Cream (results posted)
    [04/16/18] What are your Favorite Vegetables (results posted)
    [04/13/18] What is the Best Smartphone (results posted)
    [04/20/18] What is the Best Pet to Own (results posted)
    [05/25/18] What are the Nation's Top Issues Most Needing to be Addressed (US) (results posted)
    [06/08/18] How To Reform Redistricting And End Political Gerrymandering (results posted)
    [06/01/18] What To Do About The Long-Term Implications of Automation (results posted)
    [06/16/18] What To Do To Reduce Partisan Dysfunction In Politics (results posted)
    [07/14/18] How To Enact Comprehensive Immigration Reform (voting underway) [1][2][3][4][5][6][7]
    [08/10/18] What To Do To Stop Back-room Dealing In Politics (discussion started)
    [08/24/18] How To Finally Resolve the Abortion Debate
    [07/27/18] How To Restore Meaningful Civil Discourse (taking nominations)
    [No Date Set] How To Fix Our Campaign Finance Laws
    [No Date Set] Gun Violence v Gun Rights
    [No Date Set] Health Care Costs
    [No Date Set] Debt and Deficits
    [No Date Set] Global Warming
    [No Date Set] Education
    [No Date Set] Secret Surprise???
    [No Date Set] 2016 Presidential Vote
    [07/12/18] What are your Favorite Colors (voting underway)
    [07/12/18] What are the Creepiest Bugs (results posted)​

    -Meta
     
    Meta777, Jul 25, 2018
    #78
  4. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Not sure why the links all of a sudden all decided to turn blue in that last post. :/
     
    Meta777, Aug 4, 2018
    #79
  5. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Aug 4, 2018
    #80
  6. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Aug 5, 2018
    #81
  7. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Aug 9, 2018
    #82
  8. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Aug 17, 2018
    #83
  9. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Aug 18, 2018
    #84
  10. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Aug 31, 2018
    #85
  11. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Sep 8, 2018
    #86
  12. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Sep 20, 2018
    #87
  13. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Oct 26, 2018
    #88
  14. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Nov 8, 2018
    #89
  15. Natty Bumpo

    Natty Bumpo Well-Known Member

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    "Ranked Voting" is a practical accommodation to reality: You can't always get what you want.

    Scenario: There are 3 candidates on the ballot. Candidate A is your ideal, reflecting all your values, convictions, hopes, and aspirations, but without a shot at winning against two highly-funded, well-known, major party-sponsored opponents, B and C.

    Pitting Pragmatism against Principle

    If you cast your vote for A, C who is antithetical to all that you hold dear, has a good chance of defeating B whom you regard as a reasonably capable and decent individual.

    Is it possible to vote based upon both principle and pragmatism, or does your principled vote promote the worst possible choice from your perspective? Should going with your preference bear such a draconian penalty?

     
    Natty Bumpo, Nov 15, 2018
    #90
    Meta777 likes this.
  16. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    You get it! See, the dilemma you described is exactly why we need to get rid of our Plurality system and fully embrace Ranked voting for our various elections. Wish more people would understand. I would add though, that if people were actually allowed to vote for the principled candidate without worrying about the penalty you mentioned, such a principled candidate, whom today we consider as not having a shot, might then actually have a shot...

    -Meta
     
    Meta777, Jun 28, 2019
    #91
  17. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Jun 28, 2019
    #92
  18. liberalminority

    liberalminority Well-Known Member

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    some of the worst things in history were done by principled people

    the plurality system allows for the lesser evil because candidates have to be objective

     
    liberalminority, Jun 29, 2019
    #93
  19. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Why would anyone actually want to choose "the lesser evil" when simply using a ranked system
    could give them the choice instead of picking someone actually good (aka, and even lesser evil).
    The whole point of calling something/someone the lesser evil is to suggest that people don't really want to vote for such candidates but that they just don't have any other options because the other choices are even worse. A ranked system would fix that, making it so that folks
    could actually vote for who they felt was best rather than the "lesser evil" they thought could win.

    Wouldn't necessary guarantee those preferred candidates would come out on top, but it would at least give them a fair shot. And if enough people supported them then those candidates then actually would win. None of that suggests that the resulting candidates
    would be any less objective in fulfilling their roles than candidates chosen via Plurality. I'd even argue that Ranked voting would force candidates to be a lot more objective than they are now. Can't just slime your opponent when running against more than one serious contender... you actually have to convince voters why it is they should vote for you.

    Plurality on the other hand actually encourages non-objectivity through its binary nature... I mean, for an example just look no further than the U.S. government, specifically the house and senate, and how extremely polarized and ineffectual its become over time as a result of Plurality voting. When breaking with one's own party means helping your ideological polar opposites (because there is no moderation and no other options) then it becomes much harder for one to be objective. If we really want our government to become more moderate, and we should, then Ranked voting is definitely the way to go.

    -Meta
     
    Meta777, Dec 26, 2020
    #94
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  20. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Dec 26, 2020
    #95
  21. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Meta777, Dec 27, 2020
    #96
  22. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    .
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
    modernpaladin, Dec 27, 2020
    #97
  23. liberalminority

    liberalminority Well-Known Member

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    voting is about getting what you need, not about getting what you want

    plurality is zero sum, for example the winners will be losers and the losers will be winners. ranked voting allows the losers to feign personal responsibility.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020
    liberalminority, Dec 28, 2020
    #98
  24. Meta777

    Meta777 Moderator Staff Member

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    Please explain... are you saying that Plurality Voting is preferable to Ranked Voting because
    it means the losers of an election are 100% not responsible for anything done by the winners??
     
    Meta777, Dec 29, 2020
    #99
  25. liberalminority

    liberalminority Well-Known Member

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    yes, ranked voting means the losers are 100% responsible for anything done by the winners.

    plurality voting benefits underprivileged Americans whereas ranked voting benefits the privileged.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2020
    liberalminority, Dec 29, 2020
    #100
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