The Liberal Advantage

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by ImNotOliver, May 13, 2020.

  1. ImNotOliver

    ImNotOliver Well-Known Member

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    The corona virus must have left many on the Right with too much time on their hands as there seems to be an up tic in the creation, consumption, and recitation of anti liberal rhetoric. I highly suspect it has a lot to do with the weak leader Trump, the president of low expectations, has shown himself to be in our time of crisis. Trump’s ineptitude and ignorance can only be defended so far, so the Right, as usual, is left with their old standby, the bashing of liberals and progressives. There are even conservatives, all riled up in their conservative indignation, insisting that I, and others on the left, apologize for all the grief we have caused them and sweet innocent Donnie, with our accusations of Russian involved shenanigans.


    However, this shutdown has given me some time to stream a few things. General Magic is a documentary about the company that invented the smartphone. This was followed by a short biography on Bill Gates, then a documentary about the rivalry between Apple and Microsoft, the movie Jobs, where Ashton Kutcher played the part of Steve Jobs was pretty good, and the comedic series Silicon Valley, about a software startup. These were of interest to me because, professionally, I had grown up with the high tech industry. It is where I thrived and made my money.


    In watching these movies and shows, I was reminded just how liberal all the characters have always been. That the computer and high tech industries were conceived and created almost exclusively by liberal leaning individuals. Beginning with Charles Babbage. Watching these shows, both fictional and nonfictional, these are clearly the activities of liberals. In one episode of Silicon Valley there was a big controversy about a popular app on their platform created by a gay man. No one cared that he was gay. What had everyone upset was that he was a Christian and no one wanted him proselytizing, or even just staining their brands by association.


    That the high tech world is dominated by liberals can be seen in that in all the areas where high tech thrives, so do liberal politics.


    It isn’t just the high tech world but just about every cultural institution. Most musicians tend to lean to the left, even ones who play to conservative audiences. Same with the film and television industries. Sure there are conservatives and moderates, but they are greatly outnumbered by liberals. Likewise with comedy. It is often said that conservatives have no sense of humor. It is why the vast majority of comedians are liberal leaning. Science is another field that is overwhelmingly dominated by liberal leaning individuals. But then liberalism began as the political/social philosophy that accompanied scientific and technological developments. Medicine has also seen great advance in the past few decades thanks to liberal innovations. And education. There must be a reason that college professors and administrators tend to be liberal leaning. Why liberal colleges tend to be highly ranked, but conservative Christian colleges, not so much.


    Depending on what criteria one uses, there are only about 10-20% of Americans who are liberals. (The Democratic Party is more progressive than liberal). Yet liberals have an outsized influence on American culture, and the world.


    But then is that not what has conservatives all riled up, isn’t it. The loss of their culture. Liberal agitation has abolished slavery, granted women and minorities the right to vote, have gotten prayers taken out of public schools, preserved public lands, gained environmental protections, and now allow homosexuals to marry each other. This on top of the technology and scientific understanding that makes a god less plausible with every advancement as it enhances our lives.


    It all comes down to the liberal advantage, something smart kids figure out early in life. It is not just that we get better grades in school, there is fundamental different way of thinking. The advantages throughout life are innumerable. This can be seen in that not only do liberal dominated areas have greater economic activity, the people also tend to live longer healthier lives. The liberal lifestyle is one based on healthy minds, bodies, relationships, and nature. A liberal sees the world through an empirical lens, unlike the opinion/belief prism others see the world. It is this trait that allows liberals to develop enough of an understanding of the world to be able to create new and useful devices. Just about every great innovator has been liberal. A liberal life is one full of adventure and fulfillment in the real world, unburdened by belief.


    Conservatism never appeared until the rise of liberalism. In fact, dictionaries in the 1800s listed “opposed to liberalism” as a definition of a conservative, as conservatives sought to “conserve” the old world order. And is that not why central to conservative thought is the demonization and denigration of liberals? It is not like conservatism offers much more than the status quo, or a partial return to a previous time. Liberalism offers a better future for all, a future where technological innovation and scientific understanding provides for us an improvement to the human condition. All conservatives have is to insult us and to pretend we are their inferior. After all, it seems to be frequently written, matter of factly, on this forum some meme about liberals being lazy and just wanting to live off the public dole. This and other silly notions are common among conservatives. They are taught such things in their churches and in their media.


    Yet it is the liberal parts of the country that has been leading the economy over the past few decades. The wealthiest men in the country all seem to be quite liberal leaning. I’m not sure why conservatives would think that I would want what they have, when I have lived a wonderful, fun filled, adventure packed liberal lifestyle. When I hear conservatives ragging on liberals, I tend to hear the ugly voice of envy. Sour grapes gone bad.
     
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  2. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    So Steve Jobs was a liberal when he died? No, he was a cut throat capitalist, that didn’t have the social hang ups that conservatives have.

    Next, you seem to base your theory off of Hollywood movies. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds?

    Next, how liberal is it of Jeff Bezos who actually describes himself as a free market libertarian to pay his workers crap, and leave it to the tax payers to supplement their income with welfare benefits?

    same thing for that big time liberal who owns Uber, where his workers actually lose money working for him. Super duper liberal right there.

    Next, if being a solid blue state is so great, explain why states like New York, and California lead the nation in wealth inequality.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2020
  3. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    What a waste of time screed, a partisan rant as usual. TL just skimmed to confirm what I expected. Bet George Carlin would love it!
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2020
  4. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    That Fred Flintstone look alike that runs young turks, when all gang buster when his staff tried to unionize. He’s super liberal as well, ain’t he?
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2020
  5. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    Google is in Bed with the Authoritarian regime of China, because of money. That’s super liberal.
     
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  6. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    Mark Zuckerberg shares your data, and gets rich doing it. Super liberal guy as well.
     
  7. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    UBer is own by stockholders. Travis Kalanick, the founder, was a libertarian. I"ve talked to a lot of Uber drivers, since I used their service, and I'm told it's more or less on par with driving a cab. Some tell me they are doing well, others, not so well, that's sound about average for any gig job. Cabs have in around since the invention of the automobile, you'd think if they were losing money, they would have stopped the service long ago.
    Since when are republicans, conservatives, those on the right, suddenly concerned about 'wealth inequality'?
    The chipping away of the progressive tax system is responsible for that. That is due to the rise of neoliberalism since Reagan.
    Seems repubs are only concerned with wealth inequality when dems are talking about it.
    Same with health dare. Were it not for the ACA, the right wouldn't even be talking about health care, they never did before. ( Well, Nixon did. a long time ago )
    Remember, capitalism still reigns, even in blue states.
     
  8. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    No, what you just witnessed was a guy trying to piggyback off other people’s accomplishments to feed his own sense of superiority, all the while thinking he’s in the same club as the tech barons.
    That’s ****ing hilarious.
     
  9. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    Logically, one doesn’t have to be emotional about a issue, to point out a issue.
    So whatever you think I may feel about wealth inequality, doesn’t make the fact that New York, and California lead the nation in wealth inequality go away.
     
  10. ImNotOliver

    ImNotOliver Well-Known Member

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    You seem to be horribly misinformed about what a liberal is. Adam Smith was a liberal. Benjamin Franklin was a liberal as was Henry Ford and Thomas Edison. Nikolai Tesla was a rival to Edison, but they were both liberals. Einstein was a liberal as was Andrew Carnegie. Have you listened to Bill Gates talk. In many ways he is the quintessential liberal. Intelligent creative, innovative, competitive, with a vision of a better future, and a plan on how to get there.

    My “theories” as you call them, did not come from Hollywood Movies, that is conservative indoctrination clouding your thoughts. My “theories” as you call them are based on lifetime experiences. I have had a lucrative career as design engineer working in R&D for leading edge high tech companies. It is an industry and environment I know very well. It is a pattern that is easily discoverable.

    Everywhere there is a high tech cluster, the people tend to be better educated, better paid, and in better health than elsewhere. Less religious. And they tend to overwhelmingly vote liberal. This can be seen in Seattle, Portland, the Bay Area and Boulder.


    Boulder Colorado is perhaps the most liberal city in America, if not the world. The local conservatives like to refer to it as The People’s Republic of Boulder. From the beginning it was built around the ideas of preserving the natural beauty while developing the health and minds, and thus the happiness of its residents. It was founded mostly by German and Scandinavian immigrants who flooded in after the Civil War. They were mostly of a non-religious sort and the original charter for the public school forbade religious instruction in the school. Being recent immigrants they had no problem with Blacks, and were the first jurisdiction to forbid Jim Crow laws. Area doctors, with donations from the community created a top rated hospital, so as to not have a religious hospital, as many hospitals in the day were. With the idea of making Boulder the Athens of the West, the City lobbied to get the University of Colorado. The original buildings were paid for by local donations. In furtherance of the liberal mindset of early Boulder, the first professor that was hired was a woman. This was in the late 1800s.

    Today Boulder has perhaps one of the highest densities of high tech companies outside Silicon Valley. There is something like nine national laboratories. 2/3rds of the adults have a college education, more than twice the national average and wages are one of the highest in the country. It is also said to be the least religious of any city.

    Boulder has some weird quirks. Officially one does not own a pet, but rather is a guardian. In the name of equal rights, a woman can go topless anyplace it is customary for men to go shirtless. After snowstorms, the bike/walking/jogging paths tend to get plowed before the streets. Every restaurant in town has vegetarian meals on the menu, some much more than others. Tofu was invented in Boulder. Boulder County straddles the Continental Divide allowing them to control the watershed. The city also owns the electric company. Most of the electricity is generated using damless generators placed along fast moving mountain streams and creeks.

    One thing I find interesting, but entirely understandable, knowing Boulder. In most places the cities tend to be more liberal than the countryside. As liberal as the city of Boulder is, the county is more liberal.
     
  11. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    I don't know but it would be interesting to know why you think that has something to do with liberals.
     
  12. mpw8679

    mpw8679 Well-Known Member

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    Boulder is a freak show.
     
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  13. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    Solid blue states.

    derp
     
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  14. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We have had many people who qualify as visionaries, people who see something that could be and pursue it. That includes Steve Jobs, but also includes people who write science fiction stories- which if you think about it for a moment provided the initial conception or idea of many things that are common place to day. However the creativity do envision is not the same as the ability to execute. To brings such things to reality requires a much more conventional capacity- the Henry Ford, Warren Buffet kind of person. While it's true that many tech industries have done very well, it's also true that they benefit from riding a front wave- new product, which when first coming to market will command ridiculous prices and make a great deal of money. In the case of these tech items, for example computers and then smartphones- the rapid expansion of the technical capacity kept that wave going. Each new generation has to set new records in order to stay alive, and the used goods that was prime 5 years earlier now has no value at all. Try selling that deluxe CRT tube TV in the basement, for example.

    Point is that this economic surge is more a phenomenon of timing in our economic state, than a new brilliance about everything. Not exactly a one-trick pony, but something that will eventually slow and require solid, consistent productivity in a highly competitive marketplace- without the advantage that today keeps the Iphone commanding ridiculous prices because it is a bit faster or more versatile than the last. The jobs of programmers and people in the tech industry who have become rich riding this phenomenon will become ordinary jobs, no longer making a million out of a few lines of unique code and such.

    Real life is about day-to-day productivity rather than a get-rich quick ride. The majority of people chase that ride, but few actually find it. Most that do find it fail to realize it's not a permanent thing, and become enamored with their own glory, as if it was going to last forever. Then, they begin to think that if I can program a computer, I can do anything- including manage a nation, because my thinking is superior to common people. This is something common in liberalism. They become arrogant, egotistical, superior in their own minds, and in many cases out of touch with the big picture, the reality of life.

    Of course, that puts them out of their real skill range- with no idea how to make the real world work in the long run. We do need the creativity, and we all benefit from it. I am a creative person too, I understand the process, and have invented many products that sell worldwide. Done many things people said couldn't be done. However, I also have a list of ideas that I believed in but didn't work that is at least 50 times larger than those that became successful, and I had to learn how to tell the difference and understand the limitations of my abilities. Because you have mastered something in one field with exceptional success, does not make you a master of other skills- but it often makes such people think they are, and if we take their word for it and give them power- many stupid and detrimental things will happen, harming everybody.

    Example in point illustrates this well..... California.

    Not sour grapes or envy. It's watching a person revel in the idea that liberalism is an answer for everything make mistakes, rather than realize it is only another part of the big picture- no more, no less necessary.
     
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  15. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Probably because those on the right, who normally have meaningful work to do, have been home for several weeks.
    It also explains why there has been no similar uptick in anti-conservative rhetoric.
     
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  16. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    In the 18th century meaning of the term, sure.
    But, you know that meaning no longer applies.
    Why do you attempt to mislead people like this?
     
  17. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's just that liberals tend to be more vicious and vindictive and conservatives have to be silent around them if they want to continue to work.
     
  18. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    Yeah, that made me laugh.
     
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  19. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    The “father of fiber optics” is a Sikh. The lady responsible for the nuts and bolts of GPS is a Christian. That’s off the top of my head, I’m sure some research would further dispense with the notion intelligent and successful people are not people of faith or conservative in their beliefs.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2020
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  20. ImNotOliver

    ImNotOliver Well-Known Member

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    Probably not as both fiber optics and GPS were developed by many people over a long period of time
    https://www.thoughtco.com/birth-of-fiber-optics-4091837

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pcworld.com/article/2000276/a-brief-history-of-gps.amp.html

    The studies, and history are not on your side on this one. I first decided that I was a liberal because as an adolescent I was drawn to intellectual pursuits. There was, and is nothing about conservative thought that facilitates intellectual development. In fact I have always found conservatives to be rather anti intellectual development. Anti science, anti knowledge. It comes as no surprise that so many conservatives have a habit of condemning universities and public education. It is all par for the course.

    Liberals and liberal institutions are quite the opposite. They celebrate and promote intellectual curiosities and discoveries.
     
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  21. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Synopsis Please.



    Moi :oldman:
    Dyslexia worsens with age
    as do ADHD stuff like short term memory.




    Lucky I went to the Medical School that invented
    synopsis textbooks. The Lange series. Univ. of Calif. San Francisco.
     
  22. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Your partisan blindness is as high as I have ever seen. Liberalism has given us such garbage as men tinkling in the girls room.
     
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  23. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    A great many conservative people and institutions have been ground-breaking innovators. The difference between the liberal ones and the conservative ones is that the conservatives keep the world in perspective, while the liberals discard everyone else's values and thing the world revolves around them and their ideologies. That is their handicap.
     
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  24. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    There was never anything wrong with being a liberal. But "liberals " are not liberals any more. Economically they are leftists leaning towards strong government interference with the means of production. Socially they are progressives which simply means straight white men suck and owe everyone else a living.
    Both of those have huge problems, ethically, morally, economically and constitutionally.

    So all these guys and gals who are liberals and make the world go round, good job!

    To similar progressives? Oh, there aren't any.
     
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  25. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well said. The people that are referred to as "liberals" from history by those wishing to associate with the credentials of great people have nothing in common with today's "liberals". Those liberals of the past understood responsibility and duty and honor. They were often groundbreakers with new ideas, but they weren't egotistical fools. They have no equivalence with the "liberals" of today.
     
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