I am sure that has happened, in any human institution. I have heard of it in schools and universities, and it was more common in times past. The point is, it is a biased, unfair accusation to blame Catholicism, and more broadly, Christianity, for the actions of a few aberrants, or their enablers. Christianity as an ideology, does NOT promote pedophilia, murder, rape, lying, theft, or any negative behavior actions common to man. It is perhaps THE most idealistic and altruistic of any religious beliefs, addressing thought and feeling, not just outward action. So the false caricature you present of 'Christianity promotes pedophilia and other evils!', is a smear from a competing ideology trying to knock Christianity. AKA, religious bigotry .
I fully reconize that having some ultimate "purpose" is comforting. But, that fact doesn't mean there actually exists some ultimate purpose. You need much, much more than that to have a convincing argument that the spiratual world you espouse has any relationship to reality. So far, you're just wishing.
NO. The Church is actively protecting these sexual predators. That is NOT what schools do. If an instructor at any level commits such crimes they are out of education for life and turned over to the law for prosecution. I'm NOT saying Christianity "promotes" these criminal actions. I AM saying that Christianity protects it's own prelates from the consequences of their crimes against women and children. And, that's common knowledge - not even debatable.
I actually think Sola Scriptura is the best Christian Doctrine position since it destroys denominations and churches no one is superior to another and everyone is a Priest or Priestess or Minister so instead of a Pope you have a man reading the Word and through study learning what God wishes its the ultimate freedom from anyone lauding over another their superiority. No need for theology schools, churches, ordination, church buildings, temples, ceremonies and pomp just people and the Bible. Its wondrous and I an see why the Catholic Church and Mormons oppose it the power goes like dust in the wind. Calvin and Luther kept the same system they fled just replaced one kind of clergy with another and one kind of holy place for another and another elitist caste for another. So they failed to follow their own theology.
? I am exactly presenting that possibility. Two of them: 1. A Creator imbedded a sense of purpose, eternity, morality, etc. 2. There is no imbedded sense, it is a delusion, from human manipulators, fear, or something. IF.. there actually is a God, THEN either possibility could be true. BUT IF... there is no God, THEN.. the 'sense' is a delusion. I'd rather not repeat the same obvious, simple points in every thread. Debate this issue, if you want, in the delusion trlhread, so we don't deflect from this one. It seems more to me, that you are deflecting with a straw man, not dealing with the reasoning presented.
This is false, by any observable standard. It is a generalized smear, towards all 'churches', with no evidence.. just a 'common knowledge!' fallacy. Pedophiles have been part of the human experience for millennia. Some ideologies and political structures justify it, some condemn it as an aberration, sin, or some other descriptor. There is nothing in Christian ideology that approves of pedophilia. And most institutions, under a banner of 'Christian', do not accept or approve of it. IMO, this is just a smear, to cast general aspersions on Christianity from a competing worldview. 'Christians approve of pedophilia!' AKA, religious bigotry.
How is that? It is a common human practice, and its effects have been observed for millennia. Stalin practiced 'religious bigotry', by actively persecuting any ideology he disapproved of. Mao did the same. Hitler's actions of genocide can obviously be defined as 'religious bigotry.' Islam, even now, actively persecutes any religio/philosophical belief that does not conform exactly to Islamic beliefs. The Catholics during the reformation killed and persecuted many protestants for defying their tenets of faith. Progressives now, exclude, shun, mock, sue, legislate against, and revile any expression of Christian orthodoxy. So far from being an oxymoron, it is a constant, continuous problem, in the human experience .
No, there is absolutely no doubt about the church moving it's priests around to new locations when they have been found out by the public. And, they work hard to protect them from civil and state legal action. I'm not saying Christians approve, but there is a long history of Christians accepting this direction. If that were not so, protecting these criminals would not be possible.
Opposition to the views of USFAN have nothing to do with religious bigotry. He's constantly making riddiculous claims for Christianity in his pursuiit of degrading all those who don't share hiis personal beliefs. And, that absolutely does warrant opposition. And, you can read my posts to see that I'm objecting to his direction of degrading others rather than opposing his beliefs. If he just wanted to discuss his own religion, I would probably have no reaason to object. That's what the form is for.
So you agree that religious bigotry is a continuous practice. In fact the bigotry of one religion towards all other religions is really the only rational for existance a particular religion has.
I gave my reasoning to counter your accusation, that 'Christians approve of pedophilia!' It is an absurd caricature, yet you continue to repeat it. I see no value in repeating the same points, just for you to repeat your assertions, with no basis in reality. Then how is it an oxymoron, if it a continuous practice? Ad hom is a poor substitute for reason. ..neither is attempting to bait me into the ridiculous, 'atheists vs Christians!', flame war. I've provided a topic for discussion, and you can contribute intelligent arguments, or you can disrupt with fallacies, to deflect from the impotence of your arguments. Your choice.
Search for a word ox·y·mo·ron /ˌäksəˈmôrˌän/ noun a figure of speech in which apparently contradictory terms appear in conjunction (e.g. faith unfaithful kept him falsely true ). Understand now why religious bigotry is an oxymoron?
I very specifically said that I DON'T believe Christians approve of pedophilia. But again it IS the case that the greater Christian community is accepting of the idea of protecting the Church as a whole as well as those who have perpetrated these crimes. If the numerous crimes weren't wrapped in religion, they would be prosecuted.
I think there is a higher purpose in religion. I think that higher purpose exists outside of religion, too. We do need to work on the bigotry part. America was born to be religiously plural.
The higher purpose in religion being control of the thought process of believers and the control of the behavior of the non believers. And yes that certainly applies to political idealogies as well as religion.
No. The definition of oxymoron has no bearing on religious bigotry, a common human practice over the millennia. 'Religious!' is not just a synonym for 'Christian!', as it seems in the forums. It is a descriptor for a philosophical belief, worldview, or opinion about the nature of man and the universe. It can include opinions about God. I would say, 'philosophical bigotry,' but it is more commonly used as, 'religious'. It can come from any ideological or philosophical belief, toward another. It is usually a competing worldview, or religious opinion that is the target. It is expressed in the public discourse as, Catholic vs protestant Hindu vs muslim Atheist vs theist Progressivism vs Americanism Socialism vs capitalism Marxism vs democracy Etc 1. 'Religion', is irrelevant, as to 'higher purpose'. If there is a God, Who instilled a 'higher purpose,' then it might be real, regardless of religious beliefs. If there is no God, then any sense of 'higher purpose' is a delusion, also regardless of religious beliefs. 2. Religio/philosophical freedom in the US, and most of the west, is fading, as an important social ideal. Homogeneity of belief is preferred, and indoctrinated by the dominant religious belief, Progressivism. I agree that the goal of most human institutions is power and control, regardless of the religio/philosophical basis. And, many 'political ideologies' are just a competing religious belief. I see Progressivism as a major competitor for Christianity, and expressions of religious bigotry are common. I don't agree that Christianity, as defined by the Founder, has 'control!', as the goal. ..quite the opposite. But perhaps biblical Christianity would not qualify as a 'religion!', by your definition?
No, there are many "progressives" who would also describe themselves as Christians. Can you explain what Progressivism is?
I think i see the problem. It is the Orwellian redefinition of terms. Both 'religious!' and 'bigotry!' have become smear words, used by progressives mostly, to demonize the competition. So they seem redundant. Both are insults, not descriptors, in Progresso World. I am presenting the terms in classical usage. Religious- belief, opinion, worldview, or philosophy of life Bigotry- intolerance, censoring, bullying toward another with different opinions So i could not see the correlation of the terms. But filtering them through progressive redefinitions, it becomes clear. Nazis/jews Hindu/Muslim Protestant/catholic Marxist/traditionalist Collectivism/Individualism Progressivism/Americanism ... these are historical and current examples of religious bigotry. The phrase actually describes the conflict between competing ideologies, not just as a smear term.
bigotry in the sense that each sect believes theirs is the only 'true' one & 'the god' only cares about them not the others because they are wrong... each sect thinking they are 'above' the other which, inofitself, is anti-religous, ergo an oxymoron...
Biblical Christianity would certainly qualify as a religion by my definition. Unfortunatly no religious organization or group practices that religion, at least no in the US. Of course I am not aware of the definition of Christianity as defined by the founder so if you can actually provide the definition it might change my opinion.
christianity = believing in christ... then the tree branches out to all the sects & their interpretation of it... iow, modifyed to their liking to fit their agenda...
I'll keep this incredibly simplistic to make a point. "Higher purpose" refers to purpose above self interest. The wellbeing of mankind is a higher purpose, as one example. Freedom is a higher purpose for which one might die, thus losing all, including freedom, for the better good of mankind. What's happening in the US is a fading of the idea that one's personal religion justifies actions taken against the freedom of others or equality in interaction and representation with government. Assaults on your personal beliefs are not legitimate in our society - you can hold any beliefs you want. Issues arise when individuals believe their personal religion justifies actions against others - either at their own hand or through government.
