She had a stillborn baby. Now she’s being charged with murder.

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by Bowerbird, Nov 15, 2019.

  1. Joe knows

    Joe knows Well-Known Member

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    Knowingly fits the bill. Doing meth while pregnant isn’t something you need a doctor to tell you is life threatening for a baby. It’s not rocket science and if someone can be charged with a double homicide for murdering a pregnant women it stands to reason that the mother should be charged in the murder as well if she done something as moronic as using street drugs while pregnant
     
  2. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    So you believe that they should all be 'murder'?
     
  3. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Well said.

    The pathologising of birth is a disaster. The idea that we should not have to 'endure the pain' just adds to the disaster.
     
  4. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    It hurts in a way that no words exist which can describe it. It's a very unique and mind-snapping sensation ... but it's that sensation which propels the baby out with the least stress. When it hurts less, the 'ejection' reflex is also dulled, and in first time mothers that often leads to slow progress and thus a stressed infant.

    IOW, it's a clunky system, but when allowed to happen naturally it works very efficiently.
     
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  5. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    You a midwife? Have you studied critical care maternity? Are you aware that a woman having a PPH (Post Partum haemorrhage) can lose 700 mL/minute? And that is just ONE complication
     
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  6. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    I've been involved personally and professionally, throughout my life. Either way, we're not discussing medical emergencies - we're discussing uncomplicated births. Two entirely different scenarios.
     
  7. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    But there is very very little evidence that Meth has an adverse effect on the foetus - but you are welcome to find valid research papers to disprove that

    https://www.theguardian.com/comment...cy-miscarriage-corporate-drug-pushers-go-free
     
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  8. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Are you serious? That can't be your argument.

    Look, everyone knows cocaine can certainly have adverse effects on the unborn baby (you've no doubt heard the term "crack baby"), and meth has very similar physiological effects, but is even worse.
     
  9. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Are you trying to compare being vegan with doing meth?
     
  10. Winter Sun

    Winter Sun Well-Known Member

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    If you want to charge her with something, then write a new law like “substance abuse while pregnant” but trying to fit this into the current legal code the way you are makes me uncomfortable. You’re essentially arguing to charge a woman with miscarrying. I don’t like her actions either. The problem is she abused a substance while pregnant, but no woman should ever be charged with a crime for suffering a miscarriage.
     
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  11. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Don't need a new law. She didn't miscarry the child was still born.
     
  12. Winter Sun

    Winter Sun Well-Known Member

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    I am unable to give birth and it’s a fact that doesn’t trouble me in the least. Some women say it’s a pain you never forget, but worth it. My sister acted very tramatized by her birthing experience. Soon after she had a total hysterectomy. It was medically necessary and not voluntary, but she said she didn’t want to go through another pregnancy and labor again.
     
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  13. Winter Sun

    Winter Sun Well-Known Member

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    It’s the same thing. All miscarriages are expelled.
     
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  14. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Not the same thing.
     
  15. Winter Sun

    Winter Sun Well-Known Member

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    If it’s not a miscarriage then what is it?
     
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  16. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    In this case over dose
     
  17. Winter Sun

    Winter Sun Well-Known Member

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    That wasn’t proven
     
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  18. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    The ancient Romans did use anesthesia derived from opium.

    https://www.penn.museum/documents/publications/expedition/PDFs/38-2/Drugs.pdf

    https://www.rcpe.ac.uk/sites/default/files/vol30_3.1_11.pdf
     
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  19. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Are you trying to deny that malnutrition is harmful to the fetus?
     
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  20. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    If you can absolutely prove the exact foetal damage caused by Meth…..
     
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  21. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Didn’t say it was good for the child but we have FAR more evidence of the effects of foetal alcohol. If you have any research showing the teratogenic effects of meth would love to see them
     
  22. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    It would be easy to prove wouldn't it I'm sure they took blood.
     
  23. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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  24. Pixie

    Pixie Well-Known Member

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    I wonder what kind of mother she would have been if the child had survived, given that she didn't care one iota what she ingested while pregnant.
     
  25. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Point taken! :)
     
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