The Pernicious Myth of the Good Guy With a Gun

"Analysis by the Violence Policy Center has found that at least 29 mass shootings since 2007 were carried out by perpetrators with concealed carry permits. That’s more than three times the number of concealed permit holders who prevented mass shootings through their swift action. And it’s not as though those heroes (and they are heroes) are truly stemming the tide of non-sensical gun deaths in the U.S.: A Washington Post analysis of Federal Bureau of Investigation and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention data found that, for every 'justifiable' gun homicide in 2012, there were 34 criminal gun homicides, 78 gun suicides, and at least two accidental gun deaths. Similarly, a 2014 study from the University of California–San Francisco found that people who owned a gun were three times as likely to kill themselves as non-firearm owners; by comparison, the annual per capita risk of death during a home invasion is 0.0000002 percent. Hell, even toddlers killed more people than terrorists in 2015. Guns are used far more often for killing than for self-defense, despite the fact that some 63 percent of Americans think guns make them safer....

"A well-armed citizenry rarely makes an impact on mass shootings. According to 2014 FBI data, only seven of the 160 of the mass shootings that took place between 2000 and 2013 ended because of some would-be Rambo came to the rescue....

"In 13 percent of the shooting situations, the shooter was successfully disarmed and restrained by unarmed civilians, and in 3 percent of the incidents the shooter was confronted by armed civilians, of whom four were on-duty security guards and one person was just your average 'good guy' who happened to be carrying a gun.

"Even if armed civilians were to come to the rescue more often, there are questions as to how effective they’d be. Many instances where a 'good guy with a gun' has put an end to a violent crime involve a good guy who’s actually a former law enforcement or security specialist, someone with a significant amount of training and discipline when it comes to moving thoughtfully and with purpose with a firearm. Not, in other words, an everyday civilian."
https://psmag.com/the-pernicious-myth-of-the-good-guy-with-a-gun-3f5b4f0b157a#.g4cwvzvit

So it sounds like unarmed bystanders are better at stopping a mass shootings than armed bystanders. People who legally carry a handgun in public are more likely to start mass shootings than stop them. Those who do succeed in stopping mass shootings tend to have a lot more training than the average gun owner. So what are the solutions to these problems?

 

Thus meaning that those who legally own and carry firearms have indeed stopped at least some mass shootings from being carried out to their fullest, and thus lives have been saved from one who would be considered a good person with a firearm.

Police officers are not highly trained individuals. Certainly not when it comes to the use of firearms. Their accuracy rates in the field of marksmanship are absolutely abysmal.

According to the violence policy center, those who hold concealed carry permits are responsible for less than two murders, per each state, per every year the data has been analyzed.

It is not the obligation of those who hold concealed carry permits to go out of their way to put an end to mass shootings. Carrying a concealed firearm is about someone not having to be a victim of violent crime, because they have the option and ability of protecting themselves against someone who does not regard their life as being important.

 

Unarmed bystanders have many more opportunities to do so, given the preponderance of mass shootings that occur in gun free zones.

That's hard to quantify, given that in many instances a shooter is stopped by a legal handgun wielder before enough casualties are caused to become a mass shooting event. Two recent ones come to mind - the barbershop shooting in Philadelphia and the Uber driver defense in Chicago. In both cases, an active shooter started firing on a crowd of people, was immediately engaged by a CCW and taken out without a single injury to the unarmed targets in the area.

Also, given that a mass shooter is willing to break the law regarding murder, should we assume that without a CCW they'd not carry a concealed gun to carry out their task?

First, active shootings are so rare as to be corner cases, and they are all different with regards to locale, geography, etc. It's difficult to train to stop an active shooter as the presumption is that the shooting will take place in a gun free zone where a legal gun carrier won't be armed, anyway.

CCW holders don't carry to stop active shooters. They carry to defend themselves and family, given that mass shootings outside of gun free zones are so rare as to not be of consideration.

 

VPC???

 

Those with CCW's shoot fewer people than those without them, by orders of magnitude.

Few CCWs stop mass shooters because the mass shooting most often occurs in a gun free zone.

Your post is full of disinformation and contains sources that are outright lying.

 

FACT: Not one victim of a mass shooting has ever been armed. Statistically if you want 0% chance of being killed in a mass shooting all need is have a gun, any gun.

There also has NEVER been a mass shooting where even just one private citizen was openly wearing a gun.

 

According to VPC logic if you're a lawful CCW or open carrier and a mass shooting breaks out, it's you. The gun just takes on over. Can't take that chance, bra.

 

Seems most mast shooting took place in a gun free zones.

Well you can go back to October of 2009 and read these amazing stories which highlight accounts of law-abiding gun owners in America using their Second Amendment rights for self-defense by going here. -> https://www.americanrifleman.org/the-armed-citizen?q=44619&p=1&e=&s=

 

Not one victim of a mass shooting was carrying a potato. Carry a potato....protect yourselves. LOL

 

Op...something is better than nothing. Even if the good guys are not successful in stopping them all, they sometimes can make a difference.

 

Peer reviewed studies show that guns are used to prevent crime somewhere between 600K and 2M times per year.

Focusing only on mass shootings ignores all the other self-defense instances.

In fact you are using an argumentative fallacy known as the Tiny Percentage Fallacy. You are trying to claim that something significant is *not* significant because it is a tiny percentage of something larger. It's a fallacious use of statistics.

If you *ever* take Concealed Carry Weapon training you will find out that CCW licensees do not carry their weapon to stop any crime, including a mass shooting. They carry to protect themselves and their family. They are *not* sworn police officers. They have no obligation or duty to interject themselves into any situation unless it presents an immediate threat of great bodily harm or death to themselves or their family.

When you claim that CCW licensees don't stop crimes, including mass shootings, you are correct. The data is correct. But it is correct for a far different reason than you conclude!

Consider: You are a CCW licensee. You shoot a criminal robbing a convenience store clerk. But tragically your bullet goes completely through the criminal, strikes the clerk, and the clerk dies.

Guess what that is going to cost you in legal fees and perhaps in damage awards in civil court. And remember, you have no duty or obligation to stop that robbery!

 

The Vile Propaganda Crap is a disinformation center run by a marxist agitator who was thrown out of the Brady Bunch for being too extreme. This is the clown who told the media to deliberately confuse the public by telling the public that Semi auto sporting rifles are machine guns. He also had a meltdown when the 10 round magazine limit imposed by the Democrats resulted in gun makers creating smaller weapons designed around the 10 round limit (example_GLOCK 26) . The VPC whined about this. The VPC also claimed that centerfire hunting rifles with scopes are SNIPER RIFLES

 

The left has several web sites with names like the VCP, intended to portray an unearned level of authority and legitimacy as a platform to distribute extremely biased propaganda to the uninformed. Tracing the sponsorship and funding of these sites and the sources they they employ are often as revealing as the discredited studies they tout as proof of their narratives. Many, such as those that use then for reference in this forum rarely, if ever, perform a critical analysis of the methodologies upon which they craft erroneous conclusions as fact. In their world, they are still arguing the world is flat.

 

Lets see the evidence. Until then it is simply your opinion

 

Is that what you think a CCW is all about? Stopping mass shootings?
CCW is about giving yourself and your loved ones a fighting chance should someone put your life in peril. Successful defensive gun uses are documented daily.
There are many people alive today that would otherwise no longer be on the face of the earth if not for the ability to defend themselves.

 

Yup, the 10-round so-called pocket rockets, I think is what they were called by VPC.

- - - Updated - - -

Exactly. Around 80% of violent crimes are committed WITHOUT A WEAPON. That is what a gun is best for defense against--violent crimes committed without guns (which are well over 80% of violent crimes).

 

Analysis form the NRA says otherwise.

/thread

 

Yeah saw josh slugoman and Tom Perez whine about those "deadly pocket rockets"

they also had meltdowns over how Colt and Bushmaster, Olympic Arms and RR merely deleted bayonet lugs and changed flash hiders to muzzle brakes to make their rifles compliant with the cosmetic craziness of the FeinSwine-CLinton rape of the second amendment.

 

These same people are flabbergasted as to why fast food restaurants replace workers with kiosks after minimum wage goes to $15/hr and why soft drink producers/distributors lay people off after taxes spike the price of their products to the point where people buy less.

 

A bit off Topic ?
You seem to resort to those type of retorts when Logic fails you.
VPC twists facts to suit the Ban all Guns Agenda, and to prove everyone is a Criminal.

 

The noted exception being Ciggarettes / Tobacco products, highly taxed, yet people continue to pay exorbitant prices for a product whose use is known and proven to cause many terminal illnesses, go figure...

 

Don't you know, Fire extinguishers cause Fires !

Having a Fire Alarm, smoke detectors, Fire Extinguishers, makes a Home more likely to have a Fire, than a Home without such devices.

Home owners with Fire extinguishers and alarms, smoke detectors, are more careless than homeowners without such devices, and are more likely to cause a Fire !

See how stupid such statements are ?

VPC statements regarding CCW are in the same category.

 

Addiction.

 

Prove it

 

They've admitted to it in print.