The dollar is tumbling!

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by trucker, Mar 21, 2017.

  1. trucker

    trucker Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    23,945
    Likes Received:
    3,357
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    currently
    99.68 USD
    Last | 1:13:01 PM GMT
    -0.74 (-0.73%)
    well its be on a dive for the last few days and it started last week after yellen announce the interest rate hike? see its not suppose to happien this way intrest rates support the dollar and it usually goes up ,but somethings adrift ~:wierdface:with the ship here that we have a huge
    anchor dragging the the value of the dollar down, its the
    20 trillion dollar debt and the more yellen raises the rate to fight inflation the faster the debt goes up do to the interest payout to china and japan that holds a trillion each on us bonds, then their in this scenario that develops stagflation as the interest rates go up and wages stay the same and if it doesn't keep inflation in check we got stagflation ..

    in the 1979 the fed raised rates to tame inflation but they didn't have a 20 trillion dollar monster we have currenty, so will raising rates stop it this time?

    http://www.businessinsider.com/us-dollar-march-21-2017-2017-3
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017
    liberalminority likes this.
  2. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    20,754
    Likes Received:
    8,047
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Trumpet and other rich folks like a weak dollar, makes for more exports...
     
  3. An Old Guy

    An Old Guy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2015
    Messages:
    3,634
    Likes Received:
    2,318
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The dollar index is still very strong, especially when looking at the last 5 years. I think the market had long priced in the Fed's rate increase. Oddly enough, I don't think the $20 trillion is going to sway the Fed at all, the debt is quite manageable.....the Fed will only raise (or lower) rates in consideration of well the economy is doing, labor force considerations, and trying to keep close to inflation targets (2%). I believe these 3 areas to be the main emphasis of their monetary policies.
     
  4. trucker

    trucker Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    23,945
    Likes Received:
    3,357
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    but your not explaining why is the dollar going down now? shouldn't it be 103 or 104 after the rate increase. not 99.6
    in 2001 it was WAY up there! 120
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017
  5. TomFitz

    TomFitz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2013
    Messages:
    40,647
    Likes Received:
    16,099
    Trophy Points:
    113
    "in the 1979 the fed raised rates to tame inflation but they didn't have a 20 trillion dollar monster we have currenty, so will raising rates stop it this time?"

    Oh, the irony! In 1980 the Republicans were screaming about the budget deficit and the national debt.

    The man they put in the White House promptly ran the largest deficits in US history and tripled the national debt. The debt was multiplying so fast taht it took most of the 1990's to get it in check.

    George W Bush did it again, and left Obama a near depression and galloping debt again.

    Trump will do the exact same thing, given half the chance.
     
    Guno and Ericb760 like this.
  6. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2013
    Messages:
    93,457
    Likes Received:
    14,675
    Trophy Points:
    113
    if the dollar was REALLY tumbling, oil would tumble with it
     
  7. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2009
    Messages:
    34,707
    Likes Received:
    21,899
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Good! Bring on the foreign purchases!
     
  8. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    May 31, 2011
    Messages:
    13,888
    Likes Received:
    3,080
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    If the dollar index is going down then that means people are selling their shares of the currency?

    I had the question about whether the problem is that people don't want to be paid in inflated currency and a search ("pay out in inflated currency") led me to the idea of hyperinflation. So I guess an inflated currency is bad.

    But Trump likes it???
     
  9. trucker

    trucker Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    23,945
    Likes Received:
    3,357
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    yeah the dollar crashed starting in 1985 i see by 87 it lost 30 dollars in just 2 years the bubble popped


    http://www.macrotrends.net/1329/us-dollar-index-historical-chart
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017
  10. trucker

    trucker Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    23,945
    Likes Received:
    3,357
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    btw the lowest the gdp to us debt[​IMG] [​IMG] was in the 1970s fuel prices oil and payment to the middle east set the economy back and inflation , now whats the problem we have plenty of oil now.. is it the debt?
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017
  11. An Old Guy

    An Old Guy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2015
    Messages:
    3,634
    Likes Received:
    2,318
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I did give a possible explanation - I'm thinking the Fed interest rate hike was already priced into the market.......
     
  12. Zorro

    Zorro Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2015
    Messages:
    77,059
    Likes Received:
    51,757
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Today's markets are dangerously overpriced.

    It’s impossible to simply print prosperity out of thin air. Since 2009, Central Banks have unleashed over $12 Trillion in new money into the world, concentrating wealth into the hands of an elite few, while blowing asset price bubbles everywhere in the process, The Mother Of All Financial Bubbles.

    Price bubbles always burst. The world’s financial markets will implode spectacularly from today's heights -- destroying jobs, dreams, hopes, economies and political careers alike.

    Central bankers will respond with even more aggressive money printing -- the entire money system will first compress into a ball of deflation, then exploding in hyperinflation, or, we will get lucky and they will actually pull off this incredible game of tetras.

    Money is not wealth; it is a claim on wealth. Debt is a claim on future money. Our current monetary policies are attempting to do the impossible, grow our debts at roughly twice the rate of GDP -- apparently, forever. Can we really compound the claims at twice the rate of income year after year from here on out?

    Imagine your credit card balance rolled over every month as the balance grows at 10% each year, while your income advances at only 5% per year. Eventually your income is swamped by your debt service payment. First you are insolvent, then bankrupt, your creditors split your remaining assets, at a loss. The run up is inflationary, the bubble burst is deflationary.

    The US has been spending far above our means for decades and decades, amassing a tremendous amount of public and private debt as well as entitlement promises along the way. And, yes, even nations go bankrupt.

    All those the claims represented by all the debt and excess printed currency have to be destroyed, or reduced, to bring things back into balance.

    The Austrian economist Ludwig von Mises said it best: There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved.”

    Currently there is no demonstrated willingness by us or our national leadership for “voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion”. With the Federal Reserve leading the way, the ‘plan’ has been the voluntary, increasingly desperate, attempt to expand credit even more aggressively than before.

    [​IMG]
    US economic growth began slowing due to its accelerating ‘too much debt’ problem back around 2000. Instead of allowing natural market forces to clear out the excessive debts, the Federal Reserve chose to go into overdrive to ‘remedy’ the problem. It's remedy? Drive interest rates to 0% to reduce the service burden of those debts, and print trillions of fresh dollars that in turn can fund new borrowing.

    Of course, no true ‘solution’ for having too much debt involves piling up even more of it.

    The only path that history has shown works involves fiscal austerity and reducing debt. Or, as von Mises put it, "a voluntary abandonment of the credit expansion". But, that requires real political courage and a willingness from society to endure actual ‘pain’ in the form of living below its means to make up for the prior periods of living too lavishly.

    Returning to the chart above, it’s sufficient to know that no country, ever, in all of history, has ever dug out from such a mountain of excess claims. Never. Not once.

    The only possible way we're avoiding crisis is if the economy suddenly returns to extremely rapid economic growth for an extremely long time. And IF during such a period of rapid growth, we use that windfall to pay down the debts and other associated IOU’s -- rather than as an excuse to run them higher.

    Tthere’s been zero effort towards ‘voluntary abandonment’ of the credit cycle. And there's been every effort made towards extending it farther. We're simply climbing ever higher up an extension ladder from which we will someday fall. We passed the ‘moderately painful’ height a long time ago; now we're up at the ‘quite possibly lethal’ altitude.

    Pushing us further up this credit ladder is exactly what 0% interest rates were meant to do. The openly-stated intent of the central banks in treading into the never-before-tried ZIRP and NIRP waters was to spark more borrowing and spending.

    Savers and pension plans have been utterly decimated by these low (even negative rates in some parts of the world) is not even a passing concern to the Federal Reserve. Their only goal has been to get credit expanding again as fast as possible. Ditto for the European Central Bank, The Bank of England, and the Bank of Japan, as well as The People’s Bank of China.

    All of them have the same plan: Expand!

    But this ‘plan’ does not pencil out. It fails basic math both here in the short term, as evidenced by more than a decade of sub-par GDP growth, but especially later over the long term. Why? Because there’s no such thing as perpetual exponential expansion of anything.

    Regrettably, though, that’s the ‘plan’ of every major central bank around the world right now.

    Because it's mathematically guaranteed to fail, our only job as private individuals is to understand the situation accurately and to then take actions that are in alignment with the reality of living within such a broken system. If we can’t stop the lunatics, at least we can foresee the consequences of their actions and begin to unhitch ourselves as best as possible from their nutty trajectory.

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-03-25/why-market-needs-crash-and-likely-will
     
  13. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    The stinking, über-manipulative Federal Reserve combine has squashed interest rates since it hammerlocked them in August 2007. It wouldn't even exist but for liberal Democrat Woody Wilson and a gaggle of others like him who, over 103 years ago, put this octopus monopoly into official existence. We never needed a European-style "central bank", and we don't need it now!

    It's so sick it's almost funny. When the hyperlibs put this 'Frankenstein's monster' into existence it was done to end all the turbulence of depressions and financial panics. Instead, just look at how many of them we have had in the past 100 years, including the Great Depression and our more recent Great Recession, plus numerous other recessions... almost too many to count.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2017
    GreenBayMatters likes this.
  14. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2014
    Messages:
    18,101
    Likes Received:
    23,524
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I know it is fashionable to complain about the FED. However, the low interest rates as of late are not a product of the FED, but rather dictated by market forces. Bernanke himself has said that the FED's power is in affecting interest rates for short times, but in the long term the free market rate always takes over.

    Since 2007, there was too much capital seeking for safe return, while there was an absence of qualified borrowers. Thus, interest rates naturally has to be low because of the law of supply and demand. Nothing the FED could have done about it.

    In fact, the overabundance of capital still persists, which is why the stock market is at record highs. All that capital is blowing up the stock bubble.

    Unfortunately, investing, however, into production rather than speculation is still low, caused by low demand for products. Trump's supply side policies won't fix that one bit.

    As to the OP: The dollar actually has been gaining strength. As a holder of Euros, I follow the exchange rate closely.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2017
    mdrobster likes this.
  15. Fisherguy

    Fisherguy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2016
    Messages:
    5,023
    Likes Received:
    3,411
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You're blaming Wall Street criminality on liberals? Did you forget your medicine this morning?
     
  16. Deckel

    Deckel Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2014
    Messages:
    17,608
    Likes Received:
    2,043
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You are going to see US stocks become increasingly volatile. The thing driving the dollar down is the same thing the has been driving the markets up--an expectation on Trump to be able to deliver real economic growth. Now that his healthcare plan is in the toilet, the markets will be hesitant to expect him to be able to deliver on other things, especially the tax cuts. Trumpcare was the first big thing Trump did legislatively and it failed miserably. While MSNBC is busy saying Trump moving on from healthcare is like a spoiled kid taking his toys and going home, the reality is if he doesn't deliver on something, we are in for a recession just off people fleeing from their probably unrealistic expectation of him being able to deliver 3-4% growth.
     
    Marcotic, trucker and Moonglow like this.
  17. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2014
    Messages:
    20,296
    Likes Received:
    7,744
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yep, china can now buy our scrap cheaper which used to be our biggest export to them, besides our jobs.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2017
  18. Surfer Joe

    Surfer Joe Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    Messages:
    24,397
    Likes Received:
    15,542
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Lol...You can buy trump's made in China crap then.
     
  19. Deckel

    Deckel Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2014
    Messages:
    17,608
    Likes Received:
    2,043
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We buy their coal ash so it all evens out.
     
  20. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    20,754
    Likes Received:
    8,047
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I thought der Donald Duck was suppose to fix that little problem, instead he's off golfing..
     
  21. Sam Bellamy

    Sam Bellamy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2014
    Messages:
    3,231
    Likes Received:
    715
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I wouldn't panic over a few sharks feeding on the dollar. Besides there aren't many places to run right now. Volatility is creeping around every corner.
     
  22. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    20,754
    Likes Received:
    8,047
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    It's like death, you just try to keep your mind occupied so you don't notice it so much...
     
  23. ButterBalls

    ButterBalls Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2016
    Messages:
    51,533
    Likes Received:
    37,905
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Excellent Read, thanks!
     
  24. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2013
    Messages:
    19,294
    Likes Received:
    7,606
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Oh come now, trucker

    Don't we both know the dollar has been inflated by the world economy balloon.
    And that balloon has to pop or implode ala USSR sometime.
    It cannot remain a balloon forever. It must come down to earth sometime. Yes?


    Moi :oldman:

    r > g




    :nana: :flagcanada:
     
    GrumpyCatFace likes this.
  25. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2016
    Messages:
    11,951
    Likes Received:
    7,714
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    Well that was one of Trumps complaints against China wasn't it. Said they manipulated the Yuan, keeping it low to make Chinese exports cheaper, so imagine he's quite happy with the lower dollar.
     
    ButterBalls likes this.

Share This Page