Standards lowered to produce first female Green Beret.....

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by MMC, Dec 2, 2017.

  1. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Obviously a lot of men must have died because of that woman if others are correct. How many deaths did that woman cause?
     
  2. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Male or female monkey? :xd:
     
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  3. camp_steveo

    camp_steveo Well-Known Member

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    It had to be a male....LMAO
     
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  4. Right is the way

    Right is the way Well-Known Member

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    All I said is that is sucks having women in your unit. Imo.
     
  5. camp_steveo

    camp_steveo Well-Known Member

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    We never had them, but I heard about it. Slow runs, no challenge.

    I will say this though. We had a couple of females on our FOB that we would take on patrol with us to search female locals. They were no problem. We also took a civil affairs team with a female into our sector sometimes and she was no problem. That said, they were being escorted by us. They were not doing our job, not saying they couldn't.
     
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  6. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Perfect example. The claim is being made that if any role can be found that women can not meet - such as fast marching or running 20 miles with a 120 pack, then women should be allowed no role whatsoever. By that logic, since that was a mission task the men couldn't, the same logic says no man should be allowed any role.
     
  7. Greataxe

    Greataxe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    But then you provide no studies of women attempting to do modern infantry combat tasks.
    Here is a study proving how even having a small number of women in combat units causes them to suffer:

    The Marine Corps just released a year-long study testing whether women can survive the rough, grueling world of ground combat. The details are stark. All male units outperformed mixed-gender units across the board. Here's the decision Marine leaders have to make now - ask the Pentagon to still bar women from ground combat or push for tougher physical standards to let them in. Here's NPR's Tom Bowman.

    TOM BOWMAN, BYLINE: The Marine Corps created a battalion of 100 women and 300 men last fall to test whether opening up jobs in the infantry, artillery and armor to women is a good idea. NPR went along. They carried heavy packs and mounted patrols, shot at targets and dug fighting holes, practiced pulling the wounded to safety.

    BOWMAN: Others changed massive tires on armored vehicles, while still others loaded artillery shells.

    PAUL JOHNSON: Those are measurements of things that we believe impact combat effectiveness.

    JOHNSON: In 93 out of 134 tasks that we tested across the MOS's, the all-male groups outperformed the integrated groups.

    BOWMAN: And those task basically tell how good a unit is in fighting the enemy. Johnson's study found that male-only squads, teams and crews outperform those mixed with males and females. Today, a four-page synopsis of the study was released, and the Marines says the full study will be released soon.

    All-male units were faster in moving to a target, the study found, especially with a heavy weapon like a machine gun. They also had more hits on target and at a faster rate. And the number of females in those mixed-gender units was small. They tested with one woman, then two women. The numbers were kept low to reflect this reality. Women make up just 7 percent of the Marine Corps.

    The study pointed to what it called notable differences in the amount of time it took an all-male unit to evacuate a wounded Marine compared to a mix-gender unit. In addition, women had trouble climbing over a barrier with their packs and often needed assistance. And they suffered more injuries, like stress fractures from carrying heavy packs. Still, the Marines included no specific time differences in the synopsis, and they said the findings do not necessarily mean that women should be barred from ground combat.
    https://www.npr.org/2015/09/10/4392...ase-results-of-study-on-women-in-combat-units

    So even a few women in a combat unit will cause it to be less effective 70% of the time.

    Stupid is as stupid does.

     
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  8. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    delete
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  9. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    delete
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  10. Greataxe

    Greataxe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Using your silly logic, if you were doing a drug study, and the drug caused adverse reactions or death 70% of the time over a standard drug---would you approve the drug?

    Would you also want our troops to use tanks, jets and other equipment that was 40% weaker and could not do as much 70% of the time?

    If you had to defend your own life with a gun, would you carry one that jammed more often, held less ammo, and fired weaker rounds?

    I'll name you one example right here. Jessica Lynch.

    In the interview, Lynch also clears up conflicting stories about her actions during the March 23 ambush in which Lynch was taken prisoner. Initial reports portrayed the Army supply clerk, then 19, as a hero who was wounded by Iraqi gunfire but kept firing until her ammunition ran out, shooting several Iraqis.

    "I did not shoot, not a round, nothing," she tells Sawyer. "When we were told to lock and load, that's when my weapon jammed … I did not shoot a single round … I went down praying to my knees. And that's the last I remember."

    Nine American soldiers were killed in the firefight.
    http://abcnews.go.com/Primetime/story?id=132434&page=1

    She was also anally raped and now has to crap into a bag.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/nov/07/usa.iraq
     
  11. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You just presented nothing but simple minded nonsense. Obviously you drive a semi-truck 18 wheeler, because the concept of different vehicles for different tasks is just too complicated. 5 white people fail a drug test - so never hire a white person - your logic.

    Lynch got no one killed. Her M16 jammed and she had been knocked unconscious in crash - her testimony. Your claim that she brought her own personal M16 - picking it out herself refusing a better rifle - is absurdly false and desperate on your part.

    HEY GUYS! Is he right? Did the Army or Marines take you to a room of 50 different caliber and model of rifles saying "each of you pick out the one you want and grab all the magazines and ammo you want." ? Greatax says that's how it works.

    Male POWs are anally raped- and worse - too. All her experience proved is that women in combat will suffer all that men suffer.

    What made her greatness is her willingness to testify that all the trying to make her some great hero was BS. She was just a soldier. Knocked unconscious in an attack like thousands of male soldiers. Not rare M-16 jam. Broken bones wounds like male soldiers suffer. Tortured as are male POWs. Her greatness was that she was a soldier, not that she is a female - and that was her sworn view of it.

    Still waiting for an example.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  12. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    For once in this thread, I agree!
     
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  13. Greataxe

    Greataxe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Pvt Lynch was a low-level soldier in a maintenance company. However, like ALL soldiers she was responsible to keep her rifle clean and maintained. She was too incompetent to do that. She was also too poorly trained and motivated to know how to clear a malfunction.

    Only a fool would drive into a combat zone without keeping one's rifle cleaned checked and ready daily. Her best friend, another female, was also captured alive, and later died.

    HEY GUYS! Does anyone else in here agree with much of anything he is ranting about?
     
  14. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    By following the links one can view that actual results of the Marine Corps study. Political correctness in the name of diversity will result in Marines bleeding and being killed and being defeated on the battlefield.



    “Survivability and Lethality” in Battle

    CMR Analyzes USMC Women in Combat Research Data: Part II

    After four years of comprehensive Marine Corps research, results clearly show that the case for women in direct ground combat still has not been made. In fact, tests have produced highly credible, reality-based, empirical data that discredits theories about gender equality in the combat arms.

    This is the unmistakable message conveyed in a significant memorandum signed by Brig. Gen. George W. Smith, Jr., Director of the Marine Corps Force Innovation Office at Quantico, VA, which the Center for Military Readiness has analyzed here:

    Interim CMR Special Report – Part II, Section A

    U.S. Marine Corps Research Finding: Where Is the Case for Co-Ed Ground Combat?

    General Smith’s 14-page August 18, 2015, memorandum to the Commandant of the Marine Corps, released with 19 additional pages, included consequential facts and empirical data resulting from Ground Combat Element Integrated Task Force (GCEITF) operations at Marine bases on the west coast. For nine months, the task force conducted professionally-monitored field exercises designed to analyze direct ground combat units such as the infantry, armor, artillery, and Special Operations Forces.

    Researchers from the University of Pittsburgh worked with GCEITF officials to scientifically measure the individual physical capabilities and unit performance of hundreds of male and female volunteers divided into units. Some teams remained all-male, while others were integrated with female volunteers who qualified by meeting the same physical requirements as the men.

    In a presentation to the Defense Advisory Committee on Women in the Services (DACOWITS) on September 18, 2014, Marine Col. Anne Weinberg, Deputy Director of the Marine Corps Innovation Office, noted that the “purpose-built” task force was designed to test a simple Research Study Hypothesis that would be tested via operational evaluations: “[A]n integrated unit under gender-neutral standards will perform equally as well as a gender-restricted unit."

    To qualify for participation, both men and women had to meet the same minimum standards for men in physical fitness (PFT) and combat fitness tests (CFT). Far from being “average,” the female task force volunteers were exceptionally strong and well-prepared to succeed.

    Despite positive expectations, task force data and findings failed to prove the hypothesis.

    Quoting briefing slides accompanying the Smith memo, “All-male task force teams outperformed their mixed-gender counterparts in 69 percent (93 of 134) ground combat tasks. . . .[Physical differences were more pronounced in] “specialties that carried the assault load plus the additional weight of crew-served weapons and ammunition.”

    In addition, women suffered injuries at rates double those of men, and enlisted women who successfully completed training at the Infantry Training Battalion suffered six times more injuries than men.

    As stated in the Smith memo and findings, factors such as “speed and tempo, lethality, readiness, survivability, and cohesion [are] critical components to fighting and winning in direct ground combat.” In this environment, “speed is a weapon.”

    Survivability and lethality -- two factors that the Marines identified as most important for successful accomplishment of ground combat missions -- define the very purpose of the Marine Corps. It matters, therefore, that “[G]ender-integrated teams, squads, or crews demonstrated, with few exceptions, degraded performance in the time to complete tasks, move under load, and achieve timely effects on target as compared to all-male teams, squads, or crews.”

    These results are not anomalous: Numerous research projects conducted by United States researchers and by the British Ministry of Defence have produced similar findings that reflect physical realities, not theories.

    As reported in this CMR Policy Analysis, British gender-integration research pointed to “a reduced lethality rate [among women], in that combat marksmanship degrades as a result of fatigue when the combat load increases in proportion to body weight and strength.” The Israeli Defense Force (IDF) also decided recently to keep their armored units all-male.

    In addition, U.S. Army Medical Command documents, which CMR obtained via FOIA, revealed injury rates among women averaging twice those of men. These are physical realities that cannot be ignored or mitigated, even with extra training and conditioning.

    Sources -> https://www.cmrlink.org/issues/full...orities-survivability-and-lethality-in-battle


     
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  15. Greataxe

    Greataxe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    JJ lives in a fantasyland. He couldn't care less.
     
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  16. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    All your message does is give one of the reasons why divorce rates in the military are so high. In your rabid contempt of women in your messages, you show ZERO personal integrity or honesty. NONE whatsoever. When I pointed out the absurdity of your claiming SHE picked what rifle she was carrying and how much ammo - you rushed to change your claim to "dirty rifle" - thinking no one will see what you did.

    THIS IS WHAT YOU POSTED:

    WHAT ME TO QUOTE YOUR ENTIRE MESSAGE?

    I saved it figuring you'd try to delete it after I asked all who served it the military to give their opinion.

    Saved your message so from here on just how incompetent and absurd your messages are that 100% of people who ever served in the military would recognize - the absurdity of your claim people in the military get to pick which rifle, which caliber and how much ammo they carry. The absolute stupidity combined then with the cowardly, dishonest attempt to cover it up shows no one should believe ANYTHING that you post - ever.


    There is exactly nothing indicating her rifle was dirty, nothing all all. Rifles hit by RPGs tend to not function, plus she had been knocked unconscious and had broken bones.

    ALL,even who served in the military and do not think women should be in combat, should 100% condemn you. TOTALLY curse you. She was a soldier hit by an RPG. Broken bones, Knocked unconscious. Ruined rifle. Captured. Tortured. And you post false absurdities everyone knows is absurdly fast - and then a cowardly message to try to erase that absurdity by most still more false crap.

    Regardless of opposition to females in combat, NO REAL soldier would post such false crap aganst a severely wounded and tortured POW, then you ducking to cover that up with more false crap, to attack an wounded, tortured POW who was one who did make it home with messages - one after another - that EVERYONE knows is false - just to spit on a wounded POW because she's female..

    If you were alive, I bet you spit on returning Vietnam vets and POWs too and rant that John McCain should have picked a different aircraft and it went down because he had not cleaned the fuel lines - and other absurd BS crap against wounded and POW veterans.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  17. Greataxe

    Greataxe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't hate women, as I've been married to the same woman for decades. However, women make poor NFL linebackers, and poor infantry combat soldiers. If women were so equal, have one of equal weight go in a fight up against a man in pro boxing or Mixed martial arts.

    All units have someone called an armorer.

    https://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-.../mechanics/small-arms-artillery-repairer.html

    Any soldier with common sense would at least be doing a function check after they were given their rifle. I would cycle a few rounds through my weapon daily (without firing them) to make sure my rifle worked when in the combat zone. If it didn't work, then I'd turn mine in for replacement or repair. Like duh!

    Lynch said when the firing started, she tried to use her rifle but it was jammed (with sand). Then her Humvee was hit by an RGP then it wrecked.

    Silly people like you who have their arguments taken to the ground and stomped by experts, and still demand them, are most deserving of being cursed.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  18. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Greataxe was referring to the 507th Maintenance Company, POG's who were never trained being riflemen.

    Facts are since the first Gulf war, (Desert Storm) every female soldier, Marine, airman and sailor who has been captured on the battlefield has been raped by the enemy. Every one. Since we are fighting Muslims maybe even males who have been captured were also buggerized ?


    Every M-16, SAW and Ma-Duce during this fire fight had a malfunction, mostly stoppages.

    Nothing new with the M-16, they have been jamming in combat since the Vietnam War.
    Any Marine or soldier who ever been issued a M-1 Garand or M-14 would rather go into combat with the M-14 than the shitty M-16.

    These members of the 507 were not properly trained during basic training or before being deployed into combat. They were never trained on keeping their weapons clean and functioning in combat.

    They became dependent on technology like GPS and when the GPS units failed they didn't know how to read a map or use a compass, made a wrong turn and became lost.

    After action reports seems to show that the female soldiers were pissing in their panties during the fire fight. Pvt. Lynch mentions her panties numerous times, I think she pooped in her panties. You have to pucker up your ******** during a fire fight.
    It also mentions male soldiers trying to protect the female soldiers instead of killing the enemy.





    Lessons learned but never initiated...
    Every soldier should be trained being a rifleman first like where all Marines no matter what their MOS is are riflemen first.
    Co-ed basic training has to come to an end, it's a failed liberal social engineering experiment that has cause American soldiers to bleed and die on the battlefield.
    Women should not serve in combat arms !!!


     
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  19. Strasser

    Strasser Banned

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    What most of them really want is the benefits program those in the military get; this is the result of the 'volunteer military' agenda replacing the draft and attracting recruits. they wouldn't be crying about having to meet standards set for males, as women wouldn't be volunteering in the first place in such large numbers if the civilian job market was decent, and that goes for many males as well. Somewhere out there are stats for having to have PT courses for males to get up to passing the real fitness requirements as well, since it seems some 20% or more of those enlisting fail as well, iirc.
     
  20. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

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    Those high bulk "football players" tend to have a harder time in my experience on things that deal with high stamina, like ruck marches and long runs. Has to do with all that extra weight they have to lug around.

    I have actually spoken with a couple of the survivors of that mess. A few years later when the Army reorganized how units were handled, the 507th Maintenance Company became Echo Company, 5-52 AMD. They were literally less than 100 yards away from my unit at Fort Bliss.

    The problem was several things. For one, "basic rifleman" skills at that time were not taught to anybody other than infantry. This was a vehicle maintenance company, attached to a PATRIOT missile battalion. So nobody had any kind of training in the real care of their equipment, and operating in a firefight. During that war, the SOP was to attach an infantry Company to the battalion, and they provided the security needed.

    I spent 5 years in PATRIOT, and to be honest weapon care was almost always a joke. I stood out whenever we went to the field, because having been a grunt for 10 years I took such things seriously. I cleaned and lubed my weapon at least 2 times a day, more if it needed it. most would not do it a single time the entire week or two we would spend in the field. And even though 4 years later the Army was trying to instill the "Warrior" into everything, it never really took hold in non-infantry units.

    That was why my entire 5 years I was in PATRIOT, I was generally assigned to the Force Protection or Recon elements. Every 1st Sergeant knew of my being a grunt, so decided that was the best place to put me. That way at least 1 of those who was supposed to be doing security had some real fighting skills. I ended up doing a lot of training to others in those groups, things that were basic to me, like map reading and making a range card. Something that every grunt learns in their training, was completely foreign to these guys.
     
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  21. braindrain

    braindrain Newly Registered

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    Virtually nothing you have posted in this thread has been true. I don’t believe a single one of your little stories and neither will anyone one has ever spent more then a day in the military. You really should stop thinking that playing video games counts as knowledge of the military because it’s quite obvious that is where all your knowledge comes from with maybe a few fiction books thrown in.
     
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  22. braindrain

    braindrain Newly Registered

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    Just because you make up stories does not mean anyone will believe you. And that is exactly what you are doing.
    It’s pathetic
     
  23. braindrain

    braindrain Newly Registered

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    More made up stories. And getting more ridiculous by the post. If nothing else you have a good imagination. You should consider writing a book. Problem is with zero actual knowledge of the topic nothing you write is going to be believed.
     
  24. braindrain

    braindrain Newly Registered

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    Man you really should just stop. You are making a clown out of yourself. If you had any idea about the military you would be embarrassed to write such nonsense
     
  25. JakeJ

    JakeJ Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Take off your shirt, go look in a mirror and claim "I'm the man!" Listen carefully. The universe is laughing. I never play video games. But is seems clear you see yourself as a combat video game character.

    I can say with certainly some on this forum do believe my "little stories" and know vastly more than you ever did or ever will about what all the military does. However, they seem to see no reason wasting time debating ex-grunts. Rather, there is no reason to argue it since current or ex-ground combat grunts have absolutely no say on the topic anyway in reality, and become like whiny little boys on such topics as these. Posting on the forum is not the only method of communication.

    During all your time in the military, how many times did any upper ranker come to your personally or to your unit explaining the Joint Chiefs, Congress, the President, or any other policymaker wants to hear your opinion as to how to organize the US military? 0? 5, 25? 100 times. The answer to that question is the answer to the question of how relevant your opinion is to the civil or military leadership and commanders.
     

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