Repeal and replace

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by ARDY, Nov 24, 2018.

  1. ARDY

    ARDY Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    While obama was prez, there wre countless gop bills to repeal obamacare

    when trump ran for prez
    Obamacare was an unmitigated disaster that he would immediately get rid of

    Then when he was elected we started to hear about repeal and replace

    Now we have just had another election
    And i just realized there was barely a single word from the gop about obamacare

    It seems strange given the near 10 year obsession on this topic. Did the gop finally give up?
     
  2. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump has gutted ObamaCare. The reason ObamaCare was not repealed and replaced was the Freedom Caucus who are (as it turns out) the biggest supporters of ObamaCare due to their actions of insisting on their definition of the perfect instead of the good. The Ryan/Pence 3 part plan to repeal and replace was masterful as the immediate Part 1 legislation did as much as possible under reconciliation rules which only required 50 Senate votes. That one year window has closed. Part 2 would have been implemented via regulations from Pence then the Sec of HHS. Part 3 would have been follow on legislation.

    Now we have a D House and so health insurance reform is again up in the air.
     
  3. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I blame Paul Ryan.

    I think he hated Trump more than he did Obamacare. None of the bills submitted actually repealed Obamacare but all of them cut Medicaid, which (other than the Obamacare version) didn't have much to do with Medicaid. This guaranteed that the GOP Senators with heavy Medicaid use in their states (Alaska and Maine) would never vote for it when it hit the Senate.

    The bills submitted were inferior in every way to the replacement the House Republicans came up with in 2013. They were all poison pilled and doomed to fail by design.

    Trump's responsibility for the failure came in when the bills failed. I don't think he realized that he was being sabotaged by the Congress. He should have formed a "Presidential Commission," designed his own bill, then dare Congress to vote against it. Since he didn't do that, he left himself vulnerable to the Democrat "pre-existing conditions" attack.

    Obamacare isn't just a political problem, it's an actual problem that needs to be fixed and because the GOP Congress decided they wanted to tweek Trump more than fix the problem, there is no more GOP Congress.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2018
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  4. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ryan is a policy genius. His plan would have accomplished everything possible within the limits of reconciliation. The idiots in the Freedom Caucus and the moronic behavior of Senators Cruz, Paul, and Lee resulted in the continuance of ObamaCare. Ryan absolutely did not sabotage the ObamaCare. The plan was carefully constructed to accomplish the maximum possible in the political reality of the Senate. Ryan has no real interest in politics. He’s a policy nerd. He didn’t want to be Speaker but reluctantly accepted it. I always thought that was a mistake. The dirty politics of our times smeared him.

    The 2013 bill was impossible to pass through the 60 vote requirement in the Senate.

    ObamaCare was effectively an expansion of Medicaid.
     
  5. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    Not then, AFM, but it will become a mandatory buy-in to Medicare (at age fifty) within a few years at the most.
     
  6. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That will never happen.
     
  7. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    You bet it will.
     
  8. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    You've absolutely lost me their. He's the master of fake plans and phony budgets. What is a successful Ryan policy?

    The only thing I agree with is that Ryan has no interest in politics. He has a fake reputation as a policy nerd, but the reality of Ryan is that he helped destroy the Tea Party by crafting and pushing through his 2015 spending bill that gave Obama and the Democrats everything they asked for. Ryan's real goal is get the approval of the Washington establishment and not be thought of as a racist. I'm just curious which donor he ends up working for now that his time in Congress is done?
     
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  9. Capt Nice

    Capt Nice Well-Known Member

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    Every time you heard a Republican promise to keep insurance for people with 'pre-existing conditions' you were hearing about Obama care.
     
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  10. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    I think the gop swamp rats were never serious about it
     
  11. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ryan Roadmap 2.0. And the 3 part ObamaCare replacement plan as I've explained.

    This is complete Ryan Derangement Syndrome. And illustrates the problem with the Freedom Caucus mentality. Time after time they fight battles they cannot win losing complete sight of the objective of winning the war. Shutting down the government is blamed on the R's and it costs seats in the government making it impossible to get anything done. Ryan has done as much as possible knowing full well that the Freedom Caucus agenda is impossible without 60 votes in the Senate. For that he has been vilified for no good reason. That is exactly what I predicted would happen.

    Where do you get this stuff.
     
  12. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Educate yourself.
     
  13. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    AFM, talk to yourself, please.
     
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  14. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    The "Ryan Roadmap" is exactly the type of stuff I'm talking about. It's a fake proposal that is never even contemplated to be implemented or turned into real legislation. It was for show only. It's hard to take seriously someone who whines about fiscal responsibility but when he actually has to take a responsible vote on a Balanced Budget Amendment, votes against it.

    And congratulations to Ryan for totally wasting two years of GOP control of all branches of government. Look what he accomplished...
     
  15. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You haven’t read the Roadmap including the economic analysis have you. Privatization of SS, MC, and MD must be done to both save the economy and provide much better benefits.

    The balanced budget amendment is a dumb idea. It opens the door to gross increases in spending and taxation.

    Look at what the Freedom Caucus blocked. The are the best advocates of ObamaCare.

    The R’s never had full control of the government. 60 Senate votes are required for that. Ryan was one of the R’s who understood that the only way to repeal and replace ObamaCare was to pass legislation under the reconciliation rules which only required 50 Senate votes. The idiots in the Freedom Caucus and their counterparts in the Senate had no clue and sabotaged the only chance to do it. I could not believe or understand the gross stupidity that those morons displayed. Watching video of idiotic Rand Paul pushing a copy machine around the capital was just embarrassing.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2018
  16. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    Trying to defend the privatization of SS, MC, and MD is embarrassing.
     
  17. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Last edited: Nov 25, 2018
  18. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    The programs are not bankrupting America.
     
  19. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You’re kidding right ??
     
  20. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    The reforms necessary are easily implemented and cost effective, which will require moving the tax cap and means testing.
     
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  21. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Only an idiot would tax productivity and steal money from contributors to fund a system on a death spiral which pays less than half what it should.
     
  22. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    OK well congratulations to Ryan for accomplishing nothing but dreaming big.
     
  23. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The tax reform wasn’t big ??

    “Congratulations” to the Freedom Caucus for being outstanding champions of ObamaCare.
     
  24. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    Let's get AFM right before he gets left.

    First, he is not an idiot.

    Second, much of the tax would be on non-productivity earnings, not productivity.

    Third, taxation by We the People is not theft.

    Fourth, the system is on no death spiral.

    Fifth, your opinion on what the system she pay out is meaningless without facts, study, and projection.
     
  25. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You’ve revealed your ignorance. Carry on.
     

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