Scots Begin Struggle For Independence:

This thread is likely to be closed for a few days as Scotty people mourn their Rugby team being thrashed by the English .
I wonder if they will march on the capital -- Glasgow , demanding heads to be chopped off .
English people , stay away until they stop drinking .

 

Why don't you think of something less troll-like to say?

It must be difficult think up all these mockajock remarks, really stupid sneers and pointless non-sequiturs...but then it does save you having to do anything other than give vent to your prejudices. Much easier not to engage brain and discuss anything....less hassle to just open your mouth (so to speak), let your belly rumble and spew bile.

 

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJ9Q7-blsy8&feature=fvsr"]Scotties - YouTube[/ame]

 

Look at those little Scotties staring forlornly toward England , hoping a nice English owner will come along .
A tear rolled down my cheek .

 

Don't take it so badly , old chap .
Another day , another game and one day you will play better .

 

Remember that numbers and money have nothing to do with it, Oddquine: racial superiority is the cause, obviously. Englandt (sp?) uber alles!

 

Scotties don't have owners. Only companions.

 

Let's all be nice to Scotties for a few days . Cut out mention of Edward the First ( Hammer of the Scotties) and don't start timing all posts at 13. 06

 

What is going on in the Western Europe forum these days, there used to be some decent discussion. Now it's trashed by a crowd of continually trolling off-topic effeminate twits. I've gone back pages here before finding anything resembling a decent post and not containing a stupid attempt at a racist insult.

Some of us would quite like to discuss the UK political situation without the thread being continually derailed. If you want to do continual trolling, can I suggest you go to the fun forum...oh wait no. Trolling is completely against the TOS. You can't go anywhere.

 

I think I'll derail it further......and let the Unionists really get something to get huffy over.....[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-znkbMzi4A"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-znkbMzi4A[/ame]

 

Try the blog Welsh Ramblings for a sensible discussion of UK nationalism from our side. I'd also be happy to discuss the book 'Britons' which shows how all this stuff was set up.

And, Raymondo, if you are interested in rugby, today's 'Wales'/Ireland match was worth watching. Raised some interesting issues too.

 

Great match but not in the same league as Chelsea versus Man U -- a classic .
Viv seems a very serious young lad .Seems he is against enjoying himself .
Go on Viv . Let's all chat about Rob Roy .Great Film ( spit )

 

...who wants to tell him?

Trolling isn't humour, Ray, it's just tedious and destructive of discussion where this is actually kind of a serious issue to people in UK and even some in US.

 

Wow OQ, excellent video although he is holding back he still expresses quite a bit of the gist from this perspective.

He is wrong about our own history being omitted from education in my case, my teachers educated us regardless of the proscribed curriculum and said although it was not allowed, they could not do anything other in line with their own ethics.

That is how far we are from being oppressed and culturally brainwashed by the dead empire, for anyone who is actually interested. Not very.

 

Doesn't it say it all that your teachers educated us regardless of the proscribed curriculum and said although it was not allowed, they could not do anything other in line with their own ethics.

I was at school in 1952, from a couple of months before my 5th birthday and went into Secondary from 1959 to 1965 and I don't remember getting anything but what was "allowed" in those days (and my short-term memory ain't great any more......but my longterm one is still pretty decent)......but then the Scottish cringe factor probably still then ruled OK.

History was my favourite subject...so I could recite all the details and dates of everything English and British from the Norman Invasion and the Magna Carta up to and including the Union of the Crowns and Parliaments, the Fifteen, the Forty Five etc.......but nothing from the Scottish viewpoint..everything from the English one. By the time I got to the stage of sitting O-Grades and Highers....we were into more modern stuff....as in both World Wars and the Empire.....and a distinct Scottish dimension just did not exist.

Heck, as I took Latin to Higher level, I knew a lot more about the history of the Roman Empire than I did about the history of my own country.

But then, I was at school not that long before my sister-in-law, who was a native Gaelic Speaker from Lewis.....and when she started school, Gaelic was forbidden in class and in the playground. It was use English or be speechless..so today, she is a person who can speak Gaelic, because that was what she used at home...but can't read or write it.

In my case, I was lucky re Scottish history......because my best mate's father also happened to be our history teacher up to higher level.....so what I learned, I learned as an extra-curricular activity when talking to him when visiting my mate...and from there I studied it for myself.

Things may well have changed in the intervening years...but I'll check that out with my grandchildren..particularly with the boys, who are both very keen on and good at history. I have never had the impression from my own children that, in their school years, much had changed from mine.....but they did have the dubious benefit of me bending their ears eternally..though how much good that did them...I am still not sure.

 

Which is why he is on my ignore list now.

 

One teacher told us straight she wasn't allowed to teach us Scottish history and why, but that she could not in conscience not teach it and if we told our parents she taught it, she could be fired and she asked us not to. Then she explained a whole lot and crammed in what she could of Scottish history in relation to the dictated curriculum. I don't know what they teach now, I will ask my son.

My mother was very interested in history and I read a lot of historical novels and visited many castles, so I picked up a lot but historical books are often French or English history. There is a big gap in the market for Scottish historical novels, to provide an easy learning facility. Maybe I'll pen one.

 

Thinking about it....was/is there any difference in the English mind between India, and other members of the old Empire and Scotland regarding attitude........as in they own it so can dictate to it?

Only Cyprus and Malaysia do not have English as an official language (to my knowledge)....all other Commonwealth countries have English as their first or second language..although all have now mostly reclaimed their own cultures by not conforming to the Queen's English and allowing native languages/dialects their place.

In the case of Scotland, if England had ever, at any stage, accepted that we were not just another region of England, and let us be us in a negotiated Federal system....we wouldn't be where we are today......and, with the best will in the world, it is hard to blame the Scots because the English majority do arrogance to the nth degree..unless, of course, you are a Unionist.

In my schooldays our equivalent of a native language, the Doric, was as forbidden in school as was Gaelic in Gaelic speaking areas....and that was because it was a non-acceptable dialect of the English approved of by the powers-that-be. By the time my own kids were in Secondary School, between the RAF English input, and the teaching strictures, they were often mistaken for English people, much to their disgust.....and that was despite my continually correcting them when they called cows, cows and not coos.........and my kids hated holidays with me........because we did castles and museums etc......and did very very little lying about on beaches relaxing.

Was looking through my photos the other night searching out some to print out for No2 grandaughter's 18th birthday nostalgia album....and was struck by how few had my kids in bathing suits on beaches and how many had them standing in front of Castles etc all over Scotland. Puir wee souls.

 

OK, my apologies ... Alex Salmond just wished Fred Goodwin good luck on "the ABN front" and said he was "watching events closely". (Not closely enough considering he is a former economist who'd worked for the RBS and the Scottish Office.) It was the Scottish govt's Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Sustainable Growth, John Swinney, who actually congratulated Goodwin on the deal. He even said it was an enormous achievement for RBS! ... In his own words.

Anyone could see the economy crashing. We were living on massive amounts of credit. And yes, politicians of all parties without a doubt courted Goodwin and took advantage of the changes.

A few non-English MPs? You're dismissing the Scots who have been in very significant positions within UK governments, including 2 recent prime ministers, one of whom presided over the banking crash and represented a Scottish constituency and authorised the socialisation of the banks. I don't blame the Scots entirely by any means. This isn't a Scot v English thing for me. It's the entire political class who need to acknowledge that they got it wrong. None of them argued for real changes before the banks crashed but Scottish politicians certainly can't wash their hands of it any more than English ones can. In what sense do I have have half a million compatriots there?

And we haven't been electing "right wing" governments. We've been electing governments that are the worst of both the left and the right wing, and both are statist and anti-libertarian. I don't see that changing for any part of the UK or Scotland if it separates from the UK.

 

WHO forbade native languages in school? Or the teaching of Scottish history?

 

I beg your pardon?

Which of my points does that answer?

 

I've had the chance to share the life a Scottish family, in Aberdeen, during my teens: Great peeps, with a genuine sympathy for us Continentals. So when I hear, nowadays, talks of nationalism rearing its ugly head in Scotland, I have to laugh.

 

And?

Wouldn't you have expected the finance minister of the UK to send much the same kind of letter of congratulations if it had been Barclays rather than the RB of S which acquired the bank, as it had also been trying to do?

Bloody hell..until she grabbed his knighthood back, Fred the Shred was a trustee of the Queen’s personal charity, the Silver Jubilee Trust..and until 2009 was head of The Prince’s Trust.

Given that Northern Rock, Bradford and Bingley and Lloyds...which are "English" were also bailed out........as was HBOS....how come the focus is on just one Scottish Bank and its CEO...bar as a vehicle to manipulate in order to trash Salmond and the SNP......particularly now that anti-independence is on the Unionist agenda.

Actually, the whole problem was that nobody could see the whole financial system and the economy crashing as it did. Not the banks, not the Bank of England, though they had been warning about the personal debt levels from the early 2000s....not the politicians...because if they had realised what was about to happen, I'm sure some or all of them would have done something more timeous to head it off at the pass.

The fact that individuals knew they were living on massive amounts of credit does not equate to either them thinking that the banks didn't know what they were doing or to banks thinking they couldn't continue to do what they had been doing for years....fraudulently manipulating the banking system and lying through their teeth to their shareholders. I am surprised....not to say angry that there were no fraud charges brought against many people in the financial industry.....because it all started from a complete scam.

Well, excuse me......but I was absolutely convinced that it was the guru of the totally free Reaganomic/Friedmanite market which deregulated the banks in the late 1970s and 1980s..Margaret Thatcher....who was, to my knowledge, an English person who both represented an English Constituency and was Prime Minister of a Conservative Government..and who followed, like the poodles UK PMs have become, on the lead tugged by the USA.

I am, of course, sure that you will have links to disprove that belief of mine if it is erroneous.

I certainly agree re politicians......on forums at the time, I was saying we shouldn't be bailing out banks, but should be dealing with them more on the lines as Sweden did theirs in their 1990s Banking crisis......and not go running about like headless chickens throwing good money after bad.

What Brown did wrong was to not roll back the Conservative policies and re-introduce financial regulation...and the idea that all that was needed was that bankers would police themselves through the FSA...foolishness in the extreme...which elicits much the same hollow laughter as the idea that the press can/will police themselves, or the police can/will police themselves..or, if it comes to that, that MPs can/will police their own expenses claims.

After the Cruickshank report, around 2001, which did recommend bank re-regulation, the banks shrieked and howled....and Brown backed down...or Tony Blair made him back down...hard to know which of the red Tories were to blame...but that doesn't alter the fact that the rot set in with Thatcher. In an article in the Independent in late 2007, there is a quote which illustrates how much Thatcher caused it all UK side....The most hard-right Republican congressmen issued a report last week calling for the US to adopt "a regulatory structure like the one used in the United Kingdom." Our model is the market fundamentalist dream, where companies can be almost as unethical and risk-riven with our cash as they like.


There was at the 2001 census about half a million English people living in Scotland.......that was all I meant..nothing more sinister.

There hasn't been a left of centre.......or even a centre Government in the UK since Thatcher...and until Scottish Labour got its comeuppance in Scotland, none there either. I don't see that situation changing in the UK anytime soon, tbh.......but I don't see there being a right wing Government in Scotland anytime soon, either......though I can see the Scottish political parties doing pragmatism rather than dogma.

 

Why should I answer your points?

 

So you can show people here you have more to say than make pointless as homs.