Trump's Four Obstruction of Justice Crimes 100% proven in the Mueller Report

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Golem, May 28, 2019.

  1. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    America can't wait that long. If Trump is not impeached and removed from office, this country and the presidency will forever be changed and headed toward intolerant totalitarianism and national popular rebellion.
     
  2. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    The text you quoted is irrelevant to what is actually written down. Please show me where in 19-27.220 it says that Mueller could not say "yes, President Trump broke XXX laws, here's why I believe that....". Don't rely on others to make your argument. Rely on yourself and reading comprehension of what is actually written down by OLC.

    Not British. And we're not a democracy. We are a Democratic Republic. 3 branches of government. Judicial, which interprets the laws, Legislative, which makes the laws, and the Executive which executes the laws. The Executive branch is the one that all federal prosecutor jobs falls under. All of them. This is not up for debate. This is a fact. Even Neal Katyal, an Obama administration lawyer admits that yes, Trump could have constitutionally and legally fire Mueller directly.

    How Trump Can Legally Fire Mueller...On His Own.
    Yes, Trump can fire Mueller. But a normal president would know not to try it.

    Like it or not, Trump, or any President for that matter, has the power to fire a federal prosecutor because under Article 2 of the Constitution the President has ultimate authority when it comes to the Executive Branch, and Mueller was under the purview of the DOJ, which is under the purview of the Executive Branch. This does not mean that they should, or that it is wise to do so. Doing such would surely be considered a Constitutional Crisis and be cause for impeachment. But then impeachment is a political ploy and does not have to be based on any laws. In fact Congress can impeach a President for any reason what so ever. Even if that reason is that they simply do not like the looks of the President. Of course doing such would be detrimental to them come election season. As happened against Republicans when they attempted to remove Bill Clinton from the Presidency for perjury. It was a stupid charge and not worth impeachment proceedings. The American People saw that and made their displeasure against Republicans known by Re-electing Clinton AND ousting some Republicans from Congress.
     
  3. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately for you, Trump IS going to be President for the rest of this Term. And being an incumbent President with a good economy the chances of him being re-elected are pretty good if history repeats itself. No President that has had a good economy has not been re-elected. Not saying that he WILL be re-elected. Just saying that he has a good chance of being re-elected. Add into that that Democrats have no real policy that they have put forth beyond "Trump Bad!" and the chances increase. If Democrats want to get rid of Trump this election season then they are going to have to put forth a policy that consists of more than just "Trump Bad!".
     
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  4. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Actually the democrats have a platform. This upcoming debate will outline it. Let's call it a 'free for all'.
     
  5. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    There's a case to be made for that. I'm all for impeachment proceedings. Even though I'm not sure he'll be removed through impeachment. But he would be exposed. As would all GOP Senators who would prefer to protect him and their own re-election odds over protecting the Constitution and the laws of this country. And that might be an even better alternative than a Pence presidency.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019
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  6. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    We'll see.
     
  7. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    Thats not true
     
  8. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Why don't you know about Manafort meeting with Russians? Mueller's report talks about a meeting at Trump Tower in June of 2016 involving Trump Jr., Manafort and a Russian lawyer who'd been offering "dirt" on the Hillary Clinton campaign courtesy of the Russian government. Later the meeting was spun into a meeting about "adoptions" but that was shown to be a cover up.

    "the investigation established that the Russian government perceived it would benefit from a Trump presidency and worked to secure that outcome, and that the campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts."

    And after the Russians helped Trump get elected though efforts that were apparent to the Trump campaign, the report says, the Russians reached out to members of the Trump transition team, including the president's son-in-law, ostensibly seeking the fruits of their labors. After a backchannel meeting in the Seychelles, the head of Russia's sovereign wealth fund passed a friend of the president's son-in-law a two-page document proposing how the Trump administration could promote "U.S.-Russia reconciliation
    ."

    Two days before Trump took office, the document found its way to Jared Kushner, who promptly passed it along to incoming White House adviser Steve Bannon and incoming Secretary of State Rex Tillerson."

    In Volume I of Mueller's 448-page report, Mueller details a bevy of contacts between the Trump campaign and Russia.

    "The Russian contacts consisted of business connections, offers of assistance to the campaign, invitations for candidate Trump and Putin to meet in person, invitations for campaign officials and representatives of the Russian government to meet, and policy positions seeking improved U.S.-Russian relations," the Mueller report says.
    https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/na...-camp-were-friends-benefits-collusion-n996101

    Where do you get your "news"?
     
  9. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    Your example of a meeting with the female Russian lawyer is not collusion

    the investigation established that the Russian government perceived it would benefit from a Trump presidency and worked to secure that outcome, and that the campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts."

    That is a damn lie by the Deep State
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019
  10. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Try proving it. That's just your uninformed opinion.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019
  11. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    I dont have to prove a negative

    You have to show the proof that russia preferred trump
     
  12. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    The report says it. Good enough for me and over half the population.
     
  13. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    In that case the Deep State swamp rat who says so has to prove it

    And he cant
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019
  14. jack4freedom

    jack4freedom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    How about Manafort giving internal polling data regarding closely contested states during the campaign to Kalimnick. The OSC report clearly states that Russian military intel was involved in a concerted effort to swing the election in favor of Trump. With that in mind it seems pretty clear to me that Manafort, Trump’s campaign chairman at the time, supplying that information to Kilimnik who is closely tied to Putin is the very definition of collusion.

    The lawyer you speak of is a known Russian lobbyist who had been in the US for years trying to get politicians like Dana Rohrbacher and others to reverse the sanction upon Russian crooks and murderers known as The Magnitsky Act. When the meeting was proposed by this woman’s associate, dirt on Hillary Clinton was offered. Trump Jr. said: “I love it”. Maybe taking that meeting and then lying about it was not technically illegal but it certainly smacks of collusion.

    On one hand, the Trumpists are claiming that the OSC report totally exonerates Trump and his campaign. Then you turn around and say that the OSC is a Deep State lie. So which is it?
     
  15. jack4freedom

    jack4freedom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If Mueller is a Deep State rat as you say, then I would love to see some of these loudmouthed GOP Congresscreeps say it to his face when he comes to testify before them. Next month we shall see.
     
  16. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    How about sticking to the quote?

    Mueller is making slander that he cant prove
     
  17. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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  18. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Then what crimes was it that Mueller referred to?
     
  19. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Mac-7 was referring to me because I did "prove it".
     
  20. Nemesis

    Nemesis Well-Known Member

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    You've been living with Patrick Starfish under a rock in the Ocean for the past few years? Should we "prove" to you that water is wet? How about that ice is cold?

    From the Mueller Report:

    As set forth in detail in this report, the Special Counsel's investigation established that Russia interfered in the 2016 presidential election principally through two operations. First, a Russian entity carried out a social media campaign that favored presidential candidate Donald J. Trump and disparaged presidential candidate Hillary Clinton. Second, a Russian intelligence service conducted computer-intrusion operations against entities, employees, and volunteers working on the Clinton Campaign and then released stolen documents. The investigation also identified numerous links between the Russian government and the Trump Campaign. Although the investigation established that the Russian government perceived it would benefit from a Trump presidency and worked to secure that outcome, and that the Campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts, the investigation did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in its election interference activities.
     
  21. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Well, we'll see about that on July 17.
     
  22. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    And Trump Jr. Rejected what was offered. Muellers report states that.
     
  23. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    Now read the underlined red part. There is a difference between expecting to benefit and actually working to make that benefit happen. Or should we prove to you that water is wet or that ice is cold?
     
  24. jack4freedom

    jack4freedom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Mueller indicted several Russian government officials by grand jury. Are you saying that the evidence he produced was false? He does not seem like that kind of person to me, nor does his 50 record of service to his country indicate that.
     
  25. jack4freedom

    jack4freedom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think Manafort giving internal polling data to Kalimnick could be construed as coordinating with the Russians in their efforts to swing the election. However it looks like Mueller felt that he could not prove conspiracy beyond a reasonable doubt in that case.

    The bottom line is that the OSC report does not totally exonerate Trump and many of his associates. I read both volumes and there is a lot of troubling information disseminated. I welcome any and all further investigation into what did happen and how we can prevent or at least minumize the damage of further attacks like this.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019

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