US soldiers committing more sex crimes

Discussion in 'Security & Defenses' started by Uncle Meat, Jan 20, 2012.

  1. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

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    Also notice, the statistics never say who is commiting the rapes.

    Are you aware of how many civilians serve on our bases downrange?

    You only want to attack and skewer people in uniform, so things like truth matter very little.
     
  2. Herkdriver

    Herkdriver New Member

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    You have to be careful not to reduce the argument to just statistics...ideally there should be 0% sexual assaults within the ranks...and a female or male should not fear retribution if he or she reports it to higher ups if indeed a sexual assault has actually taken place. Arguing that there are fewer of these crimes taking place within the ranks as compared to the civilian side of things appears too dismissive. Honestly I have no idea how prevalent it is or isn't but minimally there should be zero tolerance for it. Arguing purely on the basis of numbers and statistics dehumanizes the actual trauma to the victim.
    On the flipside, the motive for posting these sort of sensationalized stories is anti-Americanism and anti-military rhetoric.
     
  3. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    I state the facts and have no tolerance for people like who manipulate statistics and sensationalize. No one thinks that assault/rape is "good", but its not something thats out of control in the military. The military is one of the last bastions of the masculine world and is the target of femminists and other people with political agendas.
     
  4. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    You, and the article, said that women were more likely to be sexually assaultd than shot in Iraq. You said this as though it were some kind of abomination. I broke down the statistics and showed you just how silly your numbers were because civilain women in the United States were also 14 times as likely to be sexually assaulted.

    You also can't say that violent sex crimes increased by 90 percent, a more accurate statement would be that reporting of violent sex crimes increased by 90 percent during that period.
     
  5. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    I never asserted that women were less likely to be sexually assaulted in the military. I don't have those statistics. You'd need an accurate comparison of civilain women aged 18-25 compared to military women. I used statistics to show just how silly and disingenuous Colonel K and the author of the article were.
     
  6. Herkdriver

    Herkdriver New Member

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    I have no idea what the statistics are, but let's assume it occurs with less frequency than the civilian World...
    It should first and foremost be condemned. There's no "test" for this upon entry into the military...background checks can be done and prior criminal records checked. Beyond this, you can't predict a future sexual assault perpetrator. Regulations are in place that if a person is found guilty of this they're punished. I'm sure there are false reports also...
    The insinuation is that the military harbors rapists and does little to nothing to address the issue or prevent it...my argument is more along those lines the military as an institution condemns this type of crime; it's just difficult to predict in advance.
     
  7. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    I agree. I also assert that when you put young men and women in close contact with each other under a lot of pressure these things happen, military or otherwise. People are people, regardless of service. I get irritated everytime the media throws in (ex-military/Iraq vet) commitsY crime. You read the article and find out that the guy has been out for 3 years and was a water purification specialist on his one deployment. Unfortunately, the media and much of the public are too stupid(Ignorant?) to realize that it ISN'T PTSD related. Service members commit murder, rape, assault etc. just as any other demographic anywhere does.
     
  8. Herkdriver

    Herkdriver New Member

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    I completely agree. The lead story is always "Iraq war vet robs bank." Never ex-waiter from TGIF mugs man in park. It's an insinuation that all veterans are ticking time bombs waiting to explode on the general public; we're dysfunctional anti-social accidents waiting to happen.
     
  9. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    I blame the media, they disgust me today. They're arrogant self-appointed idealists who think their cause is so noble they can violate all decency and even truth. So many of them slant their stories and push for that golden pulitzer. If they smell blood in the water they go so far as to make stories up and use unreliable sources. Their arrogance infuriates me, they believe they're on moral high ground because they report the news..a profession that while important, hardly involves the complications or difficult decisions made by those they so snobbishly judge.
     
  10. Anders Hoveland

    Anders Hoveland Banned

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    Probably because the US army is now more racially diverse than ever before.
     
  11. Uncle Meat

    Uncle Meat Banned

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    I never said any such thing.

    You're confusing me with someone else.

    Scroll back and check.
     
  12. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    One only needs consider the backgrounds of the majority of those who go into the military.

    Many of the folks joining do so not because of any desire to serve their country but because there are little other opportunities available to them.

    Folks from disadvantaged backgrounds tend to have a higher incidence of social abberation.

    Rather than comparing stats from the population at large one should compare stats to that found in Harlem or the slums of Detroit.

    I bet the rates would be far more similar.
     
  13. Courtney203

    Courtney203 New Member

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    Makes sense since women are not allowed to serve in combat roles. It also does nothing for your argument because you left a giant hole for anyone who knows how to debate to crawl thru and destroy your point. It could point out how insignificant the casualty rates are in fighting the war in Iraq and downplay the medias sensationalism over how many have died fighting the Iraq war. It seems to be the cornerstone of their argument to stop the conflict. If a comparison like this were made downplayed the casualties in Iraq, it would take the wind out of the sails of the idealists who protest against it. Lets say we compare the casualty rates of men between the ages of 18-45 in a large city to those of the men serving in Iraq.
     
  14. Up On the Governor

    Up On the Governor Well-Known Member

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    Kaboom. Why is this forum predominantly comprised of troll threads?
     
  15. Up On the Governor

    Up On the Governor Well-Known Member

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    According to the DoJ, a woman in the US is raped every two minutes. 191,670 cases reported in 2005. Needless to say a lot of instances of rape are never reported to authorities.
     
  16. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    You ignorantly perpetuate a myth.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111903791504576587244025371456.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

    Do some research before making such statements.
     
  17. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  18. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    I'm glad to see you admit your error, thats more than many on this forum can do.
     
  19. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It is not foolish to make mistakes .. we are all human.

    What characterizes the fool is one who tries to maintain their position in spite of being shown to be in error.
     
  20. Up On the Governor

    Up On the Governor Well-Known Member

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    There is making a mistake, and then there is talking out of your arse to degrade military personnel. A mistake would be accidentally switching numbers in a statistic. You had absolutely no basis for your claim.
     
  21. Uncle Meat

    Uncle Meat Banned

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    The Making of an American Soldier: Why Young People Join the Military

    ' George Bush likes to say it's because they're patriots, but the truth may have more to do with financial need and recruiters targeting those with limited economic options. '

    ' Recruiters may not explicitly target "the poor," but there is mounting evidence that they target those whose career options are severely limited. According to a 2007 Associated Press analysis, "nearly three-fourths of [U.S. troops] killed in Iraq came from towns where the per capita income was below the national average. More than half came from towns where the percentage of people living in poverty topped the national average." '

    http://www.alternet.org/story/52233/
     
  22. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    Your article is wrong. The source is also suspect at best and mostly conjecture. As my WSJ article clearly showed, the military is underrepresented in the lowest 20% of Americans and OVER represented in the top 20 and 40%.
     
  23. Uncle Meat

    Uncle Meat Banned

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    So anything you post is correct, and anything anyone else posts, that's contrary to your beliefs, is "wrong"?

    Hmmm, It doesn't really work like that.

    The article is legitimate, until proven otherwise.

    ' Recruiters may not explicitly target "the poor," but there is mounting evidence that they target those whose career options are severely limited. According to a 2007 Associated Press analysis, "nearly three-fourths of [U.S. troops] killed in Iraq came from towns where the per capita income was below the national average. More than half came from towns where the percentage of people living in poverty topped the national average." '
     
  24. IgnoranceisBliss

    IgnoranceisBliss Well-Known Member

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    That's an extremely broad open ended statistic. It doesn't even say TROOPS come from families below the average...it only says they come from towns below average. How far below average? My article, the WSJ (very respected source) actually breaks down the economic background of the troops themselves, not their town. Thus it's more reliable.
     
  25. Uncle Meat

    Uncle Meat Banned

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    The author from my source:

    Jorge Mariscal

    "Mariscal, Jorge (George)
    Associate Professor - Literature; Director - Chicano/a~Latino/a Arts and Humanities Program
    Areas of Expertise: Chicano/Mexican cultures in the United States, history and role of Latinos in the U.S. military, Spanish and Latin American concepts of "race," U.S. social movements
    Languages: Spanish/English"


    http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/news/spanishexperts/campuses/ucsd.html



    The author from your source:

    Anne Marlowe

    "Marlowe published rock criticism in the early to mid 1990s in the Village Voice, LA Weekly, Artforum, and Spin."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Marlowe


    I think it's pretty clear which source is more respected and reliable.
     

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