Stop blaming the NRA for failed gun control efforts

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by Kek, Mar 29, 2018.

  1. Kek

    Kek Member

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  2. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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  3. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
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  4. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    Actually you have a for profit corporate prison industry, a growth industry in a post-industrial society without enough livable wage jobs, complete with legislative drafting think tanks, stables of lobbyists greasing the legislative skids, stocks traded on Wall Street, and convict labor leasing which is legalized slavery. As such the industry has a vested interest in higher societal rates of crime, violence, homelessness, joblessness, poverty, poor education, broken families, mental illness, drug dependency, anything that will contribute to full/growing prison populations and the maniacally sought after linear profit margin growth to infinity. And now you have no right to Habeas Corpus.
     
  5. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Australia and the UK got to grips with gun problems, albeit just suffering a once in a blue moon incidents, but America is making a right hash of it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
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  6. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Do you imply the NRA is attacking the USA? If so, please post the links.
     
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  7. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    Part of a thread and an exchange, you missed it.
     
  8. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    If you follow the NRA publications and receive notifications you would find the devote sections updating followers on specific issues related to gun legislation at the local, state and federal levels.
    https://www.nraila.org/
    And, they provide indexes to most current law across the US.

    If anyone is leveling attacks on the US, it’s a frequent theme of yours.
     
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  9. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    Thanks so much, but you see, I was an NRA member, until they morphed into a partisanshithead political think tank operation.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
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  10. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What do you think the thousands of jihadi's in the UK on government welfare have planned?

    One of them almost pushed his way into parilament. Wait until it's 30 or 40 of them.

    Didn't they just try to assassinate May too?
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
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  11. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Don’t generalize much, or engage in hyperbole I see.
    But then, implying the NRA doesn’t focus on specific issues is dead wrong.
     
  12. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    Great. That organization has nothing to offer and no place in my life, you go on any journey ya like.
     
  13. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Ditto regarding your posts.
     
  14. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Focussing on specific proposals requires a degree of familiarity with the dynamics of civilian firearm ownership that the GCers prefer to ignore. Far easier to just rail against the oposition as 'unreasonable' and hope to pass restrictions so ignorantly subjective as to allow future ban by proxy or precedent, then call the opposition 'muderers' when it innevitably fails.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
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  15. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    Relax. America's not going to do anything, this was settled long ago; we just have to pretend we're dissatisfied with this level of slaughter and violence in our “exceptional” society. A cursorial review of our national history both at home and overseas and perusal of our current military operations abroad will relieve any and all of the illusion that americans or american society have ever had any aversion to violence.
     
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  16. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Violence is inherent to civilized society. Defensive violence, to be specific. Only domesticated societies will claim intolerance of defensive violence. Thats the difference. America remains civilized in an increasingly domesticated global community.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
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  17. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    Interesting, violence = civilization. Americans are certainly domesticated, won't argue that. Any population that will freeze in front of their televisions while their right to Habeas Corpus as stripped from them is utterly domesticated to the point where their fantasy that they will preserve their liberty with their guns is pure unadulterated poppycock. Only domesticated societies will claim state violence against the citizenry is defensive violence.
     
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  18. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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  19. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I never said americans were impervious to domestication. Just more resilient to it than most of the rest of the world.

    Your analysis of our acceptance of the loss of other rights slipping us into domestication is accurate. However, that is no argument for us to accept it further, but rather an argument to resist it harder.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
  20. Fenton Lum

    Fenton Lum Banned

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    "Just more resilient to it than most of the rest of the world."

    Yeah, we disagree there.
     
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  21. Kek

    Kek Member

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    Mind pointing out which specific gun bills you believed would have stopped these recent mass shootings? The NRA supports individuals who already align with their values, it's unlikely that those they support wouldn't vote down gun bills proposed in the past. The point of the article, and one that I agree with, is that going after the NRA isn't productive for those who actually want gun control.
     
  22. Kek

    Kek Member

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    You shouldn't compare other countries to the US when it comes to guns, there's to many things that don't line up.
    Did you know when Australia instituted their ban there were millions of SKS's (full auto) imported. To this date only around 100,000 have been turned in. Many were reported "stolen." Do you think trying to do some sort of "buyback" or banning specific guns will do anything in america, when there are hundreds of millions of firearms? We're looking at countries that have a much smaller population, no where near as many guns floating around, and completely different cultures. It's a culture problem in America, more gun control will not do anything. Nearly every recent "mass shooting" as one thing in common: all of those committing the act passed background checks or weren't stopped by the government even though there was plenty of warning (see the recent parkland shooting). Hell, in the case of sandy hook the guy just killed his mother and took her gun if i'm not mistaken. How do you propose we stop that? Let's assume we ban "high capacity magazines." Ok, we now have 10 round handgun and rifle magazines only. What do you think goes through the mind of these shooters now? Every shot needs to be a kill. I'm not even touching on the fact that if you ban "high capacity magazines" there are already so many in circulation that those who want to commit shootings will get their hands on them anyway. So we ban high capacity mags and another shooting happens, what do you do after that? Ban all rifles? Shooters use pistols now, which are responsible for the vast majority of gun violence already. What do you do when the next shooter uses a pistol and kills 20 kids? ****, what if shooters used buck shot? The point is, these terrible events are never going to stop pushing gun control. The disaster of a mental health system we have, along with the culture of violence is the root of the problem. Not guns.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2018
  23. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If you do what you've always done, you will get what you've always got.

    If you wish to site mental health, you have a society that offers dangerous weapons readily available to nutters. The problem with guns is that the Australian's, British etc.. view them as weapons, Americans view them as a symbol, often linked to being macho and glorified on screen.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2018
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  24. Kek

    Kek Member

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    I'm not saying we do nothing. If you read my post, you'll see that I point out mental health and our culture is the real problem. You've glanced over the rest of my post, which is typical of those who push for gun control. Mind telling me what gun control you think we should push? These "nutters" show no signs some of the time before they purchase guns, so they end up passing background checks, or they end up killing their mom to get a gun/etc/etc.. what regulations are going to stop that if the existing ones don't even work. You are right that guns are a big part of American culture, which isn't a bad thing in my opinion. Since 1994, private gun ownership has continued to increase, with gun related homicides decreasing in the same period.
     
  25. Nonnie

    Nonnie Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I didn't skip read it, I found a large part of it irrelevant.

    What do you need guns for? Sport and vermin control, just like most countries? Protection doesn't come into the equation.

    Australia and the UK have guns too but their dimensions, caliber size, storage, back ground checks etc.. are tightly controlled. Amnesty hand in days constantly receive banned firearms. Kids as old as 13 own shotguns, there's not age limit by UK laws. No need for hand guns in a civilised society. After the Dunblane massacre of '96, hand guns were banned and by coincidence, there's not been another incident since. If you Google UK massacres, the odd one will come up which involved shotguns. More happens in one of weekends then in 30 years in the UK or Australia, combined.
     
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