US Defence Secretary James Mattis says climate change is already destabilising the world

Discussion in 'Environment & Conservation' started by MrTLegal, Mar 15, 2017.

  1. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ld-security-donald-trump-global-a7630676.html

    It is a really sad world that we live in when the US Defense Secretary recognizes the dangers associated with Climate Change to our National Security and the President of the United States is set to sign an order that greatly reduces the role that climate change plays in decision making across the U.S. Government.
     
  2. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    Climate change could cause stronger turbulence for airline passengers...
    [​IMG]
    Climate Change Could Cause More Turbulent Flights
    April 11, 2017 - Climate change could cause stronger turbulence for airline passengers, according to a new study.
    See also:

    Scientists Link El Nino to Increase in Cholera in Eastern Africa
    April 10, 2017 - Researchers are reporting a link between a climate phenomenon know as El Nino and the number of cholera cases in eastern Africa. Predicting when there’s going to be an El Nino event could improve public health preparedness.
     
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  3. AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS

    AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS Well-Known Member

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    Just because the climate changes does not mean it's caused by man..

    It has changed many many times with no help from man in the past..
     
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  4. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Do your underpants change all by themselves? No? Neither does the climate
     
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  5. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Mattis looks straight out of 'Dr Strangelove' to me!
     
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  6. AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS

    AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS Well-Known Member

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    You are quite ignorant to think that the climate doesn't change by itself..

    Did we humans cause the last 5 ice ages too?
    lol
     
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  7. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    No the last five ice ages all had causes that drove the change

    What is the current cause driving THIS change?
     
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  8. AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS

    AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS Well-Known Member

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    You are wrong, their are only theories..
     
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  9. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Sorry but you cannot have it both ways. If you are claiming that climate has changed in the past then you have to accept the evidence of that change and the evidence of the forcing agent causing that change
     
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  10. AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS

    AGWisFAKEsillyBABYKILLERS Well-Known Member

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    The climate has changed all over the place in history and no one knows exactly why..
     
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  11. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    We actually do have some very good ideas as to why previous climatic changes took place - orbital variations, solar intensity, volcanic activity, El Nino/La Nina events, greenhouse gas concentrations in the atmosphere, etc.

    And more importantly, scientists are absolutely able to measure the impact of those variables today. The current climate change is occurring primarily because of CO2 being put there by humans.

    My front lawn has been getting wet for thousands of years without human intervention because of rain. Yesterday though, it got wet despite the fact that it did not rain in my area. What're the chances that the reason it got wet yesterday is because of human influence?
     
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  12. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    How do you know it has changed? Through scientific reports - how do WE know there have been drivers of that change - through scientific reports

    So who is right?

    And it still leaves the question - WHAT IS DRIVING THE CURRENT CHANGE?

    Climate is subject to entropy - it will not change without some driver
     
  13. Just_a_Citizen

    Just_a_Citizen Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    About as good as another natural event, causing a river to flood, breaking waterlines, or destroying a dam, or levee.
    Granted, 66% roughly of those other possibilities, DO involve human activity in some way.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
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  14. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    How do you know that the climate has changed in the past?

    Hint: Scientists
     
  15. Professor Peabody

    Professor Peabody Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Earths climate has changed countless times over the last 4 billion years, where's the proof the same isn't happening again?

    BTW.....Have you sold your cars, cut off your electricity and the energy you use for heat?
     
  16. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    One day republicans tell us there is no change and polar bears are doing better than ever....the next there is climate change but we're not at fault
     
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  17. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    First, how do you know that the climate has changed countless times over the last 4 billion years?

    Second, we know and can study the various reasons that the climate has changed in the past: Orbital variations, Solar intensity, Volcanoes, El Nino/La Nina, natural increases in the concentration of Greenhouse Gases, etc. And because we can study those variables with a lot more detail, we can also rule those other options out as a possible explanation for the current change. For example, a giant meteor caused a really big climate change roughly 67 million years ago. But I can tell you for a certainty that a giant meteor is not the reason for the current climate change.

    You also probably noticed that I referenced the natural increase to greenhouse gases and you're probably wondering how we know that the current increase is not related to that same natural process. Well, we can measure the isotopes of the CO2 currently in the atmosphere and compare it to the isotopes of the CO2 found in ice core data. The CO2 in the current atmosphere is a different type because it is created through fossil fuel combustion.

    Third, no.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
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  18. VietVet

    VietVet Well-Known Member

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    One of the few competent and non-corrupt people Trump has, and now the wack jobs will be attacking him because he speaks the truth.
    Yes ,there have been climate swings in the past - this time we are accelerating the change.
    Scientists have found air trapped in ice cores and can plot the relationship between climate and CO2.
    We should listen to the vast majority of scientists and not listen to either crackpots or those who have been bought by the fossil fuel industry.
    I am pleased Mattis speaks the truth.
     
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  19. ThorInc

    ThorInc Banned

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    yeah, but he is in a tough spot trying to walk the BS admin line. You can see his instinct is not to BS.
     
  20. Professor Peabody

    Professor Peabody Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It's called ice cores.

    There were Herbivore Dinosaurs and the vegetation to support them between 400 to 1200 miles from the North Pole about 60 Million years ago. The fossilized remains of both don't lie. Something cause the Earth to warm to that extent, man didn't exist and the fossils for oil were still walking around and growing from the ground. So what caused the Earth to warm that much? We know through indisputable fact that there were Herbivore Dinosaurs and the vegetation to support them between 400 to 1200 miles from the North Pole about 60 Million years ago.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/arcticdino/about.html
     
  21. MrTLegal

    MrTLegal Well-Known Member

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    Did you study the ice cores personally? My guess is that you are relying on the conclusion of the scientists who did study those ice cores.
     
  22. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am wide open to the possibility that much of the warming could be the result of
    the full orbital pattern of the earth around the sun.........

    One thing for sure is that only one nation on earth has experienced COOLING in
    their climate. That nation is Israel.... and they were applying something along the line
    of the theory put forward by Mr. Carl Cantrell of New Mexico.

    Carl and I submitted for the Virgin Earth Challenge..... but we didn't win!


    My two somewhat humorous submissions for $25 million Virgin Earth Challenge.


    Dear Mr. Branson:

    It is my firm belief that the number one technological device to reduce atmospheric greenhouse gases has already been invented. It is the tree.

    What is desperately needed at this time is not necessarily a new mechanical device but instead a paradigm shift in economic theory regarding monetary policy. We require a readily understandable explanation on how leaders in business and government can direct not only millions, but actually trillions of dollars of investment into combating global warming.


    One of the most effective practical methods that could be put into place in the least amount of time would be dozens of the largest possible desalinization plants all along the Mediterranean and Red Seas. Huge quantities of fresh water could be dripped onto the Sinai and Sahara deserts and voila, well chosen species of newly planted fast growing trees could soon change the color of these relatively desolate areas, significantly reduce atmospheric CO2, positively affect local weather patterns and at the same time significantly counterbalance the increases in worldwide ocean levels as the polar ice caps melt. This will buy us some extra time and thus expand the "very brief window of opportunity to deal with climate change."

    So who is going to finance the construction of all these massive installations not to mention the planting of all those seedling trees?

    I believe that it is possible for you to do this yourself Mr. Branson. You have already created a Virgin currency unit/coupon which has astonishing long term potential. My wife Maria Jose just returned from a two week trip to the British VIRGIN Islands. It is theoretically possible to link your Virgin coupon with the national currency of a small nation and you could soon be playing around in macro-economics. Considering the volume of business being done through your Virgin Group I would submit that you already are.

    Pope Benedict XVI may be in an even stronger position than you Mr. Branson to transform the world economy virtually overnight through the introduction of a new Vatican Currency Unit that could be linked with each and every national currency where the Vatican State is free to do business.

    I plan to elaborate in great detail on these two major alternatives in a later writing but I felt that you and your staff should now see the simple explanation that I wrote up for applying this theory within a micro-economy to greatly reduce unemployment. Although combating global warming would seem to be a conflicting goal to job creation, there need be no dissonance when we all have a better grasp of the big picture.

    .......


    Dear Mr. Branson:
    Dear Mr. Gore:
    Dear Mr. Tickell:
    Dear Mr. Lovelock:
    Dear Mr. Hansen:
    Dear Mr. Flannery:

    I am extremely glad that you are all doing your best to attempt to find a method to save the earth from the many perils associated with global warming. I believe you will be tremendously encouraged by the theory presented by biologist Carl Cantrell who makes a convincing case that global cooling can be initiated simply by pumping vast quantities of fresh water into the world’s largest deserts.


     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
  23. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Dr. James Hansen has stated that the last time that average global temperatures rose by
    three degrees, oceans levels rose by twenty meters over a period of about four centuries.

    This sounds terrible.... .but in actually can give us motivation to alter the world
    financial system in such a way that is win - win - win - win - win.

    Was Moses - Moshe a brilliant economist?

    "And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded.
    And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do." (Genesis 11)


    .....

     
  24. Vegas giants

    Vegas giants Banned

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    But wait....those scientists are all lying. LOL
     
  25. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Even if we are a major factor in climate change........
    a carbon tax doesn't seem to be working well at all......

    Europe’s CO2 Emissions INCREASE While America’s Fall [MAPS]
     

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