Supreme Court to review NYS gun control law

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by Turtledude, Jan 22, 2019.

  1. Xenamnes

    Xenamnes Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2015
    Messages:
    23,895
    Likes Received:
    7,537
    Trophy Points:
    113
    They have already had their chance, just as the city of Chicago and the district of columbia had their chances, and proved their ideas were abject and unconstitutional failures. They had over thirty to make their ideas work, and they could not do it.
     
    Bondo and Rucker61 like this.
  2. Vegas giants

    Vegas giants Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2016
    Messages:
    49,909
    Likes Received:
    5,343
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Well no you cant put a cop on every corner in nyc
     
  3. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,135
    Likes Received:
    4,905
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I don't know....I'm torn on this one.

    I don't particularly like the federal government interfering with states even in regards to things I personally agree with. While we all like to believe that the Constitution is "clear" and not up for interpretation we have to understand that isn't actually the case. It if were that clear then we would have no need for a US Supreme Court to make rulings on it, it's supposedly cut and dry....And it's obviously not cut and dry seeing how the folks appointed to the SC can't even always agree on it and their actual job is to be the subject matter experts on it.

    I like states rights because I like choices for citizens. Don't like NY or Cali gun laws then don't live there if it's that important to you.

    Just remember, while the SC may sometimes rule in your favor they will sometimes not rule in your favor. Be ready to accept and support the federal government implementing laws in your home state that you don't agree with if you are willing to accept them implementing laws that you like.

    If you are cool with the SC making universal gun laws on the federal level then you need to be willing to be cool with them doing something like making 3rd trimester abortion universally legal on the federal level also if they choose to do so.

    Be careful with this sort of thing....
     
    Turtledude and Richard The Last like this.
  4. Rucker61

    Rucker61 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2016
    Messages:
    9,774
    Likes Received:
    4,103
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That's the point - they want the states to have the power over one right but the federal government to have the power to override the states over other rights. It doesn't work that way, not after the 14th Amendment and certainly not after Chicago v McDonald.
     
    Ddyad and Bondo like this.
  5. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,135
    Likes Received:
    4,905
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yeah both sides of the aisle are like that though. People are usually cool with laws they particularly like and not cool with laws they don't like. And everybody always thinks "they" are right so even if they support one law but not the other they can convince themselves that they aren't being hypocritical because "they" are right but the other law they disagree with is "wrong" which is why they don't support it.

    As I've been saying for years, the best solution to America's growing division is a healthy dose of mind your own business from both sides of the spectrum. Don't like it? Don't do it. Don't like the law there? Move. Don't want their laws in your state? Then don't push for your laws in their state.

    Problem with that is once again even when talking about mind your own business everybody claims to do so "until it effects other people then we are morally obligated to no longer mind our own business".

    Here's how this usually works:

    Libs: We need strict federal gun control
    Cons: Mind your own business, if you don't like guns then don't buy one
    Libs: Guns are killing people, we are morally obligated to not mind our own business in this matter

    then we get

    Cons: We need to outlaw abortion
    Libs: Mind your own business, if you don't like abortion then don't have one
    Cons: Abortions kill people, we are morally obligated to not mind our own business in this matter

    No folks. Seriously, mind your own business....all the time.

    If you support the Federal Government overriding NY's strict gun laws and you don't even live in NY then don't start complaining if the Federal Government tells Alabama that they have to legalize abortions after 20 weeks if you live in Alabama.

    No you don't get to do one without the other without being hypocritical regardless of how "right" you personally think you are in your beliefs.

    Open up this can of worms if you want to. I'd prefer to live and let live and let the states govern these matters and tell the Feds to keep their overreach in Washington where it belongs.
     
  6. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2016
    Messages:
    15,501
    Likes Received:
    3,740
    Trophy Points:
    113
    States have power and Authority.
    People have Rights to protect them from Government oppression.
    States do not have the right to do anything at all, laws govern what a State may or may not do.

    People have had the Right to defend themselves as creatures as soon as they became sentient, long before Governments existed, Rights existed.

    The Federal Government Agency, B.A.T.F.E.
    Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is the Agency currently overseeing and enforcing Federal Firearms laws, they define laws and selectively decide how to enforce laws as well as define existing laws, an overbearing top heavy agency.

    If you want to do any business involving firearms, Interstate or Intrastate, you are required y Federal law to aquire a Federal Firearms License, individuals can obtain a Curio & Relic licence to enhance a personal collection.

    Neither the Federal Government nor the States respect an individuals Rights.

    The Constitution can grant power to the States over firearms matters or the Federal Government, but not both.

    The Tenth Amendment:
    "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

    ~~~~~~~~~~

    "Congressional Authority to Regulate Firearms: A Legal Overview
    Congressional Research Service 1
    Overview of Commerce Clause
    The U.S. Constitution specifies the enumerated powers of the federal government.1
    These powers,
    however, have been interpreted broadly so as to create a large potential overlap with state
    authority. States may generally legislate on all matters within their territorial jurisdiction.2
    Indeed,
    criminal law, family law, property, and contract and tort law, among others, are typical areas of
    law that are regulated at the state level.3
    Accordingly, states have enacted their own laws
    regarding the unlawful possession and disposition of firearms, as well as the manner in which
    firearms may be carried.
    Congress, too, has enacted legislation related to firearms control. It includes, among others, the
    National Firearms Act of 1934,4
    the Gun Control Act of 1968,5
    the Firearm Owners’ Protection
    Act of 1986,6
    and the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act of 1993.7
    Generally, Congress has
    relied on its authority under the Commerce Clause to enact such statutes.8
    The Commerce Clause
    states: “The Congress shall have Power ... To regulate Commerce with foreign Nationals, and
    among the several States, and with Indian Tribes.”9
    Although a plain reading of the text might suggest that Congress has only a limited power to
    regulate commercial trade between persons in one state and persons of another state, the Clause
    has not been construed quite so narrowly, particularly in the modern era.10 Since the 1930s, the
    U.S. Supreme Court has held that Congress has the ability to protect interstate commerce from
    burdens and obstructions “no matter what the source of the dangers which threaten it.”11 Over
    1
    U.S. Const., art. I, §1(“All legislative power herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States.”).
    2
    The states’ authority, or “police power,” to enact such legislation does not arise from the U.S. Constitution. Rather, it
    is an inherent attribute of states’ territorial sovereignty. See Alden v. Maine, 527 U.S. 706 (1999). The Supreme Court
    in Alden affirmed that states retain a “residuary and inviolable sovereignty” and that “our federalism requires that
    Congress treat the States in a manner consistent with their status as residuary sovereigns and joint participants in the
    governance of the Nation.” Id. at 748.
    3 See, e.g., Screws v. United States, 325 U.S. 91, 109 (1945) plurality opinion (“Our national government is one of
    delegated powers alone. Under our federal system the administration of justice rests with the States except as Congress,
    acting within the scope of those delegated powers, has created offenses against the United States.”). The states have
    retained “inherent police power,” Newberry v. United States, 256 U.S. 232 (1921), meaning the power to legislate for
    the “health, safety, and morals” of the citizenry. Barnes v. Glen Theatre, Inc., 501 U.S. 560, 569 (1991).
    4
    P.L. 73-474 (1934), codified at 26 U.S.C. ch.53.
    5
    P.L. 90-618 (1968), codified at 18 U.S.C. §§921 et seq.
    6
    P.L. 99-308 (1986).
    7
    P.L. 104-159 (1994).
    8
    The National Firearms Act of 1934 levies taxes regarding the manufacture and transfer of certain firearms and other
    weapons. Therefore, it could be argued that Congress is also relying on its authority under the Taxing Clause to enact
    this statute. U.S. Const., art. I, §8, cl. 1.
    9
    U.S. Const., art. I, §8, cl. 3.
    10 For a historical overview and early jurisprudence regarding the Commerce Clause, see CRS Report RL32844, The
    Power to Regulate Commerce: Limits on Congressional Power, by Kenneth R. Thomas. In the early 20th century, the
    U.S. Supreme Court generally declared various federal statutes, which regulated the movement of goods or persons,
    constitutional under the Commerce Clause. However, the Court struck down a series of federal statutes which
    attempted to extend commerce regulation to activities such as “production,” “manufacturing,” or “mining.” See, e.g.,
    United States v. E.C. Knight Co., 156 U.S. 1 (1895); Carter v. Carter Coal Co., 298 U.S. 238 (1936).
    11 NLRB v. Jones & Laughlin Steel Corporation, 301 U.S. 1, 36 (1937) (“The fundamental principle is that the power
    to regulate commerce is the power to enact ‘all appropriate legislation’ [citation omitted] for ‘its protection and
    advancement’ [citation omitted]; to adopt measures ‘to promote its growth and insure its safety’ [citation omitted]; ‘to
    (continued...)
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2019
    Ddyad likes this.

Share This Page