Single Payer nightmare in hell complete with death panels

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by mitchscove, Jul 16, 2017.

  1. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    Doctors can withdraw life support from a baby with a rare genetic condition against his parents’ wishes, a high court judge has ruled.

    The parents of Charlie Gard had pleaded to be able to take their son to the US for experimental treatment, saying he “deserves a chance”.

    But medical staff at Great Ormond Street Hospital in London said it was kinder for the brain damaged eight-month-old to be given end-of-life care.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/h...-rare-genetic-condition-parents-a7678436.html

    This is the world Liberal statists want us to live in. Hopefully a happy ending for Charlie, but anyone who could advocate for government controlled --- Fascist --- healthcare doesn't deserve to live.
     
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  2. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    private insurance had death panels.

    they used to be able to cut you off from insurance, meaning you were left to die.

    ObamaCare ended this disaster
     
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  3. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Don't be dense. This has nothing to do with a single payer. It was ruled to be in the best interest of the child by a court. I may or may not agree but it had nothing to do with their health care system.

    Get a grip on reality. The world makes a lot more sense.

    It is fanaticism that makes the right look like a bunch of idiots.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
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  4. VietVet

    VietVet Well-Known Member

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    This is another Terry Schiavo case where the right exploits a tragedy to try to blame sensible people who are facing reality.
    Giving false hope is not a kind thing to do.
     
  5. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    And some government employee, bureaucrat, gets to determine what the best interest of the child is ,,, just like Hitler. Just hand over control of your family and its choices to the government. Please post the clause in the Constitution that transfers existential control of our lives and the lives of our children to an all powerful government.

    This is what single payer is about.
     
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  6. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    And how many times are you going to continue repeating this falsehood?
     
  7. Sam Bellamy

    Sam Bellamy Well-Known Member

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    This is the ugly truth behind socialized medicine. There are a few countries who have done it right, but most are like the UK, ****.
     
  8. Deckel

    Deckel Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Pretty much. If this had been about saving money, they would have had that kid discharged and on the first ambulance to the airport as soon as the parents requested the transfer.
     
  9. Sam Bellamy

    Sam Bellamy Well-Known Member

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    Neither is the government ordering you to kill your baby. You may disagree with their parental approach, but it's still their child.
     
  10. logical1

    logical1 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We have a great example of socialize medicine in England where their national health care wants to kill the young baby that has been in the news.

    Well on Fox news any way. The left wing media hardly mentions this because it shows socializes medicine's death panel in action.


















    e
     
  11. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's not conservatives running around claiming people are going to die by simply moving healthcare in the US to a paradigm that worked for years.

    It is those who consider themselves geniuses who believe that creating infinite demand for a finite resource makes them sensible. Those are the same people who believe that insurance subscribers who can't afford their deductible or co-pay actually have health insurance.

    Analysis: 68% of patients with bills of $500 or less didn't pay full statement in 2016

    An increasing number of patients fail to pay their full hospital bills, according to a TransUnion Healthcare analysis.

    TransUnion said the analysis includes data from hundreds of thousands of patient files from several hospitals nationwide.

    The analysis found a vast majority (approximately 68 percent) of patients with bills of $500 or less did not pay the full statement balance during 2016. That's up from 53 percent in 2015 and 49 percent the year prior.

    Additionally, 99 percent of patients with bills of $3,000 or more did not pay the full statement balance during 2016, and 85 percent of patients with bills of $500 to $1,000 did not pay the full statement balance during that time period, according to the analysis.

    On the other hand, the number of patients who paid their hospital bills in part decreased from about 90 percent in 2015 to 77 percent in 2016, TransUnion said.

    http://www.beckershospitalreview.co...r-less-didn-t-pay-full-statement-in-2016.html

    "There are many reasons why more patients are struggling to make their healthcare payments in full, the most prominent of which are higher deductibles and the increase in patient responsibility from 10 percent to 30 percent over the last few years," said Jonathan Wiik, author of Healthcare Revolution: The Patient is the New Payer, and also principal for healthcare revenue cycle management at TransUnion, in a news release. "This shift in healthcare payments has been taking place for well over a decade, but we are seeing more pronounced changes in how hospital bills are paid during just the last few years."
     
  12. TCassa89

    TCassa89 Well-Known Member

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    You're deliberately misrepresenting the case to make a political point. This isn't simply a matter of the doctors deciding the child should not live because he has brain damage. The doctors have come to the conclusion that the child's condition is so severe that he will never recover, and will never be able to live without being plugged into a machine. There is one doctor in the US who wants to practice an experimental procedure on the child for a large sum of money, but there is no knowing if this procedure will actually work, because it has never successfully be done before.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
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  13. mitchscove

    mitchscove Well-Known Member Donor

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    There no case. In my country, there are two ways to transfer authority over existential medical decisions to another person or doctor. The first is medical power of attorney; the second is advance directive. Liberty is being able to choose or choosing to let others decide.
     
  14. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    That is just a bad court ruling in the UK and gives doctors too much choice over their patients and is more of a moral problem not a problem with single-payer. While these system do have their problems like less innovations, long lines and wait times, and shortages, they insure healthcare to 100% of people and avoid the crushing cost and often debt of American healthcare and have 2 1/2 times less the cost.
     
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  15. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

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    No, an entire panel of doctors, all of whom agree that any further treatment will have no chance of success and will only prolong suffering, made the decision.

    The parents want to further torture their child when there is zero hope so they can feel better.
     
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  16. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

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    Not to mention that experimental procedure isn't even designed to treat the condition Charlie Gard has.
     
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  17. VietVet

    VietVet Well-Known Member

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    As I said - The Terry Schiavo case all over again. A tragedy being exploited and misrepresented to make political points.
     
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  18. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

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    The one thing I notice in cases like this is how little faith the religious actually have. They act like someone dying is the worst thing that can possibly happen to them while at the same time going on and on about how great Heaven is.
     
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  19. MMC

    MMC Well-Known Member

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    Then why are they starting to fail? UK, France, and don't even think about mentioning Canada. Just why are their costs starting to become unsustainable?

    Oh hows those longer wait times able to say they haven't caused peoples deaths? Or treating something that could be treated into something worse and costing more to be treated.
     
  20. VietVet

    VietVet Well-Known Member

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    Very true.
    And so much for the mercy of their imaginary friend.
     
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  21. tkolter

    tkolter Well-Known Member

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    Someone must say NO to keep costs down I have a Medicaid HMO and they say no to often enough to know some things I shouldn't even consider asking for but my doctor still tries just in case they might say yes.
     
  22. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    They are failing and their costs are unsustainable? Their costs are growing much more slowly than the US and are far smaller.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  23. MMC

    MMC Well-Known Member

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    France, the UK, and Canada all saying they had the best. What happened? Oh that's Right, they didn't see their recessions and that more people would end up having more chronic health problems. Now cutting back on benefits. Sure didn't take long, huh?
     
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  24. MMC

    MMC Well-Known Member

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    :roll:


    France's Health-Care System Is Going Broke - Bloomberg
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-01-03/frances-health...


    French Health Care Expert: France's System Broken, …
    www.newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/lynn-davidson/2007/08/27/french...

    Canadian Health Care Isn't As Good As You Think It Is
    www.huffingtonpost.ca/michael-bolen/canadian-health-care-ranking_b...

    If Universal Health Care Is The Goal, Don't Copy Canada
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2014/06/13/if-universal...
     
  25. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    All that is happening is that their government isn't raising enough money to handle the costs, but their costs are still far less than in the US. Imperfections in other systems isn't proof they are bad as our problems are much much worse and have been long before Obamacare.
     

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