[Mods this is another topic I had no idea where to put] I grew up in an upper middle class home with a liberal lawyer as a Dad. We never wanted for anything. Now he grew up in a single parent home so he understood poverty in a way I never really did. I can remember three experiences in my youth that turned the poverty of others from an abstraction to concrete. 1. I can remember as a very young kid who visited a small decrepit house of a Hispanic boy with multiple families . It was so crowded, and so cluttered and he slept in a room with so many other kids. I recall feeling 'squalor shock' that real people lived like that. 2. At around 13, I remember I got to stay at my uncle Jacks( a 'poor relative' apartment for the first time over a weekend. He was a constant presence in our lives and visited our home rather than the other way around. I thought I was in for a real treat. Dinner was a surprise. We ate Mac and Cheese ( a favorite of mine) but there was no cheese. I knew instinctively for the first time, what it might actually be like too poor to have all the ingredients to cook . I remember feeling so weird that this was a possible thing for people I intimately knew. 3. This was around when I was about 16. We had a half uncle ( 12 years younger than my dad) who we rarely saw and went visiting his family including his mother, who happened to be terminal with cancer. It so happened that the two brothers had to leave on an errand, and my mother ( a nurse) and I stayed with Aunt Mary. I recall exactly what Aunt Mary was fixated on during most of the visit. She kept looking at the bills she was leaving behind. She wasn't talking about death in spiritual or abstract terms, or talking about the pain or the effect of the disease, or any of the topics they seemed to focus on in movies or television specials. No, she worried about how her son was going to manage those medical bills, the rent, the electric etc. I remember thinking nobody should ever have to die, and worry on some *******n bills. That is not what should define ones life or death and I knew what poverty must really mean. Have you more privileged members got stories from your youth, where you got your first gut-punches that hunger, deprivation, and real economic hardship was not just something adults and media talked about, but it involved flesh and blood human beings? edit: PLease members this is designed as a non-partisan thread. It does not in any way have as its premise that any ideology is more or less sensitive, or that either party has better answers. Its designed to share some experiences that those of us who were not raised in poverty can share about realizing the world works differently than it ought to. whether a poster is libertarian, a trumpster or a socialist, this thread is about our first exposures to real empathy based on circumstance. Don't turn it into something more cynical or divisive.
I recall a family of black folks across the street when I was a boy, Lamar was a friend of mine and I often visited. There was maybe 13 people altogether living in a 2 bd (possibly 3 at most) house. Even as young as I was, I realized poverty there.
Damn I just missed the 15 minute cut-off to amend the OP. I would sure like this paragraph to be merged should a Mod be inclined and able. PLease members this is designed as a non-partisan thread. It does not in any way have as its premise that any ideology is more or less sensitive, or that either party has better answers. Its designed to share some experiences that those of us who were not raised in poverty can share about realizing the world works differently than it ought to. whether a poster is libertarian, a trumpster or a socialist, this thread is about our first exposures to real empathy based on circumstance. Don't turn it into something more cynical or divisive.
I think the kicker was seeing multiple kids sharing bedrooms, me and my brother always had our own rooms. We lived in a 2 story with 4 bedrooms on 3 and a half acres, right across the street. Granted, we were not all that wealthy, It was grandma's house that we kids and mom moved in with, after the divorce when we were toddlers. But I did not realize that as a child, i felt wealthy, after all we lived in a big house on that acerage, which was more than 99% of people I knew then.
You get the drift here. This is exactly what I am talking about. I suspect these are actually universal experiences that involve memories we rarely directly attribute to the development of empathy. We recall confusion and some sense of a jarring of our own assumptions, but these are some of the seeds for a social conscience in some sense. Whether these lead to more charitable giving, or an alternative understanding of economic/ political theory, they do mark a capacity to feel something for people in situations that do not endanger our own security. Its similar to seeing serious illness or deformity or disability in others I guess. these kinds of memories and experiences are more important than we suspect.
An interesting topic. I guess whether we grow up in poverty or relative affluence, we see that as 'normal' until we are presented with an opposite reality. Reminds me of the story of the Buddha. Growing up isolated from the reality of poverty behind the castle walls, venturing forth one day to see the reality most lived with, poverty, suffering and old age and death, directly triggering his 'great renunciation' and abandoning his royal life for the alms bowl of the 'beggar' (I say that as Indians saw that as a noble calling) we would call that a beggar or panhandler. The story of the Buddha, enthralls me. Not to get off topic, but an extreme case of the seeds of empathy, taking root.
How about direct experiences in poverty? I grew up knowing what it was like to not have food, a bed on some occasions, a family vehicle, electricity or some other utility frequently shut off, bunny ear anetana no vcr, generic shoes and Salvation Army clothes that were sometimes washed in the bathtub, bikes that I'd cobble together, cockroaches, crappy apartments in bad neighborhoods. It was unpleasant. I have a disdain of poverty and a strong motivation to keep my kids out of it. Big fan of Siddhartha myself
I grew up (many, many years ago) in an upper middle suburb, just a few miles from NYC. My dad was an exec at IBM. When I visited my rural cousins in the summer, I was surprised they didn’t have enough money to get bathing suits. They just wore old denim cut-offs. They didn’t have money for a lot of things I took for granted. It was a little sad. But they always had a roof over their heads and they never went hungry. They really didn’t qualify as “poor”.
Been there myself, and the experience taught me that the only person who can pull you out of poverty is yourself. If you rely on the empathy and charity of others to get you out of poverty you will remain poor all of your life, and there's a good chance your children will, too. All of this has made me a huge believer in the individual and the importance of encouraging people to be strong, independent and self-sufficient individuals who are capable of taking care of themselves and their families. Arguably the most insidious, dangerous and destructive thing I've seen in our society and politics lately is the destigmatization and encouragement of government dependency by politicians and bureaucrats who exploit that dependency for their own self-aggrandizement (power, money, fame, self-righteousness, etc.). The ironic and implosive part of this is that individuals who can't or won't take care of themselves can't and won't be individuals who contribute to our society and can lend a hand to the poor, the elderly, the disabled, wounded veterans, et al, whether it be through taxpayer assistance or private charity. Even worse, in my mind, is that these individuals can never be truly free as long as they are beholden to others. That's not a life I want any of my fellow Americans to live, which is why I think we need a lot less talk about empathy and a lot more talk about individual independence, freedom and responsibility. Great nations are made by great individuals, and the people and countries who lose sight of that do so at their own peril.
