I really wonder sometimes if pro-lifers actually think about the costs of their war against abortion. In 2010 (the last year there are complete figures for) there were 765,651 reported abortions in the USA - http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss6208a1.htm 86% of abortions, according to this site - http://endoftheamericandream.com/ar...ion-in-america-that-should-make-you-very-sick - are for 'convenience' reasons. Therefore if elective abortion were banned there would have been 658,459 more possible births (86% of 765,651), approximately 1/4 of all pregnancies end in miscarriage or still birth leaving a total of 493,844 live births 69% of women having abortions live at or below the poverty line - http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/US-Abortion-Patients.pdf - that equates to 340,752 children born into families that will require extra welfare in order to cope. Based on data from The Senate Budget Committee a woman below the poverty line will receive around $202 (Federal & State) for each child per month ($2,424 per year) that is an extra $825,982,848 per year ($2,424 x 340,752) added to the welfare budget, and this in a time when republicans are calling for cuts in the welfare budget. So while this may not be a justification to keep abortion legal, it is something that pro-lifers need to address.
They have addressed it....they want to cut any aid to poor children and their parents and they elect people to try to do just that even though it's a drop in the bucket of our taxes. Anti-Choicers have repeatedly shown that they ONLY "care" about children when they're still in the womb and at no other time....and that's because they want to punish and vilify women....they use a fetus as a weapon. They want to cut food stamps which feed actual living breathing CHILDREN. They want to cut or end unemployment benefits which help to feed and care for CHILDREN. They don't want minimum wage raised becasue that money might feed CHILDREN. And in direct response to your post, Republicans/Rightwingers/ Conservatives NEVER think things through...they read the bumper sticker or repeat what Grandpa said a million times, believe it and repeat it....learning something new or following an action to it's repercussions or conclusions is not their thing...
Funny.... for people who drool and whine about how "Not one penny of my taxes should go to abortions" (and they don't but Anti-Choicers are too stupid to understand that)... it is surprising they don't want to discuss this.... the REAL costs.....
I'm not because the "costs" aren't measured in money alone, human suffering is involved, something the Anti-Choicers have never cared about.
It's nearly the same exact people who want abortion banned (which would only effect poor women)....and who ALSO want to cut Food Stamps and aid to poor women and their children. And they, in a moment of acute cognitive dissonance, see no contradiction in that.
And they're also the same people that hate birth control and real sex education, both of which obviously lower abortions and welfare. It's almost like they have no idea how cause and effect works, or they don't really care at all.
After 40 years of watching politics, I'd have to say while not caring pretty much describes Republicans/Conservatives, AKR hit the nail on the head with them having no idea how cause and effect work. They don't want to. Repubs like simple one liners, a Rush Job (referring to the slobbering Rush Limbaugh)something that can fit on a bumper sticker...and NEVER think it through. They just repeat it and think repitition makes it true. Democrats on the other hand ask why, what, who, and if that happens what and then what and how does it affect this thing and IF it "trickles down" whose head will it dump on... I'm not talking about politicians but everyday people....and it has held true for 40 years.. I was listening to some Republican speak on the floor my state house last night...that stupid jerk said abortion was bad because there now wasn't enough kids in school...YES, he really said that...he added that less kids was bad for the economy. What he didn't say was that women had abortions usually because THEIR own personal economy wasn't so good. So this State Republican thinks it's women' duty to have babies to fill classrooms and then the economy will be fine....
I actually feel a little sorry for most Americans, you basically have an either / or choice when it comes to the people in government, anyone else tries to step into the 'game' and they are crushed by the money men supporting either side - set to get worse now the ban on personal donation limits has been lifted - I don't really see how America can be called a true democracy when there are only two choices. Its like being asked do you want to hang or be shot.
Which is why I am so glad I'm old....I don't want to see anymore what this country is now and will be in a few years. BTW I added a little rant to the post you quoted after you quoted it...
If we just killed all people that drained resources from our society I guess we'd have it pretty good. You are suggesting that we kill those at risk---who haven't had a chance to thrive or fail. Why not just kill those that are proven parasites? That would be much easier and clear cut.
That must be a Republican strategy. Did you know the refusal of red states to expand Medicaid will kill thousands of actually born and breathing people? http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/02/...-expansion-in-red-states-will-kill-thousands/
You mean like the Republican stance against Medicaid in Red states, seems that some are already trying to "kill" those who drain resources.
Lame comparison---seeing as how mothers killing a human life is nothing like republicans believing in individual responsability and fighting against a totaltarian government. Very lame. But its hard to justify killing your child outright. Ya gotta try.
Right .. so you don't see born people (including children) dying as human life then .. good to know, or are you of the (false) opinion that born people won't actually die if cuts are made?
roughly 500,000 = roughly 1 billion dollars/year in new costs is basically what the OP is saying, if abortion was made completely illegal, outside danger to the mother correct? Well I believe I already put out a lot of this, but will say it again. A ban combined with early sex education and contraceptive availability will help reduce the numbers of abortions. Now on the government aid side. I also support raising the minimum wage to roughly what a family of 3 would need need to meet the poverty level, which is currently roughly $20,000/year. So 10.00/hour. Then tie it to inflation from there. It will not get rid of poverty, but will reduce government aid substantially, without having to cut anything. I also want to see all subsidy programs go to the States, as some welfare programs already have. This includes farm aid and corporate subsidies too.
FACT: Banning abortion does NOT reduce the number of abortions. It just makes it harder for poor women to get SAFE affordable abortions...in other words YOU WANT TO MAKE SOMEONE'S LIFE HARDER . PERIOD. Fact: a family of three cannot live on $20,000 a year unless they live in the woods and subsist off rocks.
FACT: I said meet the poverty level set by the federal government. FACT: no proof banning abortions does not reduce the number of abortions. Plkus I said combined with.. but of course you choose to pick what you want to focus on, rather then what i am actually saying
No, I saw the "combined with" but that still will make no difference ....abortions will still happen and we could argue numbers forever but I don't think ANY woman should be denied a SAFE abortion especially if she's poor...poor having more children just makes MORE POOR PEOPLE...what can't you understand about that???????? And gee, I sure like your support in helping working Americans MEET the poverty level with 3 people in the family....... But how about those who can't get an abortion and they end up having 2 or 3 or 4 kids???? You seriously can't believe $20,000 supports a family of three ???
What can't you understand that trying to eliminate poverty through abortion is wrong? LOL I didn't say living wage, I said minimum wage. Yes a minimum wage of 10.00/hr is very much fair. There two other minimum wage plans I have floated out there too, but that is a different topic. Ultimately to fight poverty you need a strong education system and training programs to help people get skills they need to improve their marketability. Again different topic Gee what is your grand plan to fight poverty then? Post it in a different thread if you have a plan.
Yes. You go after the drug companies that supply abortion drugs and doctors performing abortions. Also go after the underground, much like we do with drugs. You can have sting operations, etc etc like they do with prostitutes. All perfectly legal things we do now. No every miscarriage does not warrant an investigation. did it happen before? if not then why would it suddenly start now?
