Time to Get Real About Ukraine

The Jupiters deployed in Italy and Turkey actually started the arming sequence when struck by lightning.
They were an obsolete first draft weapon system that needed to be replaced.

"By the time the Turkish Jupiters had been installed, the missiles were already largely obsolete and increasingly vulnerable to Soviet attacks.[32] All Jupiter MRBMs were removed from service by April 1963, as a backdoor trade with the Soviets in exchange for their earlier removal of MRBMs from Cuba." Wiki

 

Is that true?

Thus supporting my point.

 

Yes, the Jupiters were dangerous and obsolete. The US already had far better alternatives.

"On four occasions between mid-October 1961 and August 1962, Jupiter mobile missiles carrying 1.4 megatons of TNT (5.9 PJ) nuclear warheads were struck by lightning at their bases in Italy. In each case, thermal batteries were activated, and on two occasions, tritium-deuterium "boost" gas was injected into the warhead pits, partially arming them." Wiki

 

I'll stick with historians, thanks.

 

You're having grave difficulties motivating that boast.

 

Jesus! That is even more outrageous than the scandal of owning them and the cover-up of Kennedy's bowing before Krustjev. It is possible that the cover-up story was concocted for that reason more than any other. One can assume that Krustjev knew of those malfunctions?

 

Not a bit. The historical record is the record. All your propaganda bloviating can't change that.

 

If the CIA version of history says so then it must be right, eh Jack? I rely on non-biased/non-aligned historians. They are much more likely to reveal the truth.

 

Got some references there? I studied US & Cold War history up to PhD level so I'd love to read these 'non-biased/non-aligned' historians.

 

And in your astute opinion was the removal of US missiles in Turkey & Italy part of Krustjev's condition? Yes or no will do nicely. Or did Kennedy simply demand by threat that Sovjet missiles would not be placed on Cuba, as the CIA/American government told its population? Do you understand the question or should I break it down in simpler terms to avoid a side-stepping labyrinth of smoke and red herrings in order to soften the blow to denial seekers?

 

No, you do not.

 

Financial Times
Military briefing: Ukraine's daring 'shaping operations' stretch Russian defences

 

I'm interested in your sources, not your silly games. Are you prepared to tell someone who actually understands the field of study what sources you are referring to, or are you going to dodge? I know where my money is.

BTW, if you want to reduce complex historical situations to yes/no answers (in itself a waste of everyone's time) at least get the terms of the question right.

 

Ukraine war live updates: Drones attack Russian oil refineries; Germany closes Russian consulates in retaliatory move

 

Russia: Ukraine war takes new turn as shelling and drone ...
https://www.cnn.com › 2023/05/31 › europe › russia-bel...

8 hours ago — Russia saw the effects of its war on Ukraine dramatically reverberate back onto its own territory on Wednesday, after a “massive” shelling ...

 

By arming Ukraine, Biden shows growing appetite to cross Putin’s red lines
Despite warnings that arming Ukraine would start a world war, President Biden continues to push Vladimir Putin’s limits — a strategy that brings risk and reward.
By John Hudson and Dan Lamothe

 

Well, a MiG crashed right next to a Jupiter missile site after a flyover.
It is never safe to assume that the USSR/Russia does not know our secrets.

Nevertheless, the Jupiter missiles were superfluous by the time they were replaced.

 

And I'm not interested in cheap tricks.

Would that be you? I've paid your respect and given you the floor but you didn't answer the fundamental question on which the debate rests. "Yes" or "No"?

No dodge, instead I am meeting the dodge head-on and challenging the diversion that has succeeded in dupping you into undeserved complacency.

I have, it is the very point of the debate, and it ain't no "waste of time" at all. Answer these questions: then we shall proceed:
1). Was it Krustjev's insistence that he would give up the placement of Sovjet missiles on Cuba only if the issue with the Amercian missiles in Turkey and in Italy be settled? Yes or no?
2). Do you believe the US was going to remove their missiles in Turkey and Italy anyway? Yes or no?
Think about it before you answer. Rely not on some CIA-concocted crib sheet. Trust your instincts instead.

 

I certainly do. There are such things as historians. Some are honest and some are not. The ones you rely on have been bought. They are working under the guidance of politically-aligned agents.

 

You boasted about the quality of your sources, yet you refuse to list any of them. Then you claim my even asking you for them is a 'cheap trick'. So we are supposed to just take your word for it that you even have these sources while you criticize everyone else for swallowing some 'CIA version'.

It was aways my assumption that you wouldn't produce anything.

I'll leave you to play silly games, its all you are up to.

 

By your claims you are creating an example of irony.

 

In a sense, yes.

They are irrelevant, but that brings us to your next statement .....

No, I didn't. The 'cheap trick' is the one you fell for when sifting through your sources of information. Here's one of the questions you have failed to answer: "Do you believe the US was going to remove their missiles in Turkey and Italy anyway?" Yes or no? This question is important because it sets the groundwork for the ad hoc "Cuba Crisis" cover-up.

Nope. I am trying to lead you to your own conclusion once you see that you've been duped.

Don't worry, maybe next time you will be right.

 

We'll see.

 

Here's Douglas Macgregor's latest.

What's next in Ukraine? Are more drones on their way to Russia?
https://www.brighteon.com/91f53011-8fe0-481d-9fcc-190fcee5c115

 

Very good.