Six Oath Keepers convicted in connection with January 6 US Capitol riot

What they planned was their riot inside of the Capitol. What was not planned were any other steps, and what was never indicated was some plan to interfere with the government. Again, the defense attorneys pointed out that not a single witness(that also means for the prosecution) was able to illustrate that fact.

Indeed, if you look at Metha's reasoning, it essentially says "Yeah, you say that but it's hard to believe so nope."

Which again, makes a trial pointless. If Meas rea is simply "what we believe the defendant to have logically done" then that just defies the meaning meas rea.

There was no seditious plot against the government. There was a plot to infilitrate the building, but that was never in question(I mean, no ****, it's on camera.). The key here is to elaborate some anti-government scheme. They couldn't, so they settled on 'it's what we believe, and our beliefs trump your beliefs'.

Which is fine they have that power. But it's not a fact in evidence. It's just how they choose to read the evidence.

 

Here's a perfect example of what I mean: "Hang Mike Pence!". I have a question for the prosecution: Why weren't there any attempted murder charges? The threat is credible enough, given that they're there. If we agree with the prosecution's logic, then surely there must have been enough for an attempted murder charge!

I'll give you the answer: There's no meaningful illustration of meas rea(IE: They didn't specifically look for Pence, the hanging effigy, such as it was, was incapable of hanging anything.). But if Metha believes that the weapons across the potomac should apply(ie: Virginia) then I would submit to him this is no different.

But the prosecution didn't go that route, they lacked the specificity necessary to actually win a conviction. And for those same reasons, I didn't think they'd win the seditious conspiracy either. Because plotting to go inside of the building, and plotting for a specific outcome are two very different things.

The 'plot to interfere with the government', is basically inferred after the fact by the prosecution and by His Honor. And fine, they can read into that inference but that doesn't make it an absolute fact of what happened. Even in their own words, 'we the jury FIND'.

It's not an absolute, it's just what the court thinks.

 

whataboutism.

Yeah, you say this. While ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...2e8b7e-8d65-11eb-a730-1b4ed9656258_story.html

Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes exchanged a 97-second call with someone helping to lead a helmeted formation of Oath Keepers members and associates nine minutes before the group pushed past police and broken doors to force its way into the Capitol on Jan. 6, U.S. prosecutors alleged for the first time.

“The founding generation Sons of Liberty stormed the mansion of the corrupt Royal Governor of Massachusetts, and trashed the place. . . . We are actually in a far more deadly situation given the FACT that enemies foreign and domestic have subverted, infiltrated, and taken over near every single office and level of power in this nation. We have one FINAL chance to get Trump to do his job and his duty. Patriots entering their own Capitol to send a message to the traitors is NOTHING compared to what’s coming if Trump doesn’t take decisive action right now. It helped to send that message to HIM. He was the most important audience today. I hope he got the message."

 

And, what part of this proves a conspiracy exactly?(if anything, the fact that Trump didn't take any action(whatsoever, as Liberals have pointed out) shows that this conspiracy, such as it was, was harbrained at best. But, at the very LITERAL taking of the evidence, we can take 'Patriots entering their own capitol to send a message to the traitors' as quite literal. They entered the capitol as a demonstration of a show of force.

This is again illegal, it's rioting and trespassing, etc(and the various crimes associated with it.). In fact "It helped to send that message to HIM. He was the most important audience today. I hope he got the message."

There's so much we can read into(that goes against the conspiracy notion). One, that to reiterate the goal was less about 'disrupting the electoral count', as it was to get Trump to say enact martial law or something of the sort.(Indeed, there's clarification by Rhodes to such an effect.). Now, mind you such a goal had ZERO chance of success because even the green bay plan indicated that such a contingency would only take place after the 'votes would be contested'(which would be done legislatively) in order to seize the ballot boxes to be counted.

But ergo, even taking that into account the idea of Trump enacting martial law seems less important at this point(meas rea) as it is that Trump sees it and acts on it.

Indeed, the word 'message' is implied twice. One to the capitol, and one to Trump. Now I'd ask the prosecution, whereas the evidence is overwhelming in my argument, where is the evidence for their conspiracy? It's largely conjecture. That they themselves accepted, which is fine. But it was not literal.

 

All of it.
The first part is that he planned it.
The second part is why.

 

Planned what? To enter the capitol building, and if we take it at face value. It was to send a message to the capitol, and to send a message to Trump. and that's fine, but that's not what the prosecution(or you) allege. They alleged there was some conspiracy to intervene with the count(rather then that being an after-the-fact happening) in order to contest the elections.

And there is nothing, in any of the prosecution's claims that backs that up. Again, it is conjecture. It's taking the fact that the count was interfered with, as though it were the intended plan all along. Which is substituting the defendant's frame of mind, from what actually took place.

Why are we then, holding a trial? No, seriously. There's no reason for any trials if the evidence which contradicts the prosecution can either be ignored, or explained away.

 

The first part is that they indeed communicated about entering it, and than it's on vid that they did.

It's not since he did not win the elections.

 

Whether he won or not isn't the point(we're all aware that we have the worst POTUS in our history in office, it doesn't need repeating.). The point is, the government could not establish other than way by conjecture of this seditious plot.(and yes, their incendinary language didn't help any)

But if conjecture is evidence, then we've really reached a new low of trial evidence in my opinion.

 

No remorse doesn't help at sentencing.


'More Oath Keepers convicted of sedition in US Capitol attack face sentencing'

Source: Reuters

WASHINGTON, June 1 (Reuters) - Two more members of the far-right Oath Keepers militant group are set to be sentenced on Thursday for seditious conspiracy and other crimes arising from the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol by then-President Donald Trump's supporters.

Federal prosecutors are asking U.S. District Judge Amit Mehta to sentence Roberto Minuta and Edward Vallejo to 17 years in prison each after they were convicted in January alongside two other Oath Keepers members. If the judge follows that recommendation, those would be the second-longest sentences for any of the 1,000-plus people charged in the Capitol attack that was intended to block Congress from certifying Democrat Joe Biden's November 2020 election victory over the Republican Trump.

Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes, convicted in November of seditious conspiracy and other charges, was sentenced by Mehta last week to 18 years in prison, the longest of any of the sentences. Three co-defendants of Rhodes were given between four and 12 years in prison. Two of those three were acquitted of seditious conspiracy - is a felony charge involving attempting "to overthrow, put down or to destroy by force the government of the United States" - but convicted on other felony counts.

Minuta, who provided a security detail to Trump ally Roger Stone during political rallies on the day of the attack, entered the Capitol with other Oath Keepers and, according to prosecutors, pushed past police officers while screaming obscene language. In their sentencing memo, prosecutors said Minuta has failed to accept responsibility and has "continued to spread lies and sow distrust in the criminal investigation" by referring to himself and other Jan. 6 defendants as "political prisoners."

Read more: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/mo...us-capitol-attack-face-sentencing-2023-06-01/


Roberto Minuta with Roger Stone

 

Sadly for these OathKeepers when it comes to their sentencing they weren't charged with "Incursion"


'Prosecutors seek 17-year sentence for Arizona defendant in Jan. 6 attack'
snip:

'While Rhodes and most of the others were on the Capitol, Vallejo waited in a hotel across the Potomac River in Arlington, Virginia, as part of what prosecutors said was designed to be a heavily armed “quick reaction force.” He had supplies of firearms and 30-days worth of food ready.

According to court documents, Vallejo messaged fellow Oath Keepers as they breached the Capitol, reminding them that the “QRF” was outfitted and to “just say the word” to activate them.

In their sentencing report, prosecutors said the Oath Keepers “are unlike any of the hundreds of others who have been sentenced for their roles in the attack on the Capitol. Each defendant therefore deserves a significant sentence of incarceration.”

But Vallejo’s attorney said in response to the government’s sentencing request that prosecutors’ claims that Vallejo was some kind of “QRF leader” are baseless. Unlike the other defendants, Vallejo “was not there, did nothing violent, opposed the destruction of Capitol property, and did nothing to hinder the investigation,” his attorneys said.


cont;
https://www.kgun9.com/news/local-ne...entence-for-arizona-defendant-in-jan-6-attack

 

Not bad, all things considered.

Oath Keeper convicted of sedition in US Capitol attack sentenced to 4.5 years
Source: Reuters

WASHINGTON, June 1 (Reuters) - Far-right Oath Keepers militant group member Roberto Minuta was sentenced to four and a half years in prison on Thursday after he was convicted of seditious conspiracy and other crimes arising from the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol by then-President Donald Trump's supporters.

"You can feel a way about a government and about the way it's treating its citizens without resorting to violence," U.S. District Judge Amit Mehta said. "That is why you find yourself where you are today." Minuta's sentencing comes just one week after Mehta sentenced Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes to 18 years in prison following his November conviction for seditious conspiracy and other charges.

Rhodes received the longest prison term handed down to any of the 1,000-plus people charged in the attack that was intended to block Congress from certifying Democrat Joe Biden's election victory over Republican Trump. Mehta is due to sentence Minuta's co-defendant Edward Vallejo at 1:30 p.m. ET on Thursday.

Minuta, who provided a security detail to Trump ally Roger Stone during political rallies on the day of the attack, entered the Capitol with other Oath Keepers and, according to prosecutors, pushed past police officers while screaming obscene language.

Read more: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/mo...us-capitol-attack-face-sentencing-2023-06-01/

 

Yep...Deranged leadership from Trump on down.


'Deranged leadership’: Oath Keeper who entered Capitol on Jan. 6 turns on Stewart Rhodes'

Roberto Minuta, the third Jan. 6 defendant to be sentenced for seditious conspiracy, got 4.5 years in prison.'

snip

"Roberto Minuta, one of more than a dozen Oath Keepers who surged with a mob into the Capitol on Jan. 6, lashed out at the group’s founder, Stewart Rhodes, on Thursday as he prepared to face sentencing for his conviction on seditious conspiracy.

Minuta said Rhodes was part of a “deranged leadership” that turned the Oath Keepers “into a political ‘rah-rah Trump’ disaster” that duped many of the group’s members into criminal activity.

“I was misled and naive,” Minuta said, shortly before U.S. District Court Judge Amit Mehta sentenced him to 4½ years in prison.

Mehta credited Minuta’s comments and expressions of remorse for his actions but said his efforts to downplay his actions and involvement were belied by his clear violent intentions in the weeks preceding Jan. 6.

“Steeping yourself and cloaking yourself in this tradition of the founders and violent uprising and believing that the Second Amendment allows individual citizens to gather up arms to battle their government?” Mehta said. “The law doesn’t permit that.”

cont:
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/06/01/oath-keeper-sentencing-minuta-rhodes-00099681

 

Also being sentenced today.
He may get more than the 4.5
Waiting by the phone with a stash of weapons doesn't look too promising.
If he wasn't part of discussions/calls with Oathkeepers before he arrived then who was he expecting to call him to come on down with the goods? lol

'Edward Vallejo, a longtime Valley resident who was also convicted of seditious conspiracy, is expected to be sentenced later today. Prosecutors said he was a leader of a “Quick Reaction Force” that stashed guns at a Virginia hotel and was prepared to bring them to Washington if called. The weapons were never deployed.

A day after the riot, Vallejo, a U.S. Army veteran, traveled into Washington to “conduct surveillance” and “probe the defense line” of police and National Guard troopers protecting the Capitol, according to prosecutors. He later tried to meet up with Rhodes in Texas.

Defense attorney Matthew Peed said Vallejo wasn’t part of any Oath Keepers calls or discussions before he arrived in the Washington area a day before the riot. In court papers, his attorney called prosecutors’ argument that the Oath Keepers should be sentenced as terrorists “borderline offensive.”



https://azcapitoltimes.com/news/202...-roger-stone-before-jan-6-attack-gets-prison/

 

2 Lucky guys today after the other crew got sentenced, 12-18 yr sentences.
Don't know if today's 3 and 4.5 yr sentences will be appealed.
Money is a factor too.



'Arizona man gets 3 years in prison for role in Jan. 6 attack'

Edward Vallejo was convicted of seditious conspiracy in connection with the Jan. 6 attack at the U.S. Capitol.(Arizona's Family)
By AZFamily Digital News Staff and The Associated Press
Published: Jun. 1, 2023 at 5:44 PM EDT|Updated: 46 minutes ago


WASHINGTON (AP/3TV/CBS 5) — An Arizona man was sentenced to three years behind bars followed by one year of home confinement for his role in U.S. Capitol riots on Jan. 6, 2021. Edward Vallejo, a U.S. Army veteran from Phoenix, oversaw an Oath Keeper “Quick Reaction Force” at a Virginia hotel that was prepared to deploy an arsenal of weapons into Washington if needed, authorities say.

Vallejo was convicted in January of seditious conspiracy, the most serious charge the Justice Department has brought in the Jan. 6 attack. U.S. District Judge Amit Mehta told Vallejo that he can’t conspire to “undo” the results of an election just because he and his cohorts believed the process failed them.

“It can’t be that dozens of judges got it wrong,” he said, referring to the judges who rejected legal challenges after the 2020 election brought by Trump and his Republican allies. “If you believe in the system, if you believe in democracy, you take the good with the bad.”

Vallejo told the judge his life has been destroyed and he regrets ever associating himself with Rhodes. “I assure you that I’m not a traitor or a terrorist,” he said, fighting back tears. “I’ve learned my lesson and keeping my big mouth shut.”


cont:
https://www.azfamily.com/2023/06/01/arizona-man-gets-3-years-prison-role-jan-6-attack/

 

Very well said. There is a difference between something that can be proven, and something that just “feels” obvious. Conjecture should never be the sole line of evidence utilized in the prosecution and yet this was the case here.

 

To that point, the judge(who should never ever again claim impartiality regarding this case.) has flung on his own precedent, handing down significantly lower sentences and again, it would appear that remorse contrary to what @Izzy said is a HUGE factor given the discrepency between what the DOJ asked, and what was handed out to Rhodes and these others.

It would appear to me, that it was far less about the facts of the case as much as the political importance of calling it a seditious conspiracy. Which is funny, this government wants the people to believe it was seriously attacked and undermined. It actually wants to take that vulnerable looking position. That's a hoot, I've never seen a government want to willingly look vulnerable to its citizens.

 

Do you see a list of what they actually did, or only the listing of the criminal charges?

In other words, do you really "think for yourself", as your user name implies?

 

what did the ANTIFA radical attorneys get for throwing firebombs into police cars?

 

Victim mentality is so desirable even our govt partakes

 

Dropping this here.

"PATRIOTS 45 MAGA Gang,"

"Ahead of his sentencing, Rodriguez spoke for about 20 minutes in a rambling speech, saying he “truly” thought a civil war was going to begin and that he believed the Proud Boys and Oath Keepers formed because police were standing down across the country. He acknowledged his actions against Fanone, but stopped short of an apology.'



'Jan. 6 rioter who electroshocked D.C. Officer Michael Fanone sentenced to 12.5 years'
Source: NBC News

WASHINGTON — A Donald Trump supporter who drove a stun gun into the neck of a D.C. police officer who was abducted by the mob during the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol was sentenced to 12.5 years in prison on Wednesday.

Daniel "D.J." Rodriguez, a California man who traveled to D.C. with fellow Trump supporters who belonged to a Telegram group called the "PATRIOTS 45 MAGA Gang," pleaded guilty in February to felony conspiracy, obstruction of an official proceeding, tampering with documents or proceedings, and inflicting bodily injury on officers using a deadly or dangerous weapon. "There will be blood," Rodriguez wrote in "MAGA Gang" Telegram chat on the night of Jan. 5, just hours before attending Trump's rally at the White House Ellipse. "Welcome to the revolution.”

On Jan. 6, after joining the fight in the Capitol's lower west tunnel — where some of the most violent scenes of the day played out — Rodriguez attacked officer Michael Fanone, later bragging about his actions in the Telegram chat. “Omg I did so much f---ing s--- [right now] and got away,” Rodriguez wrote to fellow members of the Patriots 45 MAGA Gang. “Tazzed the f--- out of the blue.”

U.S. District Judge Amy Berman Jackson imposed Rodriguez's sentence on Wednesday. Fanone, speaking during Rodriguez's sentencing hearing, called Rodriguez's life story "pathetic" and said he lost his career, friends, and faith in the criminal justice system because of what he went through that day.'

Read more: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/ju...cer-michael-fanone-sentenced-125-ye-rcna89388

 

Keep on defending your 1/6ers. Started their GoFundMe yet?

 

Keep defending murderers. How much money have you given to bail bond funds?

 

You can't show me where I'm defending murders, but I can show where you're defending this 1/6 trash. Wanna bet?

 

Another reminder for you, in case you forgot about this incident.

https://news.yahoo.com/capitol-rioter-shocked-police-officer-175325500.html
A California man who drove a stun gun into a police officer's neck during one of the most violent clashes of the U.S. Capitol riot was sentenced on Wednesday to more than 12 years in prison.

 

Rhodes threw the victim card into the goose and gander thingy.



'Oath Keeper Leader Stewart Rhodes Warns Trump of Pending Jan 6 Probe: ‘You’re Going to Be Found Guilty’'


'Rhodes, a Yale Law School graduate and former Army paratrooper who founded the Oath Keepers militia group in 2009, said the federal government is working to turn Mr. Trump’s inner circle against him and scare off potential witnesses for the former president’s defense.

“They’re going to do the same thing to President Trump that they did to me,” Rhodes told The Washington Times from the D.C. Department of Corrections Central Detention Facility, where he is kept in isolation.

He sent a grave warning to Mr. Trump: “You’re going to get railroaded. You’re going to be found guilty if you try to go to trial. So everyone’s been demoralized and more likely to take a plea deal and agree to ‘test-a-lie’ against President Trump.”

Trump is reportedly facing more charges from Special Counsel Jack Smith, who is investigating the former president’s role in the attack on the Capitol on January 6th, in addition to the alleged mishandling of classified documents and the obstruction of justice that followed suit.'

cont:
https://www.mediaite.com/trump/oath...g-jan-6-probe-youre-going-to-be-found-guilty/