Timeslips, Real or Fake?

Discussion in 'Science' started by The Rhetoric of Life, Feb 20, 2021.

  1. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    I've not heard of this before this week, but now it's peaked my interest.

    I believe, given the concentrated area of this phenomenon and the sharing of the same time period these stories have, the 1950's - 1960's, that perhaps in Liverpool, England around Bold St, an active time machine is malfunctioning resulting into pulling random people momentarily back there.

    Also, there's rumour China aren't working on a time machine, and whenever a Communist Regime ever says anything, maybe entertain the notion that they're lying.
    Theoretically it's not impossible and might explain timeslips.

    It's also not impossible for it to be a hoax.
     
  2. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    Time slips are rare events. You could travel to Bold St, in Liverpool, England, but chances are good that you'd not experience a time slip. I don't understand how it happens or how they get back to the present. But, you know, people disappear every year. Maybe some of those never made it back to the present.
     
  3. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    Option (1) A transient breach in spacetime temporarily overlaying two separate points in time leaving behind no physical evidence of its existence and observed only by one person (not the person driving the car for instance).
    Option (2) A transient epileptic episode or similar neurological condition effecting the original witness and only the original witness induced by tiredness/medication or some other factor that monetarily effected the visual cortex of the person concerned.

    Ladies and gentlemen the auction starts now.
     
  4. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Is that a fact? Could you please explain the physics using the appropriate math?
     
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  5. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    Option (3) - people are full of b/s telling lies.

    Can't rule it out.
     
  6. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    True, but I didn't want to accuse the original 'witness' of being a liar.
     
  7. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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  8. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    There have been quite a few videos reported like those above. What makes them particularly interesting is that they often come from government webcams. And you can see for example in the first video that the driver reacts to the image as well. He stops apparently to go back and see who he just hit, but no one is there. I would bet that I've seen at least a dozen videos like this over the last few years.

    I'm not sure what to think.

    The idea of temporal anomalies, or perhaps so-called time slips, is not new. Arthur C. Clarke had a series about mysteries and anomalies many years ago. I remember two similar claims that were impressive, where witnesses seemingly experienced events out of time, with seeming shifts into the past and then back again. The stories were impressive but of course there was no evidence. But these videos are evidence of something strange. Not to say it is impossible that they were faked but it seems unlikely given the way the witnesses involved reacted.
     
  9. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    One of the problems with these timeslips is that the subject would also have to calculate where the location is in space as the Earth is not stationary so there would have to be a time change and displacement taking place to stay in the same location on Earth at a different time.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021
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  10. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Not just that. The earth and the entire solar system are moving in space. Were you to really pop up in the past, you would be nowhere near the earth. You would be out in space somewhere.
     
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  11. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    There was a whole sitcom in the UK around the premise of a timeslip in the 1990's who had a character from Liverpool, England whom didn't get to time travel as much as the lead, played by Nicholas Lyndhurst called Goodnight Sweetheart.
    [​IMG]
    Maybe the odd Scouser 'local demonym for Liverpudlian' so depressed with their lives in Liverpool just made it up as a form of escapism after getting the idea from TV. Why Liverpool? IDK social demographic factors of the local area too well, but, 'Ron Wheatcroft'
    [​IMG]
    The plucky Liverpool Son character on the show Goodnight Sweetheart.
    This character was the time traveller's 1990's/present day confident who helpws the bigamist anti hero/hero with his lives in the present and in the past.
    This character always wanted to travel back in time and any trips to the past were short...
    There might be not else much to do in Liverpool so locals start saying stuff for escapism and maybe even attention seeking from family and friends?
    You cannot rule this out.

    IDK
    Just a theory on why Liverpool and why the 1990's and why a timeslip.
    Or they might be telling the truth and there was something in Bold Street active in the past that pulled unwitting people from the 1990's momentarily.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021
  12. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    The only way to validate the videos in question would be to go back to the 'source' recording and review it, which in most cases would be out of the question unless action is taken immediately after the alleged 'phenomenon' has supposedly occurred. As far as I am aware though most of the videos purporting to show things like this only seem to emerge some month/years after the event, which I suppose you could say is suspicious in and of itself. The only other way I can would be to audit the trail of video file back wards from the moment it is first posted on-line back as far as possible so you can examine each step in the chain of possession to see what, if anything was done to it. Call me cynical but I doubt most of the 'publishers' of this stuff would willingly play ball.

    Accepting that we don't have a unified field theory, anything approaching a full understanding of the nature of time and human consciousness any explanation remains purely speculative. I am however inclined to go with Occam's Razer for most of the reported events i.e. deliberate fraud, medical incident, too much beer etc.
     
  13. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    Not necessarily if the causality principal and Einstein's theories hold true true then information and objects (which are sort of the same thing) can only travel forward it time not backwards. So if, and I do means IF time slips area real 'thing' resulting from some unexplained natural principal of space time then they would represent incidents where the past has traveled forward, not the other way round.

    So person X walking down a street in say 21st Century London experiences a transient projection of the same? location. He/she doesn't travel backwards in time the past literally projects forward to them. They can observe 18th century London but 18th Century London doesn't observe them. The key point is causality is preserved, they can see the past but not change it. And at no point in any of the videos of these events have I ever seen the two sides interact.

    The other interesting point is that the person at the other end of the 'slip' would see nothing, they wouldn't even be aware it had happened because light can only travel forward not back. So they don't catch a glimpse of skyscrapers or automobiles or woman wearing short skirts etc

    This also means if the events are 'real' they can still be happening and we won't know. Glimpses of our present are fleetingly being observed 200 years from now or whatever. Which means all those 'disappearances' people want to explain away via time slips or whatever would be people finding themselves transported to into the the future not the past, with no way of leaving a message in a bottle or whatever saying 'Hi, its me from 2021 sending a note from 1790' or similar. Of course this bit is undermined by the (small) fact that we don't have 18th Century chimney sweeps popping into existence in the middle of modern day Chelsea so that pretty much skewers the idea of physical transfer.

    Still there's an SF novel in that somewhere. I must start writing - something about the slips being the unintentional side effects of some future time time observation experiments or similar.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021
  14. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    I have experienced at least a couple of inexplicable events in my life. That changed my perspective forever. I actually am a physicist but know for a fact that things get a lot more complicated than what we can address with science... so far.

    So when it comes to extreme claims like this, while eyewitness testimony can't be taken as fact, it can't be randomly dismissed just because we can't explain it either. Implicit in your comment is that idea that we have to conclude A or B. I refuse to do that without evidence either way. If a significant number of seemingly unrelated claims from a wide variety of disparate sources are telling the same story, then lacking a definitive debunking, the claims slowly gain more weight.

    Truthful claims tend to be consistent over long periods of time. Take for example the claims of freak waves - waves that seeming come from nowhere that can be as much as 100 ft in height. Mariners reported them for centuries and they were always dismissed by science. Our linear wave models did not allow for such waves to exist. Then satellites and oil rigs painted with sensors came along and freak waves were seen from space and also recorded on an oil rig about the same time. Once we knew they were there, someone suddenly discovered an explanation. They are non-linear in nature and can't be predicted using classical wave models. So just like that, the impossible was suddenly possible. And a thousand sailors over the last century weren't all lying.

    There are patterns to truthful claims.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2021
  15. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately history and psychology have also taught us that there are patterns to untruthful claims as well. In this case unlike the case of freak waves, we don't have any independent scientific data from remote sensors etc to confirm things one way or another.
     
  16. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Really? Give me three examples.

    Did you read my post? Did I conclude anything one way or the other? No. But you are trying to do so while also saying we can't know. So which is it?

    It can't be true
    or
    We can't know.

    You can't claim both answers
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2021
  17. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Also, we do have sensor measurements of something strange. We have the stored data of photons incident on a detector over a period of time. That is to say, we have the videos I posted. I would bet they're fake but I don't know.
     
  18. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    When I said sensors I was referring to something perhaps a little more 'independent' and verifiable than videos posted on the internet.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2021
  19. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    Yes I did read your post. And no you didn't conclude anything one way or the other, nor was I inferring in any way that you had. I was simply saying that the jury is 'out' on the topic with there being no concrete way to verify which, if any of these reports are valid.

    As far as historic examples of untruthful scientific and pseudo scientific claims go we have decades of examples of various claims psychic phenomena, hauntings, UFO's and crypto biology etc. The Cottingley Fairies, Piltdown Man and the Loch Ness Monster come to mind, not to mention multiple reports of UFO sightings/contact. All of them initially accepted as reputable and viewed as externally and internally consistent for some considerable time.

    The three examples I named specifically were all initially examined and at least by certain people, even experts in their fields accessed as reputable and worthy at least of some of further scientific examination. The witnesses were regarded as reliable and the evidence significant, at least to begin with. And all were eventually found to be hoaxes driven by people who rationalized their frauds driven by well recognized psychological factors like need for fame, peer approval or greed (or a combination of all three).

    Finally re; 'It can't be true' and 'We can't know' issue. Where did I say it cant be true? Until physics advances its notions of issues like 'time' and consciousness it may not be/probably isn't true but that's not the same thing as 'cant be'. In this case we have video from unverified sources with no chain of custody. In terms of evidence that is an issue and remains so until those issues are resolved, just like freak waves were until hard data finally began to emerge. So yes, we cant know - not yet.
     
  20. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    IDK, anything capable in my opinion of manipulating time can also manipulate space, like the unified field theory linking space and time that apparently transported the USS Eldridge from Philadelphia to New York using another dimension and travelled through time.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_Experiment
    So who's to say time machines aren't capable of travelling from where one point on an ever moving Earth is to where that point on an ever moving Earth will be / was at the intended time / date of arrival.
    It might be needed since our sun is moving through the Milky Way pulling us and other solar bodies along with it.
    Our galaxy's even moving and is on a collision course with another galaxy, so space is so big, everything, has room to drift forever.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2021
  21. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    Except as previously noted Carlos Allende later admitted the entire story was made up. No secret research project, no travel to 'other dimensions', no time travel and no aliens.
     

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