Trump hikes price tag for US forces in Korea almost 400% as Seoul questions alliance

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by Same Issues, Nov 15, 2019.

  1. Sobo

    Sobo Well-Known Member

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    Germany is not threatened. Your bases purpose is to ve the central hub in your middle east invasions.
     
  2. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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    If Germany is not threatened then we need to pull our troops out. Russia hasn’t been trying to annex old Soviet territories. Have they?
     
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  3. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    How do Americans pay for the police and troops that protect us?
     
  4. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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    My son is leaving for Korea soon. That's how we pay.
     
  5. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    China will do it for much cheaper :)
     
  6. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    SK should pay through the nose for the US forces that protect them.
     
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  7. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Godspeed to him. :salute: :flagus:
     
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  8. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It is true that they have not.
     
  9. Texan

    Texan Well-Known Member

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    Crimea didn't happen? Is that what 0bama meant by " we'll be more flexible after the election"? We had a treaty to protect Ukraine, but Trump doesn't care about Ukraine?
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2019
  10. FlamingLib

    FlamingLib Well-Known Member

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    If that were true, rent and property values would not be high in those cities. No one would wants to live in places where there are "hills of garbage, sewage, teeming with rats, needles, disease human misery and death", obviously. Since rent and property values are through the roof in places like San Fran, New York, and L.A., what you're claiming is clearly wrong.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2019
  11. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Crimea has been a strategic port of Russia for 400 years. Part of the agreement with Ukraine was that Russia would keep that port.
    When Ukraine leadership threatened to turn that port over to NATO - Russia was forced to act to protect its Strategic interest.

    Next example ?
     
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  12. FlamingLib

    FlamingLib Well-Known Member

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    Wrong. Smaller nations like Israel, S. Korea, Germany, France, Belgium, the UK, Estonia, etc. are desperate for America to maintain a global presence and stay in NATO. After the Soviet Union, former society bloc countries were clamoring to join NATO. There was no bullying. Quite the opposite.

    Our diplomacy in places like Central America and Middle East has been a mess, but we are a stabilizing influence in the world, we protect numerous countries, and global trade depends on us.

    There are three fundamental problems with the argument in favor of abandoning America’s security role in the world. The first problem is that the United States cannot withdraw without sucking the air out of the system. U.S. power and presence have been the central structural feature that holds the present international order together. It flavors the very air that fills the sphere that is the international system. Whether it is the size of the U.S. economy, its capacity for innovation, the role of the dollar as the world’s reserve currency or the contribution of U.S. military power to the stability and peace of the global commons, the present world order has “Made in the USA” written all over it.

    The international system is not a game of Jenga where the worst thing that can happen is that one’s tower collapses. Start taking away the fundamental building blocks of the international order, particularly American military power, and the results are all but certain to be major instability, increased conflict rates, rapid proliferation of nuclear weapons, economic dislocation and, ultimately, serious and growing threats to security at home.

    https://www.jewishpolicycenter.org/2013/05/31/us-military-power/
     
  13. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    LOL! Do you think NBC News staged that video of the streets of LA?

    Vote Democrat for Free Sidewalk Housing, Free Needles, Free Sidewalk Toilets, Typhus, and Affordable Fentanyl!

    The Whole World Is Watching.
     
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  14. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Did the US or Ukraine threaten to deny Russia use of the port?
     
  15. Sobo

    Sobo Well-Known Member

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    We are one of the strongest economies in the world. Do extensive business with Russia ect. We have no Problems with Russia
     
  16. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Of course not - and that would have been an absurdly silly thing for US or Ukraine to do. Over the course of time however - the port would become a NATO outpost.. which is why Putin drew a red line.

    The history of Eastern Europe is one of NATO violating its agreements. As Russia demilitarized and moved out - NATO moved in and built bases - poking the Bear - but, the Bear didn't react.

    The Bear started to react when Bush unilaterally pulled out of the ABM treaty around 2002 - and then announced the plan to put ABM's on Russia's border in Poland and Czech in 2007. This destabilized nuclear detente' and force Russia to take counter measures.

    Ukraine was the last straw - and every leader of NATO knew it - yet they went ahead and poked the Bear anyway. Putin's reaction was no surprise to any of these leaders - Yet - they all wandered around like disingenuous fools afterwards going "why would Russia do this" ?

    Just like when the Obama Clown went on TV and said "Russia has violated the short and intermediate range treaty". This was followed up with the media posting footage of Reagan signing the arms limitation treaties - as if we were the good guys and Russia was the bad. Pure propaganda :)

    While it is true that Russia violated the agreements - what Obama fails to mention was " we forced Russia to do this".

    There were various ways for Russia to counter the ABM threat. Russia at one point mentioned nukes in space. It takes roughly 30 min for a nuke to get here from Russia - I would not make me sleep better at night knowing one was above my head .. 2 minutes away. Talk about hair trigger world - a total escalation of the arms race towards nuclear oblivion.

    Russia - fortunately - didn't do this. What they did do is double down on their subs - and focused on nuclear cruise missiles. The point of the cruise missiles would be that prior to launch - the short range nuclear cruise missiles would first take out the ABM's. At the same time our communication and military satellites would be taken out - followed by a few high altitude EMP blasts - then in darkness we would wait for the apocalypse.

    Russia also ramped up efforts on various other technologies such as hypersonic glide vehicles and other stuff - to ensure that MAD was still a reality.
     
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  17. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    The Ukrainians weren't clamoring to get in. They elected a President who looked to Russia. The US wasn't happy with this, so they fomented a "color revolution," and usurped power. Biden had a major role in this, btw. US kleptocrats were happy.

    The international order is collapsing anyway. Hoi Poloi all over Europe (and elsewhere) are rebelling against the "world order," which benefits the Global Elite but not so much the common person. All US military power will get us is more war, and unsuccessful war at that. When and where has US military power done this country any good, recently?

    The future belongs to China, not the US. Let them waste their substance enforcing a world order and let us hunker down and protect ourselves.
     
  18. Moonglow

    Moonglow Banned

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    We don't need any protection it's all for the wealthy..
     
  19. stone6

    stone6 Well-Known Member Donor

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    I think the premise is that there is a good chance they may, if we pull out. In Germany's case, they would be forced to develop nuclear weapons for self-protection, if they lose the U.S./NATO umbrella. The costs...from NATO to South Korea are certainly negotiable. NATO reached the 2% of GDP for defense agreement any a NATO Conference in Wales, during the Obama administration. I don't think Trump has asked for any more than that, but he's moved the timetable up a year or so. The Obama agreement was 2% by 2020.
    A similar agreement could be reached with South Korea, but they may already devote that amount to their own defense? Don't know? Trump's policies with China and North Korea have thus far failed. Removal of our forces from South Korea would force South Korea into the Chinese camp for protection from North Korea. The President is dismantling U.S. foreign policy that was created after WW II, without any clear strategic policy replacement, other than "if you don't pay us for your protection, we'll withdraw it." This, in itself, seriously endangers our national security. It's time for former President's, Secretaries of State and Defense, National Security officials, et al to begin speaking up.
     
  20. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Thanks in part to our corrupt, warfare addicted, incompetent political class the USG has lot's of enemies, and every American is always a potential target. We do need protection, but our national security bureaucracy does not make Americans feel very safe.

    “Record High in U.S. Say Big Government Greatest Threat, Now 72% say it is greater threat than big business or big labor”, by Jeffrey M. Jones, Gallup, 12/18/13.
    http://www.gallup.com/poll/166535/r...syndication&utm_content=morelink&utm_term=All
     
  21. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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    Okay.... so American forces seek to keep the Sth China sea open for
    international freedom of navigation. Please tell me what wealthy
    people benefit from this.
    And America under Clinton helped the poor Bosnians being killed by
    the Serbs (note - the "Peace Movement" didn't give a fig about these
    Muslims) Can you tell me what wealthy person benefited by this?

    Methinks you are suffering from envy, and a blatant disregard for
    world peace.
     
  22. Poohbear

    Poohbear Well-Known Member

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    I like this "we forced Russia to do it."
    I love how Russia can parade its missiles in the streets, boast
    of swamping the US East coast with radioactive tsunamis,
    murder its own dissidents in European streets, nibble away at
    its neighbors lands, threaten the Baltics, probe Western air
    defenses, buzz carrier groups, hack Western computer systems,
    develop new medium range rocket systems, refine space war
    tech, shoot down civil airliners, interfere in almost every Western
    election and even claim its the most invaded nation in the world,
    despite joining with Hitler in starting WWII.
     
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  23. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    The Military Industrial Complex here and in Russia and in China has to find or manufacture enemies to flourish. The results are probably inevitable.

    Nevertheless, I think the primary factor activating Putin's decision to grab Crimea was his certain knowledge that it could be done with relative ease and little risk. There was virtually nothing to stop them, and the Crimea has always been The Precious for Russia's leaders.
     
  24. stone6

    stone6 Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's their Navy's access to the Mediterranean.
     
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  25. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    The CP leaders of China have showed the world how to build islands.
    Why hasn't the USG started building barrier islands as far out into the Atlantic as is feasible to mitigate the very real threat of tsunamis to our East coast?

    And for that matter why isn't the USG partnering with The Philippines to build islands off its coast to challenge China's claims to the sea lanes?
     

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