Usfan messaged Moi that he did not plan to open a Bible II thread and invited Moi to do so. Here it is. "This is a thread to examine the most controversial, polemical, translated, printed, sold, loved and hated book, in the history of mankind. We can examine its origins, content, influence, themes, and significance in the human condition. . . ." , @usfan. Shall we Bible further? Moi Across an immense, unguarded, ethereal border, Canadians, cool and unsympathetic, regard our America with envious eyes and slowly and surely draw their plans against us. @Falena - Please link to The Bible thread now closed. eh http://www.politicalforum.com/index.php?threads/the-bible.542830/ <<< MODERATOR EDIT: LINK ADDED AND TITLE EDITED >>>
Judges 4 : 18 - 21 18 Jael went out to meet Sisera and said to him, “Come, my lord, come right in. Don’t be afraid.” So he entered her tent, and she covered him with a blanket. 19 “I’m thirsty,” he said. “Please give me some water.” She opened a skin of milk, gave him a drink, and covered him up. ( milk and a blanket ) 20 “Stand in the doorway of the tent,” he told her. “If someone comes by and asks you, ‘Is anyone in there?’ say ‘No.’” 21 But Jael, Heeber’s wife, picked up a tent peg and a hammer and went quietly to him while he lay fast asleep, exhausted. She drove the peg through his temple into the ground, and he died. Did Jael violate the laws of hospitality? I was just about to share this conundrum when the last Bible thread closed. Moi
You are my favorite poster Moi but this is a very complicated thing. This entire issue rests on how you interpret the text. Most consider this, by the laws of the city at the time, as an issue of rape, whether she was in her rights to assume that was the intention or not. It is basically unanswerable at this point in time.
They were at war and war is a nasty thing. If war were not nasty no one would win and peace would never happen. Example for peace--Japan. Example delayed peace-palestineian/ Israel conflict.
The old testament is always entertaining. 13 If a man takes a wife and, after sleeping with her, dislikes her 14 and slanders her and gives her a bad name, saying, “I married this woman, but when I approached her, I did not find proof of her virginity,” ... 20 If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the young woman’s virginity can be found, 21 she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done an outrageous thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. You must purge the evil from among you.
A Rabbi I asked said something similar, invoking the Hitler analogy. And Sisera was analogous to Hitler. So any means of killing either would be justifiable. He also said it almost like a reflex and in a louder than usual voice
Sisera was the commander of a Canaanite army they had just defeated. He was fleeing. The Bible doesnt specify whether he was intent on returning with more forces, and though that would be a reasonable assumption, its more to the point that killing the enemy commander was SOP back then.
So Jael invites the tired Sisera to rest in her tent. When asked for water, she delivers milk and a blanket. Was that the beginning of a plot to get Sisera to sleep. And what of the rules of hospitality. An invited guest is safe in your "castle". For Sisera the rules of hospitality don't apply, same as Hitler - per the Rabbi.
I don't know if Sisera was like Hitler but I do know the Israelites were at war with the Canaanites (sp?) And war is hell. Defeating the enemy is the ijective and playing nice is not going to win it. Think about what Sherman did to the south during the civil war? Just burned it leaving women and children destitute and starving. But that finalized the war and brought peace. In ww2 allies targeted German civilians and demolished entire cities with civilians with the intent of defeating the spirit of a people. War is a reality and sometimes a neccesity and playing by someone else's rules don't win wars.
The Rabbi thought so because Sisera was out to annihilate the Hebrews. Moi Look Where The Lord Placed
Sirach 42:14 (GNT) = A man's wickedness is better than a woman's goodness; women bring shame and disgrace. Ecclesiastes 7:26-28 (CEV) = 26 Here is what I discovered: A bad woman is worse than death. She is a trap, reaching out with body and soul to catch you. But if you obey God, you can escape. If you don’t obey, you are done for. 27 With all my wisdom I have tried to find out how everything fits together, 28 but so far I have not been able to. I do know there is one good man in a thousand, but never have I found a good woman. Proverbs 9:13 (KJV)= 13 A foolish woman is clamorous: she is simple, and knoweth nothing. Proverbs 5:3-5(CEB) =3 The lips of a mysterious woman drip honey, and her tongue is smoother than oil, 4 but in the end she is bitter as gall, sharp as a double-edged sword. 5 Her feet go down to death; her steps lead to the grave. 1 Timothy 2:11 (NLT) = 11 Women should learn quietly and submissively.
"For more than a thousand years the BIBLE, collectively taken, has gone hand in hand with civilization, science, law --in short, with the moral and intellectual cultivation of the species, always supporting and often leading the way. ~Samuel Taylor Coleridge "The existence of the BIBLE, as a book for the people, is the greatest benefit which the human race has ever experienced. Every attempt to belittle it is a crime against humanity" ~Immanuel Kant The Bible and its teachings helped form the basis for the Founding Fathers' abiding belief in the inalienable rights of the individual, rights which they found implicit in the Bible's teachings of the inherent worth and dignity of each individual. This same sense of man patterned the convictions of those who framed the English system of law inherited by our own Nation, as well as the ideals set forth in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. - Ronald Reagan
Anyone for some Story / Book of Ruth? https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=ruth+1&version=MEV http://www.readbibleonline.net/?page_id=15 https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0054343/ the movie I read it in a regular, public high school English class circa 1965. Is that legal today? I liked it then although I usually struggled with English class reading. So boring. Scarlett Letter. Gimmie a break. Don't like the read of Moby Dick either. Well I liked the Book of Ruth. Anyone else? Moi PLEASE don't wait on Moi, Do You Have A Favorite Bible Verse or Section To Share And Discuss?
My stepfather used to quote" let not your heart be troubled" in times of stress such as a flat tyre on the car or overcooked meat. He didn't mention the rest of the verse.
John 14:1 https://biblehub.com/john/14-1.htm New International Version "Do not let your hearts be troubled. You believe in God; believe also in me. New Living Translation "Don't let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God, and trust also in me. English Standard Version “Let not your hearts be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in me. Berean Study Bible Do not let your hearts be troubled. You believe in God; believe in Me as well. Berean Literal Bible Let not your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in Me. New American Standard Bible "Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. King James Bible Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. Christian Standard Bible "Don't let your heart be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in me. Contemporary English Version Jesus said to his disciples, "Don't be worried! Have faith in God and have faith in me. Good News Translation "Do not be worried and upset," Jesus told them. "Believe in God and believe also in me. Holman Christian Standard Bible "Your heart must not be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in Me. International Standard Version "Don't let your hearts be troubled. Believe in God, believe also in me. NET Bible "Do not let your hearts be distressed. You believe in God; believe also in me. New Heart English Bible "Do not let your heart be troubled. Believe in God. Believe also in me. Aramaic Bible in Plain English “Let not your heart be troubled. Believe in God and believe in me.” GOD'S WORD® Translation "Don't be troubled. Believe in God, and believe in me. New American Standard 1977 “Let not your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. Jubilee Bible 2000 Let not your heart be troubled; ye believe in God, believe also in me. King James 2000 Bible Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me. American King James Version Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me. American Standard Version Let not your heart be troubled: believe in God, believe also in me. Douay-Rheims Bible LET not your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in me. Darby Bible Translation Let not your heart be troubled; ye believe on God, believe also on me. English Revised Version Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. Webster's Bible Translation Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. Weymouth New Testament "Let not your hearts be troubled. Trust in God: trust in me also. World English Bible "Don't let your heart be troubled. Believe in God. Believe also in me. Young's Literal Translation 'Let not your heart be troubled, believe in God, also in me believe;
Ahh, the Bible. I often hear of it's importance. Yet, for 1500 years it was made available to less than 1% of humanity and written in a language that only 1% of humanity could read or speak. This, the marching orders for salvation of an omnipotent God to his creation. But we know that an average middle-aged English housewife can have HER book printed in every language and distributed to every country on Earth in about two months. So. An omni-potent God didn't think that it was important for His book to be read or he didn't care that everyone be saved? And why not sign His work? Oh well.
Moi's Ruth conundrum. Heroes often have a slightly odd lineage than their general population. The Plantagenet line was said to be descended from Melusine. A sort of demon. Henry II attributed his rages to his Melusine blood. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melusine Gilgamesh was 3/5ths or some impossible proportion "god". Joseph Campbell mentions this in his Hero's Journey. The hero is not pure blood of his people. Was Ruth, the Priestess from Moab really David's Great, Great Grand Mother or was she created to give the House of David that Not Hebrew blood line? Remember Boys and Girls, that places Moab in Jesus' blood too. Moi Across an immense, unguarded, ethereal border, Canadians, cool and unsympathetic, regard our America with envious eyes and slowly and surely draw their plans against us.
There have long been believers who couldn't read or write. In fact there are still many in other countries today. You forget, in older times it was 1% of humanity that was running things. Still had a huge impact on the society, and arguably politics.
If they knew the story depicted in a stained glass window, they learned their Bible. Besides, the commoner didn't speak Latin so, even if literate would not be able to read the Bible.
