The AR-15 follies: Here we go again!

I agree. And I wouldn't want you to not be able to defend yourself.
Most of my decisions in life are playing the odds. Of course, it doesn't always work, but overall, it mostly does. Not everyone who smokes dies from it, but that doesn't make it safe to smoke. Once in a while someone dies from drowning because they were wearing a seatbelt, but that doesn't make it safer to not wear a seatbelt
Speaking of seatbelts, some day they will be obsolete, as other safety advancements will make them unnecessary. Most gun owners I know are more concerned with their right to own them for fun or hunting than are genuinely concerned with not being able to defend themselves. And none of them have had to use a gun to defend themselves or loved ones.
Just out of curiosity, if you could pick one gun for home self defense, what would it be and what kind of ammo would you use?

 

If freedom means to you that someone is free to do what anything they want, then you should be disappointed in America.
There is no such thing as absolute freedom, unless you live on a remote island all by yourself. It's when our multitude of "freedoms" bump into one another that the issues arise.

 

And as the objective reader can clearly see, once face with the FACTS and logic derived from said facts that cannot be refuted, our libertarian advocate has a flag waving meltdown....braying all types of chest beating, jingoistic fodder, name calling and empty threats that is totally bereft of any recognition or compassion for the victims of a weapon formerly banned but now purchased and used by cranks and nut cases to kill groups of people.

Pathetic, but not unexpected.

So, having reduced this joker to a sputtering and fuming, I leave him to his folly...fully confident that the objective reader sees him for what he is regarding the topic.

 

You said it. With the right ammo. The number one concern is, cycling the firearm. That’s why you’re recommending a .375 Ruger and hoping some one will standardize a round for an auto.

 

Imo, 10 mm is not “good” for bear. It’s just acceptable when that’s all you have. Handguns like the Ruger redhawk and single actions in the biggest caliber you can handle are still marginal even though the most recommended for handguns.

 

Still waiting for a miracle ? After ten years, any Supreme Court decisions taking states regulatory fire arm rights away, isn’t going to happen. Heller, just put general handgun regulation in the same level as a full auto was originally. “Licensing the owner, registration of the firearm, and transfer only to qualified people.

 

I've always wondered what the right to keep and bear arms will be like once non-lethal weapons become so advanced that there is no need for lethal weapons.

Of course, lethal weapons will still be needed for hunting when that day comes. But it will still be a big change.

These developments will be quite some time in the future. It's unlikely that any of this will happen within the lifetimes of anyone who reads this thread. Non-lethal weapons have a long way to go before they are effective enough to supplant lethal weapons. But I just like wondering about what the future will be like.

HK-91 rifle; M993 armor piercing ammo.

AP ammo is a lot less effective than hunting ammo. It punches a narrow clean hole and just keeps on going. But at least you're not screwed if the bad guys show up in heavy armor.

Freedom means the right to have weapons to protect yourself.

 

We'll see.

Those are not the laws that I'm expecting Heller to topple.

I'm expecting Heller to topple laws against pistol grips and flash suppressors, laws against .50 caliber weapons, and New Jersey's law against hollow point ammo.

 

Think of it. All these items you mentioned are not banned. They are regulated. You can get all that stuff. You have to be licensed and the item has to be registered,. You do get all this sht is available in movies. That’s one of the exceptions in California for regulating the AR15 ..you can own lots of sht. It just means you’ll have to be licensed,

JUST LIKE HELLER. THE REASON HE got his handgun was, DC just banned operative handguns layin* around the house. Really, you’re dreaming.

If they didn’t allow states to regulate firearms, no one could regulate any of your rights in the Bill,of Rights. Despicable acts like child pornography, promotion of everything from dangerous activities to sbsolute freedom of criminals to do anything they want woukd all haunt our daily lives.

Geesus, even Trump the egomaniac could have a Twitter account again.

 

Bump stocks just made it easier but people could train themselves to do it with AR15 s and AK 47;semi autos. The plat form for increasing rapid fire by using its own recoil to function with the human hand can be emulated without a bump stock in an AR15. It’s all over the internet.he doesn’t lose much accuracy. This is wh6 these weapons are more dangerous then others with high capacity.

 

Freedom is living in an environment you don’t need weapons to defend yourself. You want freedom...take a cruise. They don’t allow weapons and there’s all the security you want.

 

A big bad ass but protective dog, maybe an Akita. Ammo ? Lots of steak. Just toss it at the attacker’s feet.

 

I am a professional level shooter with world championship appearances and close but not cigar efforts for the Olympic team. I enjoy shooting. Those who would want to end that enjoyment are another good reason people should be armed

 

I won a Glock 10MM. I shot some of those huge whale frame Smith revolvers. I trust 15 rounds out of G20 in 3 seconds over trying to recover from the recoil of a 460 for a follow up shot

 

I'm pretty sure that some of those places ban these weapons outright.

However, may-issue licensing (where the government only gives a permit if they feel someone has a good reason for it) does not pass muster with Heller.

The licensing will have to be shall-issue (where the government can only deny a permit for limited specific reasons) in order to pass Constitutional muster.

Preventing regulations that violate the Constitution doesn't bar all regulations altogether.

Regulations that don't violate the Constitution are fine.

I am skeptical that it is easy to aim effectively using such techniques. I doubt that it will become a problem.

However if it does become a problem, limiting magazine size in specific low-recoil rifle calibers will address the problem. There is no reason to limit AR-15s themselves.

 

Now you’re threatening people who want logical laws like universal background checks ? That doesn’t affect any law abiding citizen, none. Now anyone’s ability to arm criminals might. That’s what’s being promoted.

 

I’ve maintained that universal background checks in itself will help slow down the proliferation of all firearms including AR15s . That in itself will take the pressure of additional regulation off an AR15. Make no mistake. The NRA represents the interest of gun makers, not that of private membership.
They just steal from them. The membership majority supports UBC.

 

There’s only one way to tell. Read a few. How do you think I know that California has plenty of exceptions. The failed DC attempt to outright ban an unlocked handgun in the home but allow regulation tells you everything you need to know about these state laws enacted in the last ten years.

These regulations are designed to make it painful for law abiding citizens to transfer these weapons in a way they could get into the hands of the unqualified. It’s no different then the act of providing alcohol to a minors, another regulated activity that is still allowed for use by qualified people.

If you have an AR15 that you have to register, you’re going to do a lot of soul searching transferring it to anyone without proof of a legal right to one one. If it’s found at the scene of a crime, you’re in deep ****.

 

How is Heller going to topple a handgun regulation ? It specifically says that Heller, if qualified, must be allowed to register his unlocked handgun. It actually assumes Heller MUST BE qualified in order to practice a right. It’s no different then ANY OTHER right in the bill of rights. Embedded in your rights, is access to water. Bet some didn’t know why there is always some public access to to lakes, streams, seas and oceans. But even these accesses are regulated. You can’t run across private property and there’s signs saying you can’t be an ****** and abuse it..( like driving a motorized vehicle etc.)

 

You can’t aim any full auto from the shoulder effectively....that’s not what the provision is made for. It’s for mass killing in weapons design specifically to on targets of groups of persons. Shooting into a crowd requires no more accuracy then shooting at a elephant from close range. You don’t even have to qualify for accuracy in the military using this “feature”.

 

You didn’t win a match shooting 15 rounds in three seconds. And neither are you going to be as effective firing north, east, west and south vs a moving target shooting 15 rounds in three seconds. That’s what buck shot is made for. Six aimed rounds of 44 mag is preferred by most in Alaska. I’ll trust them. A Glock 10 mm is nothing to sneeze at, but unless you’ve encounter Grizzlies yourself, I’m trusting advice from experts who say that spray is waaay more effective then any handgun. I can only say, I’ve hunted Black Bear and when they decide to move quickly, the only chance of hitting them is when they come straight at you....not a pleasant thought. Then it’s shot gun time.....

A fellow hunter in our group was attacked by a small female black . It took five rounds of 30-06 , and four in vital areas to finally stop her at less then 10 yards. He took a year off from hunting he was so shook up.

 

That's awesome that you like to think about the future, I also find that interesting. I think the advancements will accelerate. It took awhile for the transition from strung weapons to be essentially replaced by gun powder powered weapons, but because of the increased advancement of technology, it will not take as long for the next generation of weapons. The sooner the better in my opinion. Also, it isn't going to happen in one day, it will be a slow transition, mostly due to the resistance of gun enthusiasts. I think it's important that we start working on it. Of course, you and many others disagree, as is your right.

That is one of the more radical answers to that question I've ever heard. I ask that question sometimes, just for fun. I personally went with a Striker 12, loaded the first 8 rounds with No 6 so I wouldn't risk shooting my kids or neighbors and aiming wouldn't have to be perfect. Last 3 rounds were slugs, just in case. I always left the first chamber open for a little safety factor. Armor piercing is good if you are up against armor, but that isn't probably going to be the case. More than likely it'll be some punk asses looking for guns or money.

And someone beat me to it, but freedom to me would mean that, living in America, I wouldn't have to worry about having weapons to protect myself.

Thanks for your thoughtful answers! Nice to have a discussion on here instead of an accusatory argument!

 

heller had exactly nothing to do with handgun registration

 

Heller explicitly says, Heller if qualified MUST BE ALLOWED TO REGISTER HIS HANDGUN according to the existing laws in DC. You do get that Heller has to register his handgun in order to gain “relief “ from the unlawful “ban” on unlocked handguns. BTW, DC never said you could not have a handgun stored in the home, it just said it had to be in a locked or in an immediate inoperative condition.

It has everything to do with handgun registration.