READ: Whistleblower lawyer's letter to White House

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Statistikhengst, Nov 8, 2019.

  1. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    Its the same standard we apply in law enforcement all through the country. The use of anonymous tips is completely routine in every police station. The cops don't have to produce squat on the tipster. They don't have to know squat about the tipster and yet the case may move forward for trial. If the prosecution can prove its case and all the elements of the case without referencing anything but the existence of an anonymous tip, the prosecution does not need to produce the witness or identify him. He ceases to be relevant if they are using other witnesses and documentation to prove opportunity, motive, etc.

    Wow should the House have to do more in due process when someone may lose his job, than a court has to provide when someone may lose their liberty for 15 years or die?
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
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  2. ButterBalls

    ButterBalls Well-Known Member

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    And if I'm not mistaken, "anonymous tips" either produce evidence or they do not! How many people are convicted without evidence after a fruitless anonymous tip :)

    Come on man, makes this a little challenging ;)
     
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  3. bx4

    bx4 Well-Known Member

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    He went through proper channels to report it and got the information through his job. That’s what the report says. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?
     
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  4. bx4

    bx4 Well-Known Member

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    If it could be done in a way to protect him, I don’t see why not. But he’s already been subject to witness intimidation from the president and it looks like the Rs are heading the same way.
    So why not take him up on his offer? Written questions and answers were good enough for trump in the mueller enquiry.
     
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  5. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    So why aren't they impeaching?
     
  6. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    They produce just enough information that the cops can run down a name, a place and find plenty of other direct witnesses or evidence and maybe even a cell phone or two, so that they don't need to bring the anonymous tipster into court to prove a single assertion to the jury. If you find five people who saw an assault in the back of an alley, and are willing to tell you the names of the perpetrator, what they saw and the victim, and even one filmed it, you don't need to bring the anonymous tipster who called it in to the precinct. This happens all the time. How do you think cops get called to the scene of domestic desputes or drug deals or fraud half the time. Do you think the cops are obliged to produce these anonymous tipsters that call in court proceedings? Really?

    They make promises of confidentiality all the time, and build their cases another way.

    I think you are the one who needs to make this a challenge.
     
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  7. ButterBalls

    ButterBalls Well-Known Member

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    Well I'll let your post speak for you, LOL. I hope you realize, you just posted all the things NOT associated with "THE CALL"..

    NO, but JUST LIKE YOU, I, too believe they have to produce.
    Pretty comical, I think the best thing for you to do at this point is punt the ball bro ¯\_(º¸º)_/¯
     
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  8. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    What protection? We the People need to see and hear him testify. We know who he is. So why not call him before the committee.
     
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  9. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

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    I think the House believes that they have sufficient evidence from other witnesses including the 'accused' President that they don't need to rely on the WB ( or more accurately that producing him will not result in any senators changing their votes regardless)

    Remember the burden of proof here is not proscribed by any statute. There is no 'reasonable doubt' or 'preponderance of evidence' or 'clear and convincing evidence' standard placed on the House managers case. There is no liberty or property or life at risk with this result so due process is not required. The House standard is whatever produces the majority vote. In the senate there is no standard for the burden either.
     
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  10. squidward

    squidward Well-Known Member

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    He went to Schiff.
    That negates properness
     
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  11. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    No de Nile here. There was lack of evidence of collusion. There were 32 indictments issued plus Mueller stated Russian interference.
     
  12. glitch

    glitch Well-Known Member

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    You are twisting and turning just to accuse the prez of something. Give it up, it doesn't matter who says it. It is not a threat no matter who says it.
     
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  13. glitch

    glitch Well-Known Member

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    Obviously you don't want the truth about everything. You're calling for the truth about this to be hidden.
     
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  14. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  15. Fred C Dobbs

    Fred C Dobbs Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    With all the means at his disposal any US president would be able identity this guy. Everyone in DC knows,
     
  16. Fred C Dobbs

    Fred C Dobbs Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I said "If". However this is the third time information about the President's phone calls with other world leaders has been leaked so it's clear he should be the number one suspect, given that he had access to inside information in the last call.
     
  17. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    There was no collusion found, there is lack of evidence of unicorns does that mean we should list them as an animal species. Let's investigate that Russian interference Mueller mentions Ukraine 97 times including ties with Russian oligarchs. in his report. OH THAT'S RIGHT you think Trump should be impeached for asking them, by treaty, to assist.
     
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  18. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    What witness or victim or informant has been tampered with who is not subject to Executive Privilege?

    "Whoever, with intent to avoid, evade, prevent, or obstruct compliance, in whole or in part, with any civil investigative demand duly and properly made under the Antitrust Civil Process Act, willfully withholds, misrepresents, removes from any place, conceals, covers up, destroys, mutilates, alters, or by other means falsifies any documentary material, answers to written interrogatories, or oral testimony, which is the subject of such demand; or attempts to do so or solicits another to do so; or

    Whoever corruptly, or by threats or force, or by any threatening letter or communication influences, obstructs, or impedes or endeavors to influence, obstruct, or impede the due and proper administration of the law under which any pending proceeding is being had before any department or agency of the United States, or the due and proper exercise of the power of inquiry under which any inquiry or investigation is being had by either House, or any committee of either House or any joint committee of the Congress—"

    This is not a civil anti-trust matter or a legal matter it is an impeachment inquiry. It's YOUR side that keeps saying legal due process does not matter here because it is a legal matter. And then of course there is a thingy called Executive Privilege.

    -and-

    Do explain who was retaliated against under this law and how.
     
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  19. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    He went through proper channels and those proper channels said this did meet whistleblower criteria under the whistleblower law. The fact is he actually went outside proper procedures by conspiring with members of Congress first.
     
  20. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    Nothing related to collusion. You really think if Obama or any other POTUS had been subjected to this witch hunt they wouldn't have come up with a lot?

    That's been going on since 1917.
     
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  21. bx4

    bx4 Well-Known Member

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    Fake news.
     
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  22. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    Not sufficient evidence for collusion. The Mueller investigation not in any way a witch hunt.

    The Bolshevik Revolution was a horrific event but trying to tie it to current Russian election interference if beyond rediculous. But Inwill play your game. Sure Communist thuggery has been going on since 1917. Murder has been going on since Cain slew able that does not make murder ok not Russian interference.
     
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  23. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    You do understand that the reason Ukraine was mentioned was because Paul Manafort was there working for the scum Turd Pro-Russian Yanukovych who by the way ran away to Russia when a couple two students staged protests. Of course the Scum Turd Pro-Russian oligarchs / criminals had ties to Russian oligarchs that is what Pro-Russian Scum Turds do. Manafort who is now is jail since he is a criminal was Trump's campaign manager. Manafort also had ties to Russia oligarchs.

    Mueller did not mention the good Ukrainians, the anti Russian Nationalist Ukrainians has reference is to the Scum Turd Pro-Russian variety.
     
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  24. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yes Ukraine corruption is mentioned with ties and we have probable cause the Biden's were involved so let's have a full investigation as we did with Manafort and let the chips fall where they may, what is your objection? Why do you want to impeach Trump for wanting to do so?
     
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  25. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Fact. Lack of rebuttal noted.
     

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