Sterotypinh in the gun control debate

This seems to happen a lot in this forum. I admit I have done it but really try hard no to. It's easy for us to throw people into one of these two camps:

Pro gun control: Snowflake pansy that never served his country and is so terrified of guns that he wants every single gun banned from this country

Anti gun control: Redneck who owns 50 guns and does not care if every child in America dies from gun violence as long as he can have any gun he wants at anytime and any place.

Now I would bet almost no one on hear falls into these two categories. But to hear the debate on here it would seem its easier just to lump people into one group so then you have them all figured out AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO LISTEN TO WHAT THEY SAY. My suggestion.... Make your arguments but understand every person you talk to is different. Don't shut down the debate....open it up. Some of you are quite good at it. Lets discourage the ones who are not.

Commence with the insults. Yes I did misspell the title. LOL

 

You started out well, what hindered
you ??

"Commence with the insults."

 

By such an inflammatory opening statement, you are already encouraging ill feeling in this thread.

Once you admit certain facts, there will be a true dialogue or discussion, you refuse to admit salient facts as they relate to personal Defense.
You also point to Criminal activities as a reason for stricter gun control.

Hyperbole: If Criminals disobey Laws, why have Laws ?
This question is made to obfuscate the real issues and reasoning.

Example; New York City;
Very strict Gun Laws, Criminals are Armed, Crime is high, very difficult to get Concealed carry.

Washington D.C. almost no Concealed carry for Normal People and Murder rates are very high.

Claim? More Guns = more Crime, yet s distinction is never made as to who owns the Guns causing more Crime.

The Gun Control Advocates want an across the board policy that ignores the difference between Law Abiding citizens and Criminals, so to suggest more than Gun control as a solution makes no sense.

There are already uniform Firearms Laws in place in every State, the comprehensive background check and form 4473.

Criminals are not complying with the Law that prohibits Felons from obeying the Law.

Why not deal with them, rather than demand more Gun Laws that will not affect Criminals ???

 

Why not deal with both problems?

 

Because there are not two problems, only one problem, and honestly, it is disingenuous to suggest there is more than one problem to neatly avoid dealing with the one True issue.

Make it a Felony punishable by 20 years in prison for a Felon to possess a Firearm and ammo including firearms components, to carry a Firearm concealed or openly, or conspire to purchase, mastermind purchases, or traffic Firearms or facilitate traffic or illegal sales of Firearms in any way.

 

Very well stated. Why pass more laws when the laws already in place are ignored by those supposedly the laws are meant to deter. Or it is a matter of laws aimed at the criminal element?

The reality of it all is that this whole issue is not about those criminal issues as much as control of the others. The largest criminal element in today's environment seems to be the government, all aspects of government. You know that body of chosen individual that believe they have a right to rule you as their little slaves. That body of chosen individuals that have such great ideas they have to be enforced by coercion.

People fear criminal that steal your pocket change while condoning and rejoicing over the criminals that steal half your life. People fear criminals that maim and murder not only their kind but innocent bystanders and victims but rejoice when that heavily armed goon squad becomes judge, jury and executioner.

People believe the police are to protect, however those nine mystical beings in black robes disagree, they stated it is not in the providence of the legal armed thugs to protect at all. For the most part they can only try and mop up the pieces.

People scream when there is another mass shooting without ever stopping to examine, these shooting occur in gun free zones. People scream for less guns and mass killings get ever larger.

There are those that believe limiting clip sizes mean something, it don't. I have seen competitive combat shooters using 45 cal pistols unload 18 rounds in less than 10 seconds with two clip changes. That is two rounds into nine targets every 10 seconds or 54 targets a minute.

It's all about ignorance and fear, heavy on both.

 

And how would that cure anything?

 

It won't unless you actually enforce the law. That's half of the problem. The government doesn't enforce the laws we have or allows them to be plead down to misdemeanors and then encourages more laws because the current laws aren't working.

 

That begs the question not answer it. If they are already felons, what determent is the law? If you look back to the days of the wild west, felons released from prison where given back their guns. If they didn't change their ways they either got shot or hung, the final resolution to the problem. Is that not the same scenario as today except they no longer get hung.

Prison is but the real home to many of them. My question is why do we keep giving these guys a structured vacation at our expense? Violent crimes need to be answered with either a rope or banishment to a penal colony with nothing, Australia comes to mind.

 

It is very true. I've been stereotyped as a Hillary supporter even though I voted for Trump. The debate here is very polarized and people are very quick to categorize you.

 

It is an issue that is present on both sides of any debate, in both political parties.

 

And i served ten years active duty.....but somehow am a snowflake. Lol

 

I questioned your service because of your current views, it is odd to encounter an Anti-Gun serviceman.
They do exist.

You also regaled me with an orientation based comment that was really uncalled for.

It is better to stick to the issue

 

I am not anti gun. Want to hear of my summers in Ireland as a child? Lol

 

Sure,.. if pertinent, Where?

 

My point exactly

 

That would require major prison reform. I could go on, but the short answer is to take away everything nice and make prisons as self sufficient as possible. Only weeks worked count toward a sentence. 6 day work weeks of 8 hours/day.

 

I am actually a redneck who owns 50 guns and would not sacrifice an ounce of my liberty for a metric tonne of security.

 

That would be a good start but a thought that is never mentioned, what about the victims?

 

Any criminal that has assets must pay some form of restitution before his/her sentence begins. Prisoners will grow their own crops, raise their own livestock, build furniture for government offices, and make license plates. They will have hot meals for breakfast and dinner. Lunch will be a couple of cold sandwiches and fruit. Prisoners with pertinent skills can teach as part of their labor.(reading, math, music, etc.....) Prisoners can take the classes after their work day to better their lives. There would be no more television, weight rooms, etc....... Learning will be their only escape. Lifers can rot in jail and the other prisoners will resent them because they are supported by the working prisoners

 

You sacrifice liberty every day to live in society. And you do it willingly

 

If there was some small island I could **** off to I certainly would.

 

There are many such islands. They don't get HBO though. LOL

 

I am strong supporter of the Second Amendment, yet have never owned a gun.

Does that help Vegas Giant?

 

No there aren't. Governments have claimed every square inch of habitable land on the face of the Earth. And several places not on Earth.